gatt wrote:


I take that to mean "by the time you land," but, that doesn't take into
consideration departure stalls,

Speaking of departure stalls while heavy...

This was a friend of mine, based here in CT:
http://www.ntsb.gov/NTSB/brief.asp?ev_id=20010806X01608&key=1
We lost him and five of his relatives.

This is fresh in my mind from last year:
http://www.ntsb.gov/NTSB/brief.asp?ev_id=20070917X01402&key=1
Along with four adult males, this plane had golf bags aboard, headed to
Cape Cod.