lease back financing 5, 10, 20 years

Calling all owners that leaseback a plane to a club or FBO or ??

I have found that financers offer different loans depending on
the who uses the plane. For a club they want 10 years or less
but for private they will finance up to 20 years. Maybe I just need
to keep looking. I don't quite undertand why they would care as
long as they get paid.

So if you are leasing a plane back what kinds of loans were you
able to get?


The 20 year loans are ideal for so many reasons.

R. Hubbell

I got 20 from MBNA on a new plane. They do did ask if you plan to use a
leaseback.

The reason they are asking is that when Cessna unloaded a lot of planes
cheaply a year or two ago, many skyhawk owners found out that they were
upside down in their leaseback planes. At the same time hours were dropping
and some of them walked away from the deal because they were really broke,
or just mad. The finance company gets stuck.

Those that ask usually want no more than a 10 year note on a leaseback,
which you MAY be able to negotiate up with a larger down payment. Or you
can fib, just make sure that there is no language in the contract to prevent
you from later deciding to put the plane on leaseback.

Shop around, it took me two months, but I got the loan I wanted.


"R.Hubbell" wrote in message
...
Calling all owners that leaseback a plane to a club or FBO or ??

I have found that financers offer different loans depending on
the who uses the plane. For a club they want 10 years or less
but for private they will finance up to 20 years. Maybe I just need
to keep looking. I don't quite undertand why they would care as
long as they get paid.

So if you are leasing a plane back what kinds of loans were you
able to get?


The 20 year loans are ideal for so many reasons.

R. Hubbell

"Dude" wrote in message ...

Those that ask usually want no more than a 10 year note on a leaseback,
which you MAY be able to negotiate up with a larger down payment. Or you
can fib, just make sure that there is no language in the contract to prevent
you from later deciding to put the plane on leaseback.

Believe me, MBNA specifically places that restriction in the loan documents.
I had to get a "consent to leaseback" from them when I had my plane on leaseback.

Of course, MBNA seems to have gone down hill, following the fine tendency
for any AOPA recommended service to be a good deal for nobody but AOPA.
They so screwed up my account and ****ed off both my mechanic and insurance
agent...that it was easier for me to just pay off the remainder of the loan than
to deal with the arrogant asshole there.

They have the documents available on line, so you can check.


"Ron Natalie" wrote in message
. ..

"Dude" wrote in message
...

Those that ask usually want no more than a 10 year note on a leaseback,
which you MAY be able to negotiate up with a larger down payment. Or
you
can fib, just make sure that there is no language in the contract to
prevent
you from later deciding to put the plane on leaseback.

Believe me, MBNA specifically places that restriction in the loan
documents.
I had to get a "consent to leaseback" from them when I had my plane on
leaseback.

Of course, MBNA seems to have gone down hill, following the fine tendency
for any AOPA recommended service to be a good deal for nobody but AOPA.
They so screwed up my account and ****ed off both my mechanic and
insurance
agent...that it was easier for me to just pay off the remainder of the
loan than
to deal with the arrogant asshole there.

On Fri, 06 Feb 2004 17:04:08 GMT "Dude" wrote:

I got 20 from MBNA on a new plane. They do did ask if you plan to use a
leaseback.

The reason they are asking is that when Cessna unloaded a lot of planes
cheaply a year or two ago, many skyhawk owners found out that they were
upside down in their leaseback planes. At the same time hours were dropping
and some of them walked away from the deal because they were really broke,
or just mad. The finance company gets stuck.



There must be more to it then just that. But I could understand how
people would walk away from a leaseback that's underwater but it
seems it's most likely to happen in the first 10 years
rather than the last. And with a cheaper monthly payment on a
20 year note it seems the chances of going inverted on
a leaseback would be less common. Plane doesn't have to fly as much
to cover the monthly.


Those that ask usually want no more than a 10 year note on a leaseback,
which you MAY be able to negotiate up with a larger down payment. Or you
can fib, just make sure that there is no language in the contract to prevent
you from later deciding to put the plane on leaseback.


Increasing the down payment sounds like a good option.



Shop around, it took me two months, but I got the loan I wanted.


Yes will do that, I think it's a borrowers market.

Tanks for sharing your experience.

R. Hubbell




"R.Hubbell" wrote in message
...
Calling all owners that leaseback a plane to a club or FBO or ??

I have found that financers offer different loans depending on
the who uses the plane. For a club they want 10 years or less
but for private they will finance up to 20 years. Maybe I just need
to keep looking. I don't quite undertand why they would care as
long as they get paid.

So if you are leasing a plane back what kinds of loans were you
able to get?


The 20 year loans are ideal for so many reasons.

