(B2431) wrote in message ...
Compared to V-22 Osprey
From: (robert arndt)
Date: 12/1/2003 8:26 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I have had my fill of Nazi "wonder weapons" and secrets still kept.

But the DoD, USAF, CIA, etc... have not. German weapon systems from
1945 are still classified and there is much evidence that links the
Third Reich's radical aircraft projects to US postwar projects
culminating in the black projects operating today. Therefore that
information is kept classified, restricted, compartmentalized.

None of which you can prove.

Where do you think Jim Wilson of "Popular Mechanics" got his
information from? He obtained both USAF and DoD documents through the
Freedom of Information Act and only after there was a congressional
mandate to declassify some of the older records. The German disc
aircraft and the German engineers that worked on them are firmly
placed here in the US working on similar projects in 1946. You can't
dispute that at all, its documented. The USAF admitted these designs
in the late 1990s but did not furnish any photos, timelines, flight
footage, or the disposition of the aircraft after experimenting with
them and/or replicating them. Doesn't that bother you at all? Why
admit these things and not release ALL of the documentation on them?
Why restrict the rest of the material until 2020- the LONGEST time
period they can legally classify that material?

Just like the Nazis most of the wackier ideas never got beyond the proposal
stage.

True, but the US relationship with the UK allowed much of Allied
technology to be shared. Japan's advanced weapons programs were
negligible except for the question of the Japanese atomic bomb
program, which also remains a mystery. The U.S.S.R. OTOH was seen as
an enemy and there was considerable amount of spying done postwar to
learn what the Russians had captured from the Germans and what the
Germans were developing for them. History shows that Russia's military
and space programs benefitted nicely from German technology.
In regards to disc aircraft, the US percieved threat was real.
Everything from the Ghost Rockets of '46 forward was seen as an
attempt by the Russians to develop this type of craft. However, the
U.S.S.R. followed a strict quantity over quality development program
that set their aircraft industry back significantly. One can only look
at their X-planes of the time to see that the technical ability was
there but that Stalin and subsequent Soviet leaders prohibited
advanced, costly aircraft to be developed... no matter what threat
from the US emerged.

snip

You snip because you have nothing to say about the strange phenomenon
that started in the Baltic (Soviet occupied Peenemunde) in 1946
followed by all the subsequent disc activity that started up the
summer of '47 and which has never abated. It is obvious from what
documents we have and the knowledge of the AVRO disc programs that the
US, UK, and Canada all had disc programs immediately after the war and
that the US suspected the Soviets of the same technology. Yet you have
nothing to say and disregard everyone's programs as fantasy... even
though we now know about Silverbug, Northrop NS-97, the nuclear LRV,
etc...
what's the matter with you? Can't face reality?

Same thing for the Thule Triebwerke except that this technology was
passed over to the US that conducted its own experiments and made
breakthroughs that eventually were moved from Wright Field, to
Edwards, to Area 51.

Why, of COURSE they did, how convienient.

So the Triebwerke's Coler Konverter/Shumann Levitator/heated spinning
mercury sphere operation is far-fetched? The TR-3b ASTRA black
triangle uses a similar approach. It uses a nuclear source instead of
Coler's free energy machine (which was connected to a generator). In
place of the Schumann Levitators it uses three advanced manouvering
rockets. And, like the Triebwerke, utilizes heated spinning mercury to
affect gravity... only the TR-3b uses an accelerator ring to
accomplish that.
If you read the ancient Indian texts of their Vimana flying craft you
will read that it too used mercury to fly. Same concept over thousands
of years. Not impossible just not understood very well.

snip more blind idolization of the Super Swine

No idolization here just commenting on the SS Technical Branch
programs.

the most sensitive documentation (which most likely includes photos,
timelines, and flight performances) remain heavily classified.

And you alone know all about this?

A lot of people know about this and have tried in vain through the
Freedom of Information Act to force the Govt. to explain what strange
aerial phenomenon we have been experiencing since 1946. A big part of
that is covert military aircraft, the exotics originating from Nazi
Germany. You hate to hear that but it is the truth. Funny how you
accept German engineering in missile tech, jet and rocket aircraft,
and space tech... but not with more advanced projects.

I'm just hoping that I live long enough for this material to see the light of
day again.

Rob

Ah yes, the Fourth Reich and you will be yelling "seig heil" louder than the
next guy?

Hardly since being a historical realist and aviation fan does not make
me a fascist.

I am not saying there was no Nazi tecnology more advanced than the Allies, but
the SS never produced any super weapons other than the V-2. And that was
designed by an non SS Nazi team. BTW, von Braun didn't invent the liquid fuel
rocket engine or rocket flight. Darn the luck, if your beloved SS had predated
Goddard maybe they would have.

I never stated otherwise. The SS Technical Branch was TASKED with
improving existing technology AND inventing new technology that would
stop the daily bombing of Germany. Since that affected transportation
too the SS were developing alternative fuels and power generators. The
SS did invent generators that ran off coal and grain alcohol and used
them in their facilities. I'm sure you've seen photos of the coal
engined Kubelwagen and powered searchlights. Other areas were
prefabrication methods, production dispersal, etc... also employed in
late '44-45. But secret weapons were also their mission. They started
early in the war by taking over the German Army's dangerous N-material
production and storage (which has only recently been identified as
CF3). This material was too dangerous to handle in combat and store so
it was destroyed. The SS was also heavily involved in gas research and
sadly tested out new agents on slave laborers from the camps. One gas
captured by the US Third Army was an experimental brown crystalline
desiccator designed to completely dehydrate a person alive. After the
July 1944 bomb plot, the SS was given control over the V-weapons
program and all jet projects. The confusion over the disc aircraft
arises from the fact that those programs predate 1944 and are not in
any connected with the RLM. Himmler was a Thule member and the SS
Technical Branch worked with both the Thule and Vril Societies in
creating occult disc machines based on information obtained by the
mediums Maria Orsitsch and Sigrun through channeling. At Himmler's
castle occult practices took place by the SS Black Sun- their
religious Order that held beliefs exactly the same as the Thule and
Vril Societies. Himmler, therefore, had a fascination with these
occult machines and their mysterious power source. A special
development unit E-4 was created within the Technical Branch to
specifically develop the discs. The work of Coler, Schumann,
Schauberger, and others from Thule and Vril were utilized by the SS
(along with the millions of patents stolen from the occupied
countries) to create these machines.
I know you just want a clear, non-occult picture of these machines but
you cannot seperate the occult from the Third Reich. The NSDAP itself
came from the Thule Society and the Nazi leadership were Thule
members. The NSDAP produced Hitler and Hitler the SS in all its forms.
You keep mentioning the general SS. There was also the Waffen SS, SD,
the Black Sun Order, the DHvSS, the Archeological Branch, and
Technical Branch.
Speer's book attempts to penetrate the entire SS and that is all I
pointed out.

While you are drooling over the SS and their pretty uniforms ask yourself how
many human beings were killed in their experiments and slave labour camps. Then
compare the human suffering vs actual product.

Not necessary at all. Totally uncalled for. It would be great if the
SS weren't involved at all. If Heinkel, Messerschmitt, or Focke Wulf
were tasked with disc development this entire subject wouldn't be
controversial at all.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

Rob