If I'm in the air and the window pops open on my Pawnee.. I'm going to keep
flying.. get the glider to a safe altitude and then return. Yes the POH says
not to fly with the window open, keep the speed down.
We know it will fly with the window open.

There have been too many power accidents from pilots forgetting to fly and
worried about an open window or door.. and something worse happens.

BT

"SAM 303a" brentDAHTsullivanATgmailDAHTcom wrote in message
...
Had one of these 6 weeks ago.
Both of us 15-20' off the ground with 1500+ ft of runway ahead and the
window popped open on the Pawnee. He shut down, angled left; I released,
angled a bit right and banged into a thermal that bounced me to about 80',
providing a little short field landing practice.
Here's the stupid part--my hand was on the divebrakes and I was about to
deploy them, but when the ship started rising I took my hand off!
Something in me said "dive brakes aren't used in thermals". I should have
been on the dive brakes immediately and never gotten as high as I did. It
wasn't a big deal, I didn't even use all of the glide slope control my
dear Mosquito offers. I did behave in a way I wouldn't have
predicted--that got my attention.

"Bill Daniels" bildan@comcast-dot-net wrote in message
. ..
What about tow plane aborts on the runway?

I had a tug pilot shut down and brake sharply to a stop right on the
centerline just after I had lifted off. It took some trick flying to
avoid hitting him. I thought this was one in a million until I saw it
happen to another glider pilot only a year later. In my case the tuggie
suddenly decided he didn't want to fly right then. In the other case,
the tuggie left the fuel cap off the Pawnee and gas was streaming onto
the canopy.

Part of the "Emergency" pre-takeoff planning has to be about where to go
if the tug slams on the brakes. I'd think the tuggie should move as far
to the left as possible - even departing the runway to the left during an
abort if that is possible. AFAIK, runway aborts aren't addresed in tow
pilot training.

Bill Daniels


"BT" wrote in message
news:LhAXg.4029$gM1.2379@fed1read12...
Papa3.. I like your third one..

now another... how many instructors pull the rope at about 20-30ft AGL..
just as the climb starts.. and watch the student try to go every which
way but straight ahead and land. Remember the mantra.. below 200ft land
straight ahead.

We have a long 3500ft runway, we stage about 500ft down the runway, the
tow is normally airborn with 1500ft remaining.. we have 600ft of gravel
beyond the paved portion, that is 2100ft to land on from 40ft AGL. I can
pull the rope at 20-40ft at the 1500ft remaining marker.. (cross taxi
way).. a good student will get it down and I'll have to coax him to let
it roll to the end so we can just turn around and tow out the opposite
direction. I've had other students looking for a place to go and I've
had to take over.

Tow pilot may be briefed ahead.. but we have a standing rule.. if the
tow is airborne and feels a release.. the tow keeps going.. do not try
to land... your blocking the runway for the glider.. we also have about
150ft of good landable grading beside the runway, whole length.

BT

"Papa3" wrote in message
ups.com...

BT wrote:
how many instructors coordinate with their tow pilot to give a rudder
wag at
200ft AGL..
and then watch what happens.. after appropriate ground school in a
previous
lesson of course..

and then.. on another lesson day.. coordinates for a wave off at
300ft?
and a good tow pilot might reduce power with the wave off or maybe
start a
gradual descent?

so many times.. I've had the tow pilot pull a close in down wind
turn..
briefed of course.. never get above 500ft AGL and then start the wave
off..
the student or rated pilot on a flight review does not realize that
the
pattern IS NOT NORMAL... what's going on.. and then... ohh.. he wants
me to
get off.. and then takes his sweet time doing it.. granted.. if all
appears
well.. make sure you are in a safe place to get off tow.. but if
things did
not look normal before.. that should have been the earlier clue to be
ready
for something.

BT

BT,

I couldn't agree with you more - many instructors let students get all
the way to their rating without the above sorts of "dirty tricks".
This is unacceptable.

Three that I always do:

- Towpilot begins to slowly throttle back (simulating loss of power
due to any number of reasons) at a pre-arranged altitude of about
500-700 AGL without a waveoff. In real-life, this is exactly what
might happen in the event of a non-catastrophic towplane problem while
the towpilot tries to figure out "what the ***". What does the
student do? Most will watch as the inevitable slack line develops and
we begin to transition from positive rate of climb to descent. About
20% figure out something is wrong and release while they still have
time to make a reasonable pattern and landing. When towpilot
finally gives the wave off MOST of the remainder are already on a high
enough alert level that they release immediately. A few freeze.

- Towpilot gives the rudder waggle at altitude (always above a safe
glide to the airport). Most do the right thing. A few either a)
release or b) ask me "what's he doing."

- This last one is "fun", though it isn't really a tow signal per se.
I admit that it's a hassle, but it can be a great learning tool. I
will have the towpilot plan on a particularly slow acceleration and a
marginal liftoff well down the field. All the while, I'll be asking
the student "does this feel right"? I will then pull the release (if
student hasn't already) and land straight ahead. The discussion that
ensues is along the lines of : a) Hey, it's your neck on the line.
b) Don't trust the towpilot blindly - maybe he's got a problem and has
forgotten about you. c) The trees at the end of the runway won't care
whose fault it was when you impact them 20 feet below the tops.
Caution: This requires careful coordination and briefing with the
towpilot, an ample length of remaining runway, coordination with other
traffic, etc. etc. I'll admit that not every student of mine has been
through this, though we do have the discussion.

Anyway, I think a lot of people get through training without these and
other dirty tricks, and it's a shame.

Erik Mann
LS8-18 (P3)