On Saturday, August 17, 2013 10:48:38 AM UTC-7, Don Johnstone wrote:
At 14:35 17 August 2013, Papa3 wrote:

I have great pics from sitting in the wave at Mifflin at 10,000 feet (and

c=

limbing) while about half the fleet is still on the grid. It was a bit

of=

a fluke that I and one or two other guys got into it, as the one big

therm=

al that happened to go high enough to get into the wave showed up at just

t=

he right time/place.



So, suppose this was okay in the rules. Two of us have a 6,000 foot

advan=

tage on a 3kt average day, or a 20 minute head start on a 3 hour task.

We'=

ve won the day before the gate ever opens. =20



While I don't subscribe to the idea that everything has to be perfectly

fai=

r, I don't believe that this sort of luck should be so heavily rewarded..



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I think there's a balance between trying to over-engineer fairness and

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-holds-barred. =20



P3

Which is exactly why I suggest that there should be a restriction on the

maximum height before the gate opens. After the gate opens you can climb

to/ start from any height. Don't forget to do away with the start cyclinder

and use a proper D sector with a start line.

Hmmmmm...

I think the main issue is that a high starts adds to the average speed on course (because of the higher ratio of gliding to climbing in your time on course) so if you can start high before a competitor can even have a chance to start, particularly on a day where the weather may be changing (say, OD at the start) you may force the late launchers to take up to a 5 mph speed hit because they have to take a start thousands of feet lower (say 12.5k vs 17.5k). I've seen lots of days where it takes a while to climb up that high and where there is OD or some other weather consideration that makes you want to get out of Dodge.

The reason why we have 15 minutes from last launch to gate open is so that everyone has some reasonable chance to get to MSH before anyone can go out on course to reduce the effect of luck in the outcomes. If you want unlimited height starts than you should extend the time period to allow people to climb. If people are getting 12-14k AGL you'll need nearly an hour.

I think this is totally different from whether you are able as a pilot to find a thermal and climb as well as your peers - that is more skill than luck.

You can, as has been suggested, simply say that position on the grid is part of the game and if you can get up and out on course before the weather moves in and while others are still on the gird, good for you. If this is your philosophy the the there is actually no point in having a start opening time at all - it should be launch and go if you want. If I'm grinding around trying to climb in the rain with competitors out on course in the sun, however, I would probably not like it much and might be inclined to protest under the fair opportunity to compete provisions in the rules.