NK Vario

Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

On Sep 12, 5:43*pm, brianDG303 wrote:
Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

I've heard unconfirmed rumors it is going to beep.

We are passing the point that not talking about features is harming
the NK story. Is it or is it not a real product? They have no current
vario product line to harm so some details and realistic schedule
setting cannot hurt.

Darryl

I can confidently state that a spec, adverts and prices for the N-K vario
range will appear well before the next SSA convention.

I'm sure the usual commercial outlets will be pushing pilots towards
their websites as soon as they can reveal something.

Peter

At 04:11 13 September 2010, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:43=A0pm, brianDG303 wrote:
Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

I've heard unconfirmed rumors it is going to beep.

We are passing the point that not talking about features is harming
the NK story. Is it or is it not a real product? They have no current
vario product line to harm so some details and realistic schedule
setting cannot hurt.

Darryl

Hi,

I heard from NK last week that they hope to be selling the vario in several
(3 to 4 months) and flight testing it in 4 to 6 weeks. I imagine there will
be a beta test period, but NK has not mentioned that.

I don't know many details about it yet. My understanding is that it will be
a speed-to-fly variometer with audio and averager and will communicate with
the ClearNav over the high-speed CANbus network. It will not include a GPS
or logger.

I can't wait to fly with one.

Best Regards,

Paul Remde

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message
...
On Sep 12, 5:43 pm, brianDG303 wrote:
Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

I've heard unconfirmed rumors it is going to beep.

We are passing the point that not talking about features is harming
the NK story. Is it or is it not a real product? They have no current
vario product line to harm so some details and realistic schedule
setting cannot hurt.

Darryl

On Sep 13, 7:30*am, Darryl Ramm wrote:
Well if the vario does not include a GPS and IGC flight recorder at
least as as an option that's likely the end of any interest for many
potential purchasers who are looking for a C302 replacement.

I know the NK CLearNav includes a GPS and flight recorder, if they
just want to sell varios to people who already own a ClearNav that a
fine, but a market limiting plan. I know they have been working with a
few people for product feedback but again with no market to damage
they could be getting very wide feedback from discussing specs more
openly.

So the next obvious question is is there a GPS option so the vario can
pass out enhanced NMEA data with wind and other data for PDA and other
flight computer users?

I'd also hope that a really new generation vario/flight computer would
be capable of pulling together air data etc. and logging that to the
IGC file for post-flight wind construction and other analysis.

Darryl

On Sep 13, 4:58*am, "Paul Remde" wrote:

Hi,

I heard from NK last week that they hope to be selling the vario in several
(3 to 4 months) and flight testing it in 4 to 6 weeks. *I imagine there will
be a beta test period, but NK has not mentioned that.

I don't know many details about it yet. *My understanding is that it will be
a speed-to-fly variometer with audio and averager and will communicate with
the ClearNav over the high-speed CANbus network. *It will not include a GPS
or logger.

I can't wait to fly with one.

Best Regards,

Paul Remde

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message

....
On Sep 12, 5:43 pm, brianDG303 wrote:

Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

I've heard unconfirmed rumors it is going to beep.

We are passing the point that not talking about features is harming
the NK story. Is it or is it not a real product? They have no current
vario product line to harm so some details and realistic schedule
setting cannot hurt.

Darryl

Darryl,
that is my feeling exactly, with that limited feature set I'll hope to
run GPS from Powerflarm and keep my B40, while waiting for a much
better vario option. Which might be more like the Tasman V2000
Variometer with FP10 Flight Pack than the described NK vario.

Brian

On Sep 13, 9:10*am, brianDG303 wrote:
On Sep 13, 7:30*am, Darryl Ramm wrote:



Well if the vario does not include a GPS and IGC flight recorder at
least as as an option that's likely the end of any interest for many
potential purchasers who are looking for a C302 replacement.

I know the NK CLearNav includes a GPS and flight recorder, if they
just want to sell varios to people who already own a ClearNav that a
fine, but a market limiting plan. I know they have been working with a
few people for product feedback but again with no market to damage
they could be getting very wide feedback from discussing specs more
openly.

So the next obvious question is is there a GPS option so the vario can
pass out enhanced NMEA data with wind and other data for PDA and other
flight computer users?

