On Wednesday, April 29, 2015 at 1:42:45 PM UTC-5, Andrzej Kobus wrote:

Kirk, I was lucky enough to receive excellent glider training including aerobatics and flying in clouds (all of it in Europe) and I have no problems with people who want to have good quality AHRS or turn and bank indicator installed in their gliders. Flying gliders in IMC is not easy and having a back up is not going to do any good to anyone without training.

What worries me is that someone suggests using LK8000 as an AHRS device.

Certified solid state AHRS go through comprehensive test scenarios. Modern AHRS is almost all software and as we know software has defects. There is no perfect software. There are just defects that are known and defects that are yet to be discovered.

Some suggestions here are good but some like $100-$200 solid state solution is just not realistic, while the sensors might be cheap a bullet proof software that uses these sensors is not. If I wanted to have a backup I would definitely spend the money on proper solid state AHRS. There are other considerations e.g. icing that can render some AHRS included in glider instruments useless if airspeed indication is lost. With modern slippery gliders flying without ASI due to icing could be all but impossible.

The quote below is from Karl's website. I often think about this quote when flying.

"We do not what we ought;
What we ought not, we do;
And lean upon the thought
That chance will bring us through."
(Matthew Arnold)

I am certainly afraid of people coming out of a cloud through the bottom in an uncontrollable way while I am there just because they ventured into the place they should not have been (as Evan said) encouraged by their great LX8000 AHRS backup.

Please note. LX8000 is great software, but it never was intended to be used as AHRS no even in emergency.

Regards,
AK

AK, I totally agree about a GPS-based solution like LK8000. And also agree that in order to legally (and safely) fly in clouds, a glider needs to be equipped with approved instruments - and the pilot properly trained to use them.

And I also do not intentionally put myself into an IMC situation with my (no-gyro)LS6 because I have a healthy respect for what would happen if I lost a horizon reference!

BUT - If there was an inexpensive "toy" that could possibly save my life, would I get it? Why not? I don't plan on using it (might be fun to play with on a boring VFR day) but if, for some unknown (and probably stupid) reason, I suddenly REALLY NEEDED IT, then it might just save my glider (or even my life). If it doesn't work, I'm no worse off and will probably end up using the chute. But if it does work....

Anyway, at the rate these things are going, something like a Dynon will probably be available at a reasonable cost pretty soon...

Cheers,

Kirk