Ben,
OK..I guess I need to throw in my 2 cents...I currently own a LAK-17B FES. I owned a Discus 2b and I also owned a 304CZ....

First, I do not believe you will go wrong with any of these three excellent ships. My take IMHO:

1. I've owned four ships without flaps and two ships with flaps and to be honest, I will never own another glider without them...With that said I would lean toward the LAK-17B FES and HPH304eS or the new Ventus that will be flapped and have the FES as an option.

2. If delivery lead time is an issue then the LAK-17B FES and HPH 304eS are probably the way to go as the Ventus lead time is quite lengthy.

3. I wrote an article in the March 2013 issue of Soaring on the LAK-17B FES, so you may want to read it for more background info. It's a great ship that I have truly enjoyed for 4 seasons flying in New Mexico.

4. HPH also makes wonderful gliders and I really enjoyed the great quality and handling of my 304CZ. You may want to contact a 304S owner to get their handling impressions.

Again, whichever ship you choose I am sure you will be very pleased...and you will definitely love the FES!

Good luck - Renny




On Tuesday, December 8, 2015 at 3:36:06 PM UTC-7, wrote:
I'm considering the purchase of an 18m FES equipped sailplane, and would like to hear thoughts and opinions about the various options available. I'm seeking a cross country machine with long legs and a highly reliable sustainer. An 18m FES sailplane should fit that requirement nicely.

I'm a somewhat green pilot, but in the year or so before a new glider could be manufactured and delivered, I will have accumulated some more experience in my club's DG-505 and DG-1000. I have eliminated the Ventus 2cx as a possibility, due to the aircraft's reputation as being unsuitable for low-time pilots. In the 18m class, that leaves the following gliders that are available with a FES system:

- Discus 2c
- Lak-17B
- HpH 304S Shark

All three appear to have similar performance, as best I can tell from published data. I don't plan to be racing any time soon, so a difference of a few points in best glide ratio is not significant to me.

According to the flight reports that I've read, all three feature docile handling that should not be a problem for a low-time pilot. The Lak-17B and HpH Shark have flaps. I have thoroughly researched the apparently controversial issue of whether flapped ships are suitable for low-time pilots, and am convinced that they are more of an asset than a liability.

In the interests of staying on topic, let's not make this thread about flaps or the FES. These topics have already been thoroughly discussed on RAS. Please start a new thread or add to an old thread if you wish to discuss further.

I'll list some of the pros and cons of each ship that I can see, but would love to hear if anyone disagrees with them, or has anything to add.

Discus 2c
- Pros: Reputation for excellent handling. Optional GRS. Possibly higher resale value and ease of selling due to its popularity.
- Cons: No flaps.

Lak-17B
- Pros: Lower cost (better value) than the other two. Half the lead time of the other two (6 vs 12 mo).
- Cons: No safety cockpit.

HpH Shark
- Pros: Good looking (purely my opinion).
- Cons: Every flight review I've read says it handles well but... every reviewer had at least one negative thing to say about the handling. Hard to draw conclusions, but some doubt as been cast in my mind.

By now it may be clear which one I'm leaning toward. However, I wouldn't have posted this if my mind wasn't open to others' opinions, so I welcome and appreciate your thoughts. In the end, the decision will come down to what's most important to me: safety and handling. I guess what I'm really seeking is a double-check on my thinking regarding this rather significant purchase.

Cheers,
Ben