I'd also hope that a really new generation vario/flight computer would
be capable of pulling together air data etc. and logging that to the
IGC file for post-flight wind construction and other analysis.

Darryl

On Sep 13, 4:58*am, "Paul Remde" wrote:

Hi,

I heard from NK last week that they hope to be selling the vario in several
(3 to 4 months) and flight testing it in 4 to 6 weeks. *I imagine there will
be a beta test period, but NK has not mentioned that.

I don't know many details about it yet. *My understanding is that it will be
a speed-to-fly variometer with audio and averager and will communicate with
the ClearNav over the high-speed CANbus network. *It will not include a GPS
or logger.

I can't wait to fly with one.

Best Regards,

Paul Remde

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message

....
On Sep 12, 5:43 pm, brianDG303 wrote:

Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

I've heard unconfirmed rumors it is going to beep.

We are passing the point that not talking about features is harming
the NK story. Is it or is it not a real product? They have no current
vario product line to harm so some details and realistic schedule
setting cannot hurt.

Darryl

Darryl,
that is my feeling exactly, with that limited feature set I'll hope to
run GPS from Powerflarm and keep my B40, while waiting for a much
better vario option. Which might be more like the Tasman V2000
Variometer with FP10 Flight Pack than the described NK vario.

Brian

If it was me I'd also look at doing every possible thing to make this
a future proof central data hub of the glider panel - including a
Flarm input that can take the Flarm NMEA out with traffic data and
merge in with the vario provided air-data (like the K6 MUX can do).
And I'd have an on-board NMEA bluetooth option as well as RS-232 out.
Maybe a headless versions with no vario display for limited panel
space/use of a PDA or computer display for the vario. All that may be
too much to implement in a first gen product but much of it is
firmware so I'd be building int the capability to add that firmware
over time (for a fee). Basically what I would like is a vario/air-
data/GPS/logger central data-hub on/behind the panel that is a modern
open/flexible version of essentially what a C302 is today. Oh and make
it emulate the C302 dataport commands for existing 3rd party software
compatibility. A version without an internal GPS might be an option,
but Cambridge tried that with the 301 vario and I suspect had problems
justifying the cost/margins (or was there really no demand?).

Of course it's easy to build something on paper...

Darryl

On Sep 13, 6:32*pm, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On Sep 13, 9:10*am, brianDG303 wrote:





On Sep 13, 7:30*am, Darryl Ramm wrote:

Well if the vario does not include a GPS and IGC flight recorder at
least as as an option that's likely the end of any interest for many
potential purchasers who are looking for a C302 replacement.

I know the NK CLearNav includes a GPS and flight recorder, if they
just want to sell varios to people who already own a ClearNav that a
fine, but a market limiting plan. I know they have been working with a
few people for product feedback but again with no market to damage
they could be getting very wide feedback from discussing specs more
openly.

So the next obvious question is is there a GPS option so the vario can
pass out enhanced NMEA data with wind and other data for PDA and other
flight computer users?

I'd also hope that a really new generation vario/flight computer would
be capable of pulling together air data etc. and logging that to the
IGC file for post-flight wind construction and other analysis.

Darryl

On Sep 13, 4:58*am, "Paul Remde" wrote:

Hi,

I heard from NK last week that they hope to be selling the vario in several
(3 to 4 months) and flight testing it in 4 to 6 weeks. *I imagine there will
be a beta test period, but NK has not mentioned that.

I don't know many details about it yet. *My understanding is that it will be
a speed-to-fly variometer with audio and averager and will communicate with
the ClearNav over the high-speed CANbus network. *It will not include a GPS
or logger.

I can't wait to fly with one.

Best Regards,

Paul Remde

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message

...
On Sep 12, 5:43 pm, brianDG303 wrote:

Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

I've heard unconfirmed rumors it is going to beep.

We are passing the point that not talking about features is harming
the NK story. Is it or is it not a real product? They have no current
vario product line to harm so some details and realistic schedule
setting cannot hurt.

Darryl

Darryl,
that is my feeling exactly, with that limited feature set I'll hope to
run GPS from Powerflarm and keep my B40, while waiting for a much
better vario option. Which might be more like the Tasman V2000
Variometer with FP10 Flight Pack than the described NK vario.

