Air Force One seen by BA pilot

The news mentioned that while AF1 was enroute to Baghdad Int., a
British Airways pilot saw AF1 and asked (on the horn) "is that AF1?".
Then AF1s' pilot responded "No, it's a Gulfstream". At first I
thought that was funny but then after thinking about it, I'm wordering
how true this is. First of all, did that BA pilot have binoculars?
How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world. ***I just thought of something as I
was typing this, maybe there was no TFR because Pres. Bush "wasn't
onboard" and it wouldn't have offically been AF1, as far as call sign
and ATC goes, at the time.*** Secondly, if none of that is the case,
why would the BA pilot would ask that question over the radio and what
are the chances the 2 aircraft would be on the same freq.? Just
wondering and speculating, not that it matters either way. If this
did happen, the pilot of AF1 has a great way of saying "Shut the hell
up man, this isn't what you think" wink wink. Very funny.

Well, there are just two air-to-air freqs that I know of.

Better yet, he could have called on the emergency freq, which all
pilots must monitor if able.

On 28 Nov 2003 10:37:39 -0800, (Milo) wrote:

The news mentioned that while AF1 was enroute to Baghdad Int., a
British Airways pilot saw AF1 and asked (on the horn) "is that AF1?".
Then AF1s' pilot responded "No, it's a Gulfstream". At first I
thought that was funny but then after thinking about it, I'm wordering
how true this is. First of all, did that BA pilot have binoculars?
How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world. ***I just thought of something as I
was typing this, maybe there was no TFR because Pres. Bush "wasn't
onboard" and it wouldn't have offically been AF1, as far as call sign
and ATC goes, at the time.*** Secondly, if none of that is the case,
why would the BA pilot would ask that question over the radio and what
are the chances the 2 aircraft would be on the same freq.? Just
wondering and speculating, not that it matters either way. If this
did happen, the pilot of AF1 has a great way of saying "Shut the hell
up man, this isn't what you think" wink wink. Very funny.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email:

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

The air-to-air freqs you refer to are not used in oceanic airspace...all
transoceanic flights are talking to the appropriate oceanic controller on
his/her discrete frequency. Use of this freq for plane-to-plane is not
kosher, but not unusual, either.

Bob gardner

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

Well, there are just two air-to-air freqs that I know of.

Better yet, he could have called on the emergency freq, which all
pilots must monitor if able.

On 28 Nov 2003 10:37:39 -0800, (Milo) wrote:

The news mentioned that while AF1 was enroute to Baghdad Int., a
British Airways pilot saw AF1 and asked (on the horn) "is that AF1?".
Then AF1s' pilot responded "No, it's a Gulfstream". At first I
thought that was funny but then after thinking about it, I'm wordering
how true this is. First of all, did that BA pilot have binoculars?
How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world. ***I just thought of something as I
was typing this, maybe there was no TFR because Pres. Bush "wasn't
onboard" and it wouldn't have offically been AF1, as far as call sign
and ATC goes, at the time.*** Secondly, if none of that is the case,
why would the BA pilot would ask that question over the radio and what
are the chances the 2 aircraft would be on the same freq.? Just
wondering and speculating, not that it matters either way. If this
did happen, the pilot of AF1 has a great way of saying "Shut the hell
up man, this isn't what you think" wink wink. Very funny.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email:

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

I know this is hard for a lot of people to comprehend, but actually
US regulations only apply within the US. Hence an FAA TFR can
only exist within US airspace.

And luckily even the FAA doesn't (afaik) try to put a near-Mach-1
moving TFR around AF1 while it is actually flying, although there may
be some separation provided behind the scenes by ATC.

John

"Milo" wrote in message
om...
The news mentioned that while AF1 was enroute to Baghdad Int., a
British Airways pilot saw AF1 and asked (on the horn) "is that AF1?".
Then AF1s' pilot responded "No, it's a Gulfstream". At first I
thought that was funny but then after thinking about it, I'm wordering
how true this is. First of all, did that BA pilot have binoculars?
How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world. ***I just thought of something as I
was typing this, maybe there was no TFR because Pres. Bush "wasn't
onboard" and it wouldn't have offically been AF1, as far as call sign
and ATC goes, at the time.*** Secondly, if none of that is the case,
why would the BA pilot would ask that question over the radio and what
are the chances the 2 aircraft would be on the same freq.? Just
wondering and speculating, not that it matters either way. If this
did happen, the pilot of AF1 has a great way of saying "Shut the hell
up man, this isn't what you think" wink wink. Very funny.

"Bob Gardner" wrote

The air-to-air freqs you refer to are not used in oceanic
airspace...all transoceanic flights are talking to the
appropriate oceanic controller on his/her discrete frequency.
Use of this freq for plane-to-plane is not kosher, but not
unusual, either.

