Looking for Advice..

I just graduated from high school and my dream job is to become a pilot. I have wanted to be a pilot since a very young age. I plan on attending my local community college this fall. They offer an aviation science program that is mainly a transfer program where you go for 2 years then transfer to a 4-year school for the other two. The course description says:

The Associate in Science (A.S.) degree is awarded upon completion of requirements for this program.

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot License.

The total cost of the program is $27,000. What schools could I transfer to after this? And do you guys think its worth it or should I persue a degree in something else? What is the job outlook like? Thanks.

majortom546 wrote:
I just graduated from high school and my dream job is to become a pilot.
I have wanted to be a pilot since a very young age. I plan on attending
my local community college this fall. They offer an aviation science
program that is mainly a transfer program where you go for 2 years then
transfer to a 4-year school for the other two. The course description
says:

The Associate in Science (A.S.) degree is awarded upon completion of
requirements for this program.

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot
License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot
License.

The total cost of the program is $27,000. What schools could I transfer
to after this? And do you guys think its worth it or should I persue a
degree in something else? What is the job outlook like? Thanks.
*
*
*
It has been done before - but this is possibly the toughest, unlikeliest
way to an airline job. Getting a four year degree. YES!
Getting a pilot slot in the Navy or AirForce? YES?

But if an hour of flight costs $100 and it will take you 45 hours (at
least) then that's a $5000 budget, not $27 grand

Brian W

On Jun 26, 6:28*am, Brian Whatcott wrote:
majortom546 wrote:
I just graduated from high school and my dream job is to become a pilot..
I have wanted to be a pilot since a very young age. I plan on attending
my local community college this fall. They offer an aviation science
program that is mainly a transfer program where you go for 2 years then
transfer to a 4-year school for the other two. The course description
says:

The Associate in Science (A.S.) degree is awarded upon completion of
requirements for this program.

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot
License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot
License.

The total cost of the program is $27,000. What schools could I transfer
to after this? And do you guys think its worth it or should I persue a
degree in something else? What is the job outlook like? Thanks.

* *
*
*
It has been done before - but this is possibly the toughest, unlikeliest
way to an airline job. * * Getting a four year degree. YES!
Getting a pilot slot in the Navy or AirForce? YES?

But if an hour of flight costs $100 and it will take you 45 hours (at
least) then that's a $5000 budget, not $27 grand

Brian W

And not to rain on your parade (much) but if you were a major carrier
(and hiring, which they aren't) would you hire someone with military
experience (any military is better than no military) and a college
degree or someone with schooling but not that much experience? Just
to earn $25K/yr?

For most folks its more the life depicted in a recent New York Times
article:

Free registration:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/17/nyregion/17pilot.html

Excerpted:

May 17, 2009
Pilots’ Lives Defy Glamorous Stereotype
By DAVID M. HALBFINGER, MATTHEW L. WALD and CHRISTOPHER DREW

This article was reported by David M. Halbfinger, Matthew L. Wald and
Christopher Drew, and written by Mr. Halbfinger.

Alex Lapointe, a 25-year-old co-pilot for a regional airline, says he
routinely lifts off knowing he has gotten less sleep than he needs.
And once or twice a week, he says, he sees the captain next to him
struggling to stay alert.

Neil A. Weston, also 25, went $100,000 into debt to train for a co-
pilot’s job that pays him $25,000 annually. He carries sandwiches in a
cooler from his home in Dubuque, Iowa, bought his first uniform for
$400, and holds out hope of tripling his salary by moving into the
captain’s seat, then up to a major carrier. Assuming, that is, the
majors start hiring again.

Capt. Paul Nietz, 58, who recently retired from a regional airline,
said his schedule wore him down and cost him three marriages. His
workweek typically began with a 2:30 a.m. wake-up in northern Michigan
and a 6 a.m. flight to his Chicago home bases. There, he would wait
for his first assignment, a noon departure.

By the time he parked his aircraft at the last gate of the night, he
was exhausted. But he would be due back at work eight hours and 15
minutes later. “At the very most, if you’re the kind of person that
could walk into a hotel room, strip and lay down, you might get four
and a half hours of sleep,” he said. “And I was very senior. I was one
of the fortunate guys.”

The National Transportation Safety Board’s inquiry into the Feb. 12
crash of Continental Connection Flight 3407 outside Buffalo has
highlighted the operations of the nation’s regional airlines, a sector
of the aviation industry that has grown to account for half the
country’s airline flights and a quarter of its passengers.

The details of that world have surprised many Americans — the
strikingly low pay for new pilots; the rigors of flying multiple
flights, at lower altitudes and thus often in worse weather than
pilots on longer routes, while scrambling to get enough sleep; the
relative inexperience of pilots at the smaller airlines, whose
training standards are the same, but whose skills may not be.

majortom546 wrote

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot
License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot
License.

I would be somewhat leery of any educational institution that calls a
pilot "certificate" a "license".

There are major differences between the two.