R. Hubbell

On Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:23:33 -0500 "Ron Natalie" wrote:


"Dude" wrote in message ...

Those that ask usually want no more than a 10 year note on a leaseback,
which you MAY be able to negotiate up with a larger down payment. Or you
can fib, just make sure that there is no language in the contract to prevent
you from later deciding to put the plane on leaseback.

Believe me, MBNA specifically places that restriction in the loan documents.
I had to get a "consent to leaseback" from them when I had my plane on leaseback.

So they limited you to a 10 year note?



Of course, MBNA seems to have gone down hill, following the fine tendency
for any AOPA recommended service to be a good deal for nobody but AOPA.
They so screwed up my account and ****ed off both my mechanic and insurance
agent...that it was easier for me to just pay off the remainder of the loan than
to deal with the arrogant asshole there.


what other services have they screwed up?


R. Hubbell

Ron Natalie wrote:

They so screwed up my account and ****ed off both my mechanic and insurance
agent...that it was easier for me to just pay off the remainder of the loan than
to deal with the arrogant asshole there.

I just got word that MBNA is taking over my VISA account from my credit union. I'm
not looking forward to it.

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

On Sat, 07 Feb 2004 07:24:25 -0500 Saryon wrote:

On Fri, 6 Feb 2004 19:07:34 -0800, "R.Hubbell"
wrote:


Of course, MBNA seems to have gone down hill, following the fine tendency
for any AOPA recommended service to be a good deal for nobody but AOPA.
They so screwed up my account and ****ed off both my mechanic and insurance
agent...that it was easier for me to just pay off the remainder of the loan than
to deal with the arrogant asshole there.


what other services have they screwed up?

One time I knew I was moving before the next bill print (I had just
received my bill and was moving the next week). I called them up and
gave them my new address. Called back 5 days later to make sure the
computer had my new address. Never got my next month's bill at either
my old address (had mail forwarded) or my new address. Called them up
and got mailing address and amount due - mailed it in, and the check
got cashed. Got the bill after that one, mailed to my old address and
now showing my account 30 days late. They also reported me late to
the credit bureaus and refused to fix it, even though it was clearly
their fault, and I had unequivocable proof that they had in fact been
paid, on time, even without a statement. I will never do business
with MBNA or get store financing through any company that uses them as
their lender.



Well this kind of stuff happens at all banks, sometimes it behooves
thme to be less than efficient. I have had banks play all kinds
of games. Often they attribute the problems do to just mistakes
on the part of their employees. It's amazing how the mistakes
always seem to go in their favor.


R. Hubbell

"R.Hubbell" wrote in message ...
Believe me, MBNA specifically places that restriction in the loan documents.
I had to get a "consent to leaseback" from them when I had my plane on leaseback.

So they limited you to a 10 year note?


Don't know. I only asked for a ten year note.

what other services have they screwed up?

I haven't found any of their allied services to be a good deal: insurance, car rental
discounts, etc...

"R.Hubbell" wrote in message ...

Well this kind of stuff happens at all banks, sometimes it behooves
thme to be less than efficient. I have had banks play all kinds
of games. Often they attribute the problems do to just mistakes
on the part of their employees. It's amazing how the mistakes
always seem to go in their favor.

I had set up the thing to be automatic payment from my checking account.
Twice this managed to get hosed up on the MBNA end. The latter time some
goofy charge of under a dollar kept getting propagated from month to month.
I called numerous times to inquire as well as buttonholing the MBNA reps at
Oshkosh and the AOPA expos several times to complain. Never once got
a promised answer.

The last straw was when I had a damage claim on the plane. As is typical,
the insurance company made the check out jointly to me and MBNA as the
lienholder. Since the work had already been performed, I asked them to
just endorse the check back over to me (I've had similar situations with
claims on homeowners policies, etc.... it's never ever been a problem). Well
MBNA wants proof the work was done. I fax them the bills, they call
the shop, the shop owner (who is the most laid back guy I've ever met) says
the loan guy is an arrogant jerk. This goes round and round. Finally, I note
that the balance on the loan is LESS than the check they're sitting on. Tell them
to just use the check to pay it off.

Now get this, of course, I didn't endorse the check so they can't cash it. So
they mail it to me (but they've already endorsed it, so I could have just as easily
cashed the thing). I sent it back anyhow. Still took several calls to get the
payoff handled and the balance sent back to me.

This is typical of MBNA (also had some fun with their credit card department).
If everything goes fine, it's a good deal. Even Jeannette Ving and the folks in
the acquisition department are good people. However, if anything goes wrong
their customer service people are a bunch of arrogant idiots and you're lucky
if anything gets straightened out.