For the 25 years that I flew trans-oceanic, whether the FAA or
FCC approved it or not, 123.45 WAS Oceanic Common. I suspect
that it still is. Not too many Radio Cops out there. :-)

Bob Moore

Milo

Long data article on Drudge.

Part said he was in Stealth mode, no AF call sign, no escort, routing
traffic and handling within system, nothing overt. Not just sure but
may have turned navigation lights off at night??? etc., etc.

Glad he made the trip. Troops got a boost. Shows he can move any place
he wants without being stopped by any terrorist organization.

Big John

On 28 Nov 2003 10:37:39 -0800, (Milo) wrote:

The news mentioned that while AF1 was enroute to Baghdad Int., a
British Airways pilot saw AF1 and asked (on the horn) "is that AF1?".
Then AF1s' pilot responded "No, it's a Gulfstream". At first I
thought that was funny but then after thinking about it, I'm wordering
how true this is. First of all, did that BA pilot have binoculars?
How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world. ***I just thought of something as I
was typing this, maybe there was no TFR because Pres. Bush "wasn't
onboard" and it wouldn't have offically been AF1, as far as call sign
and ATC goes, at the time.*** Secondly, if none of that is the case,
why would the BA pilot would ask that question over the radio and what
are the chances the 2 aircraft would be on the same freq.? Just
wondering and speculating, not that it matters either way. If this
did happen, the pilot of AF1 has a great way of saying "Shut the hell
up man, this isn't what you think" wink wink. Very funny.

Words are he did turn out the lights for the night landing in Baghdad.. but
I'm sure the lights were on when in other countries ATC system.

BT

"Big John" wrote in message
...
Milo

Long data article on Drudge.

Part said he was in Stealth mode, no AF call sign, no escort, routing
traffic and handling within system, nothing overt. Not just sure but
may have turned navigation lights off at night??? etc., etc.

Glad he made the trip. Troops got a boost. Shows he can move any place
he wants without being stopped by any terrorist organization.

Big John

On 28 Nov 2003 10:37:39 -0800, (Milo) wrote:

The news mentioned that while AF1 was enroute to Baghdad Int., a
British Airways pilot saw AF1 and asked (on the horn) "is that AF1?".
Then AF1s' pilot responded "No, it's a Gulfstream". At first I
thought that was funny but then after thinking about it, I'm wordering
how true this is. First of all, did that BA pilot have binoculars?
How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world. ***I just thought of something as I
was typing this, maybe there was no TFR because Pres. Bush "wasn't
onboard" and it wouldn't have offically been AF1, as far as call sign
and ATC goes, at the time.*** Secondly, if none of that is the case,
why would the BA pilot would ask that question over the radio and what
are the chances the 2 aircraft would be on the same freq.? Just
wondering and speculating, not that it matters either way. If this
did happen, the pilot of AF1 has a great way of saying "Shut the hell
up man, this isn't what you think" wink wink. Very funny.

The air-to-air freqs you refer to are not used in oceanic airspace...all
transoceanic flights are talking to the appropriate oceanic controller on
his/her discrete frequency. Use of this freq for plane-to-plane is not
kosher, but not unusual, either.

Ah, I stand corrected!

I wonder if Maurice Kirk knows this? He is planning to fly his Piper
Cub from Australia to the U.S. next year.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email:

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world.

TFRs are US only. It is up to the Authorities in other countries to decide
how to provide appropriate airspace protection.

The evil empire does not have the power to install TFRs outside the US -yet.

On 28 Nov 2003 10:37:39 -0800, (Milo) wrote:

The news mentioned that while AF1 was enroute to Baghdad Int., a
British Airways pilot saw AF1 and asked (on the horn) "is that AF1?".
Then AF1s' pilot responded "No, it's a Gulfstream". At first I
thought that was funny but then after thinking about it, I'm wordering
how true this is. First of all, did that BA pilot have binoculars?
How did he see AF1 with the TFR in place, I assume they are in effect
wherever AF1 goes in the world. ***I just thought of something as I
was typing this, maybe there was no TFR because Pres. Bush "wasn't
onboard" and it wouldn't have offically been AF1, as far as call sign
and ATC goes, at the time.*** Secondly, if none of that is the case,
why would the BA pilot would ask that question over the radio and what
are the chances the 2 aircraft would be on the same freq.? Just
wondering and speculating, not that it matters either way. If this
did happen, the pilot of AF1 has a great way of saying "Shut the hell
up man, this isn't what you think" wink wink. Very funny.

A tall tale. If another aircraft really had eyeballed "AF1" and called up
as stated, the AF1 pilot would have just ignored the call.

Also very unlikely that any other aircraft would be able to get into visual
range -- AF1 would have deviated to maintain greater separation. They do
have better than average radar, you know. :-)