Brian

If it was me I'd also look at doing every possible thing to make this
a future proof central data hub of the glider panel - including a
Flarm input that can take the Flarm NMEA out with traffic data and
merge in with the vario provided air-data (like the K6 MUX can do).
And I'd have an on-board NMEA bluetooth option as well as RS-232 out.
Maybe a headless versions with no vario display for limited panel
space/use of a PDA or computer display for the vario. All that may be
too much to implement in a first gen product but much of it is
firmware so I'd be building int the capability to add that firmware
over time (for a fee). *Basically what I would like is a vario/air-
data/GPS/logger central data-hub on/behind the panel that is a modern
open/flexible version of essentially what a C302 is today. Oh and make
it emulate the C302 dataport commands for existing 3rd party software
compatibility. A version without an internal GPS might be an option,
but Cambridge tried that with the 301 vario and I suspect had problems
justifying the cost/margins (or was there really no demand?).

Of course it's easy to build something on paper...

Darryl- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

The new LX Navigation Varios & MiniMap meet many of your paper vario
specifications

The LX166 will accept any NMEA input including flarm and PowerFlarm,
and output to about any display device including the Ultimate, PDA
etc, LX mini Map.

The LX1606 is very similar. Both vario displays have a stepper motor
vario needle and a color LCD for other information.


www.lxnavigation.si


Richard
www.craggyaero.com

On Sep 13, 9:28*am, John Cochrane
wrote:
On Sep 13, 9:30*am, Darryl Ramm wrote: Well if the vario does not include a GPS and IGC flight recorder at
least as as an option that's likely the end of any interest for many
potential purchasers who are looking for a C302 replacement.

*I disagree (and I admit to badgering the NK team to produce a great
standalone speed to fly vario).
-If you have/want to buy a clearnav, then NK vario + clearnav is your
total solution. You can add a cheap backup logger or a flarm.
-If you have a clearnav + 302, then the 302 becomes your backup vario
and logger.
-If your'e too cheap to buy a clearnav, you buy a cheap GPS + PDA for
a few hundred bucks to navigate.
-If you have some other system, sell your mechanical backup vario, put
in a real speed to fly with audio.
-If you're a club with no GPS, you finally have speed to fly in the
club gliders, so students in the ASK21 have some idea of how fast they
should fly through sink to get home, and can learn proper instruments
while the instructor is in back.
(No, I'm not a salesman for NK, and have no inside information as to
what they're producing)
John Cochrane

And if you are like many people today and have a PDA and want NEMA out
TAS airspeed data for wind? And an IGC flight recorder?

I think the ClearNav does what it does pretty well, specially for
people who cant' seem to get their PDAs sorted out or who just cannot
read the screens (which gives them an interesting older demographic?).
I am not sure it is really about being "too cheap to buy a ClearNav".
Although I am sure the cost is a factor for many people. And the cost
may also be more of an issue for some folks because they investing
thousands of dollars in screen technology that risks being outpaced by
other consumer technology..

For me the screen is just plain too large for my cockpit and (as a
fussy software developer/marketing wonk) I personally really dislike
the user interface. It does have some nice features, some of which I
expect will be copied/improved on by the PDA crowd. If I was NK I'd be
looking at the vario as the central point of acquiring new customers
and work to upsell them on the the ClearNav, not the other way around.

I hope NK is not building a closed proprietary system and thinks
ignoring the PDA/PNA market is a good idea. I expect there will be
significant innovation on Android and other platforms and they'll be
cut off from being the back-end data-provider box for that. I was/am
hoping for more, a lot more, given the talent and pedigree of the
developers involved. (and I'm not just looking for a C302 clone, there
is a lot more that could be done with a modern platform and decent
firmware). Maybe time to buy a hot-spare C302...

Nicer transition and XC club ships should have a flight computer like
a C302 with IGC flight recorder and be encouraging its use for badges
etc. And teach the students how to use a STF etc. So I've often felt
that is a worthwhile investment. Lower-end ones, yes a stand alone
electronic vario makes sense. As would something like a stand-alone
vario and a PowerFLARM for the flight recorder.

Darryl

How about NK buy out Cambridge and actually upgrade the 302? The 302
platform is very capable but the software has not been updated and
never will be by Cambridge. In fact where is the 306 or upgraded unit
from CAI? I do not see this happening as well. I like my 302 alot but
it could be better if the software was version 7 rather than 2.X.

