In message , Bob Officer wrote:
On Fri, 23 Jan 2009 10:11:06 -0600, in alt.usenet.kooks, §ñühw¤£f
wrote:

Bob Officer pinched out a steaming pile
:

On Thu, 22 Jan 2009 09:49:33 -0600, in alt.usenet.kooks, §ñühw¤£f
wrote:

Bob Officer pinched out a steaming pile
:

On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:36:12 -0700, in alt.usenet.kooks, §ñühw¤£f
wrote:

In message , Bob
Officer
wrote:
On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 09:31:50 -0600, in alt.usenet.kooks,
§ñühw¤£f
wrote:

Bob Officer pinched out a steaming pile
:

On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:31:29 -0600, in alt.usenet.kooks,
§ñühw¤£f
wrote:

Bob Officer pinched out a steaming pile
:

On Mon, 19 Jan 2009 18:20:16 +0000 (UTC), in
alt.usenet.kooks,
Bertie
the Bunyip wrote:

§ñühw¤£f wrote in news:t96dnQfJw-
:

Bertie the Bunyip pinched out a
steaming
pile
:

"Scott M. Kozel" wrote in
news:gkvte8$eth$1
:

§ñühw¤£f wrote:

I propose a technological solution to the problem of
bird
strikes:
turboprops.
Lets return to the good old days pre-jet engines.

Well ... while the L-188 Lockheed Electra example is a
turboprop,
the
above poster apparently didn't realize that a turboprop
engine
has a
jet
engine.

Discuss.

The large piston engines were incredibly complex, and
generally
could
drive airliners at only about half the speed of those
with
the
pure
jet
engines.


yes, but they were so much more fun


Bertie

Ok ok...totally *genius* idea: dirigibles.

Excellent. I'll sign on for a course.


Yeah, think on that for a while.

Its either that or the locomotive, chaps.

Only if it's a real one. i.e. Steam

No! Hell no!

And what pray tell is wrong with steam?

Steam locomotives? Everything.

Well man spit it out! Lets not play guessing games here!

Have you ever been on a working steam locomotive?

Not while its running.

I have.

Didja get to be the shovelman?

No the engine had a working feed system. I do believe when Dad Fired
steam on the L&N they had "stokers" that hand fed the coal if the
feed broke or didn't work.

Originally an operating crew would be the engineer, firemen, and if
they had cars, a conductor and brakemen for every x numbers of cars
on the territory. Stokers were not really members of "the crew", but
worked under the direction of the Locomotive Firemen. The Engineer
operated the locomotive and was responsible for the trains safe
operation. The Conductor was in charge of cars and the contents,
there of and the assignment and positioning of his brake men. The
brakes on the train were set (by hand) at the direction of the
engineer. (all those whistle signals.)

Then the airbrakes came about, the need for multiple brakemen for x
number of cars.

Yeah..."improvements" to the system cut manpower. now all you have is
one or two people per train trying to stay awake.
So much for "progress".

You don't know the half of it...

The roundhouse up in essex was taken down and people lost jobs.
Every time theres some manpower saving device, people loose jobs.
Eventually we'll all sit at home or whatever and the robots will
do everything.


They are very dirty (producing soot and ash. Very noisy. (usually
about 90-105 dB. They get louder under full power)

Yeap. Coal fired mostly.

One coal and everything else was oil.

Leave us not forget *wood*...it was plentiful once across the
country.

Most all locomotive engineers from the steam era were deaf. and
suffered breathing problems.

My granpa was one

So was mine, and so was my Dad.

Go Union!

However That wasn't how it worked. Grandad worked the Rock Island St
Louis to Sikeston he retired at 65 with something like 50 years of
service. Pop worked for the L&N @ Cleveland, Tn. Then he came west
during WW2. He went to work for the SP and retired with 45+ years of
combined service. There was 20 months of military service, and he was
discharged because of heart murmur.


