Ron Rosenfeld wrote:
On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 06:47:09 -0800, Tim wrote:


In most instances, ATC will NOT specify a DP. Executing the DP procedure,
at least for Part 91 flights, is pilot option. There is no requirement to
notify ATC.


SMO lies in critical airspace. There is no way SoCal is going to launch
an IFR departure without very specific instructions.




You've mentioned this a few times.

What are those specific instructions when departing IFR from SMO with the
tower closed?

I don't know. I know the airspace constraints of that location but, as
I said in a previous post, I have not flown IFR out of KSMO.

That was one of the questions the OP posed.

I know. And, he probably would get better information by giving SoCal
TRACON a call.


If the TRACON is issuing radar vectors off the ground, then, as I quoted
from the AIM, that would supersede any ODP. But ATC is then responsible
for obstacle clearance, of course.

Yes, but...there are many worse locations where they vector below the
MVA and do not, in fact, assure any obstacle clearance below MVA. It is
a very obscure area.


It is so critical that a few years ago a Kingair elected to
circle-to-land Runway 3 after the tower was closed and they ended up
with a loss of separation with an air carrier departure out of LAX that
had been turned northwest over the ocean but too close to SMO.


What was the KingAir's clearance?

Don't recall the specifics other than the tower was closed and ATC
bought the "deal," but in the press release the FAA claimed that 3 miles
or 1,000 was merely a guideline.