In all you have to admire the folks who put the risk capital into an
increasingly competitive and rapidly changing tecnical product in a
relatively small market. My hats off to them!

John Seaborn

On Sep 13, 9:48*am, Richard wrote:
On Sep 13, 6:32*pm, Darryl Ramm wrote:



On Sep 13, 9:10*am, brianDG303 wrote:

On Sep 13, 7:30*am, Darryl Ramm wrote:

Well if the vario does not include a GPS and IGC flight recorder at
least as as an option that's likely the end of any interest for many
potential purchasers who are looking for a C302 replacement.

I know the NK CLearNav includes a GPS and flight recorder, if they
just want to sell varios to people who already own a ClearNav that a
fine, but a market limiting plan. I know they have been working with a
few people for product feedback but again with no market to damage
they could be getting very wide feedback from discussing specs more
openly.

So the next obvious question is is there a GPS option so the vario can
pass out enhanced NMEA data with wind and other data for PDA and other
flight computer users?

I'd also hope that a really new generation vario/flight computer would
be capable of pulling together air data etc. and logging that to the
IGC file for post-flight wind construction and other analysis.

Darryl

On Sep 13, 4:58*am, "Paul Remde" wrote:

Hi,

I heard from NK last week that they hope to be selling the vario in several
(3 to 4 months) and flight testing it in 4 to 6 weeks. *I imagine there will
be a beta test period, but NK has not mentioned that.

I don't know many details about it yet. *My understanding is that it will be
a speed-to-fly variometer with audio and averager and will communicate with
the ClearNav over the high-speed CANbus network. *It will not include a GPS
or logger.

I can't wait to fly with one.

Best Regards,

Paul Remde

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message

...
On Sep 12, 5:43 pm, brianDG303 wrote:

Does anyone have a clue as to the features of the NK vario? I even
looked on wikileaks- nothing.

I've heard unconfirmed rumors it is going to beep.

We are passing the point that not talking about features is harming
the NK story. Is it or is it not a real product? They have no current
vario product line to harm so some details and realistic schedule
setting cannot hurt.

Darryl

Darryl,
that is my feeling exactly, with that limited feature set I'll hope to
run GPS from Powerflarm and keep my B40, while waiting for a much
better vario option. Which might be more like the Tasman V2000
Variometer with FP10 Flight Pack than the described NK vario.

Brian

If it was me I'd also look at doing every possible thing to make this
a future proof central data hub of the glider panel - including a
Flarm input that can take the Flarm NMEA out with traffic data and
merge in with the vario provided air-data (like the K6 MUX can do).
And I'd have an on-board NMEA bluetooth option as well as RS-232 out.
Maybe a headless versions with no vario display for limited panel
space/use of a PDA or computer display for the vario. All that may be
too much to implement in a first gen product but much of it is
firmware so I'd be building int the capability to add that firmware
over time (for a fee). *Basically what I would like is a vario/air-
data/GPS/logger central data-hub on/behind the panel that is a modern
open/flexible version of essentially what a C302 is today. Oh and make
it emulate the C302 dataport commands for existing 3rd party software
compatibility. A version without an internal GPS might be an option,
but Cambridge tried that with the 301 vario and I suspect had problems
justifying the cost/margins (or was there really no demand?).

Of course it's easy to build something on paper...

Darryl- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

The new LX Navigation Varios & MiniMap meet many of your paper vario
specifications

The LX166 will accept any NMEA input including flarm and PowerFlarm,
and output to about any display device including the Ultimate, PDA
etc, LX mini Map.

The LX1606 is very similar. *Both vario displays have a stepper motor
vario needle and a color LCD for other information.

www.lxnavigation.si

Richardwww.craggyaero.com

Richard

I don't want a minimap. Absolutely zero interest in that. I want to
use my PDA/PNA for that and in future I suspect an Android device.

Gotta remember the http:// part for google Groups compatibility, so
here it is again

http://www.lxnavigation.si/avionics/

It looks really interesting and on the right track, I see it has a GPS
does it pass enhanced NMEA data like TAS out to a PDA over RS-232 or
bluetooth? I don't know what the LX data buss is but I have no
interest in using that unless it gets me easily to RS-232 and/or
bluetooth. What about an IGC flight recorder capability?

Thanks


Darryl