Still...back in the day...those *were* good jobs.
At least you had some security.
Downsizing wasn't the norm. Now, its "oh ****, the passenger load has
dropped off by 5%, lets fire a bunch of people and cut service".

up until about 1990 there was a seasonal flow. As the business would
ebb people in operating crafts would be cut off/layed off. Then
called back in senority order. Some would stick around and others
would find work eslewhere and wouldn't come back. Around here lots of
kids put themselves through college working all summer for the RR and
then getting cut off right up until the xmas rush. Then they would be
cutoff until the summer. here is even an area where they kids would
work only the weekends getting cut off every monday morning and
called back every friday night.

Part timers get no bennies, sure.

It would generally take a person 5-7 years before they could work
year round. 10-12 before they could work regular jobs on a temporay
basis. and 20 plus to hold any sort of regular job on a year round
basis.

Railroad reschedual work on a need be basis (within the scope of the
union contracts) so their is a big degree of non-control. They are
subject tot he demands and needs of the shippers.

Floriduh just gave CSX a big huge contract.


Deaf as hell but no breathing problems...he didnt know who the ****
I
was
later since he was all alzheimersy & stuff.

My dad died from lung cancer (both Small Cell Carcinoma and
Metastasized melanoma.

Bummer...the smoke was it?

Asbestos and/or smoke.

Me-so-thee-lee-oh-ma.
nods

You got it.

Well I hope not

Most all locomotive engineers from the diesel era still suffer
hearing loss. Most all operating employees for railroads with
more
than 10 years of service have some hearing loss. About ten years
ago
the railroads started losing lawsuits over hearing losses and
started
a hearing conservation program. Too bad it was 27 years too late.

YEah...back in the day it was a macho job and you didnt **** & moan
about the conditions.

The ****ed and moaned even then. I've listen to those guys all my
life.

no...they laughed at management...but as for crying about the
conditions?

Yep the ****ed and moaned about that too.

Well yer fambly wasn't "stoic" then.

all to often the conditions were what you could make them. the
trouble is most of the people were content to work in substandard
conditions.

After the union busting in Bisbee Arizona in 1910 or so...sure...beats getting
put on box cars, taken into the desert, and shot by thugs.

No real railroader would complain "its too tough".

Being gone most of the time? Missing their families? If it wasn't for
the "good money", they would have left.

My grandpa was lucky then. He worked one line and was home often
enough...GNRY.

Dad was gone from home about 60% of the nights. The road work had a
layover at the away from home point. It was almost like a second home
for him.

Did he have a second wife?


Today the railroad has cut
its pay for new hires to 30%. Wages have effectively dropped since
1985 to about 65% of what they were compared to pre-1985. The
employees with seniority (like me) have made up for this by just
working trips. I now work 25 days a month compared to the 18-19 days
I worked before 1985. The cry was a demand for more productivity. the
Grace commission of Ronnie agreed. The funny thing is while
productivity went up wages decreased. The number of working employees
decreased and got the average age increased. this increased the
health care costs and over the next 4 contracts the carriers cried
about the increases to health care cost. (the fact the employees
health care increases because of increase of work stress also was
ignored.)

I ****ing hated Reagan.
His passing made me smile

The only thing was he never felt the pain he caused. The idiot would
cut firewood for fun. did he realize his actions created a group of
people that were cutting firewood just to feed their families.

He lived in a lovely 1950's family show that played in his head.
The world to him was just one big Leave It to Beaver episode.


Biggest complaints from crews which still use those 1st and 2nd
generation locomotives, noise and exhaust fumes in the cab.

Ever seen a track weasel?

I seen just about everything. including the look on a kids face just
after he finally looked up and saw the locomotive, just before it
hit
him.

Ugh. Musta been a deaf kid.

Nope, listening to his ipod at full volume.

Holy shnikeies!!!

I just said "****!"

Sad.

When the conductor and brakemen went back to look, then found his
Ipod laying near the impact sight, still playing at full volume.
He was listening to some sort of Rap.

ZOMGZ! I *knew* it! "Rap kills".

That's a valid assumption.

It was the train that killed him, it was the Rap!

Ipods are dangerous and should be banned.
nods


--
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of freedom of the people
by gradual and silent encroachments by those in power than by violent and
sudden usurpations.... The means of defense against foreign danger historically
have become the instruments of tyranny at home."
-James Madison