In article ,
Bug Dout wrote:

Looking more and more like piloting incompetence, by all the flight
crew. The cabin crew did a good job though.

Several friends have taught at the factories that turn out foreign ATPs.

One friend had a foreign student over Puget Sound on a srevere vlear day
and turned off all the nav and asked the student to go to SEATAC. The
student couldn't do it.

Other friends taught at the JAL school in Napa, CA and reported similar
events. They could give a student an engine out at 4000 ft and go
through the procedures. Fail an engine at 2500 and the student goes to
pieces.

There is far too much rote "learning" and not enough airmanship being
delivered.

The result is Asiana and Air France.