Bob Moore
ATP CFI
PanAm (retired)

"Robert Moore" wrote in message
5.250...
majortom546 wrote

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot
License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot
License.

I would be somewhat leery of any educational institution that calls a
pilot "certificate" a "license".

There are major differences between the two.

Bob Moore
ATP CFI
PanAm (retired)

Technically true, but annecdotal evidence suggests that the distinction has
been blurred by individuals and agencies treating both as licenses and
enforcing them as such.

Peter

On Jun 26, 6:28*am, Brian Whatcott wrote:

majortom546 wrote:
I just graduated from high school and my dream job is to become a pilot..
I have wanted to be a pilot since a very young age. I plan on attending
my local community college this fall. They offer an aviation science
program that is mainly a transfer program where you go for 2 years then
transfer to a 4-year school for the other two. The course description
says:

The Associate in Science (A.S.) degree is awarded upon completion of
requirements for this program.

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot
License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot
License.

But if an hour of flight costs $100 and it will take you 45 hours (at
least) then that's a $5000 budget, not $27 grand

Brian W-

The school's program gives commercial and instrument, not just
private, making the $27 grand much more realistic. Factor in that this
is a part 141 college and a degree is earned then the $27 seems more
likely.

Ricky

On Jun 25, 9:38 pm, majortom546
wrote:
I just graduated from high school and my dream job is to become a pilot.
I have wanted to be a pilot since a very young age. I plan on attending
my local community college this fall. They offer an aviation science
program that is mainly a transfer program where you go for 2 years then
transfer to a 4-year school for the other two. The course description
says:

The Associate in Science (A.S.) degree is awarded upon completion of
requirements for this program.

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot
License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot
License.

The total cost of the program is $27,000. What schools could I transfer
to after this? And do you guys think its worth it or should I persue a
degree in something else? What is the job outlook like? Thanks.

--
majortom546

Please do not listen only to the doom stories about salary, hours,
expense, and the liberal NYT article. Never trust or put much weight
on the media in making life-changing decions, especially about a
career.

Piloting careers are diverse and the job market fluctuates greatly. I
am not a career pilot (I am a career A&P who flys for fun at the
moment) but my nephew's story paints a different picture than the doom
& gloom stories given to you here so far.
He went into some debt but had wealthy parents to help him through
Baylor's aviation program, graduated with a bachelor's and a CFII,
Multi, went straight to the Dallas area and stepped into a $25,000/
year CFI job with very reasonable hours and benefits. A few months
later he hired on at Flight Safety as a co-pilot in a specific
business jet simulator and was paid over $30,000 for this. A business
jet captain, coming to train in the simulator liked my nephew and
said; "you should come work for us." So he went from Flight Safety to
co-pilot in a Sabreliner for a major corporation and his salary jumped
significantly to, I think, near $40,000. All this happened in less
than 2 years after graduating from a 4 year university so don't let
anyone tell you that you can't get a good flying job. If you want
something bad enough, and are willing to do whatever it takes to get
it, it can be your's.
I could tell you at least 5 more very recent success stories of pilots
just out of school getting very respectable careers flying. The
airlines are NOT all there is. There are corporations, 1000s of them
with small business jets. Helicopter jobs are hot, I understand, right
now (and usually are). You can fly and earn a living, don't listen to
those who say "don't!"
Many people really enjoy instructing as a career and make well over
$50,000 within a few years at the right school/insitution. My plan is
to get my CFII & instruct as a "side job" supplementing my A&P work or
to find a place that needs check or test pilots for planes worked on.
If you really want to fly and it's been your dream since you were
little, don't let anything or anyone stop you. You will never be
satisfied or happy until you're living your dream, anyway.

Ricky

Robert Moore wrote:
majortom546 wrote

* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Private Pilot
License.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn an Instrument Rating.
* Student will satisfy all requirements to earn a Commercial Pilot
License.

I would be somewhat leery of any educational institution that calls a
pilot "certificate" a "license".

There are major differences between the two.

Bob Moore
ATP CFI
PanAm (retired)

Some European licensing authorities call 'em licences.

Brian W

"Robert Moore" wrote in message
5.250...
snip
I would be somewhat leery of any educational institution that calls a
pilot "certificate" a "license".

There are major differences between the two.

Bob Moore
ATP CFI
PanAm (retired)

Hello Bob,
with respect,
The OP did not indicate their country of concern, in Canada at least (and I
suspect many others) the correct term (and spelling) is Licence.

PPL = Private pilot Licence (class = aeroplane or other)
CPL = Commercial Pilot Licence - aeroplane
ATPL = Airline Transport Pilot Licence - aeroplane
GPL = Glider Pilot Licence
BPL = Balloon Pilot Licence

Other Pilot Permits are available -
Student Pilot Permit
Gyroplane Pilot Permit
Ultra-light Aeroplane Pilot Permit
RPP = Recreational Pilot Permit - Aeroplane
Recreational Pilot Permit - Helicopter

Other available Licences cover -
Flight Engineers
Air Traffic Controllers
Aircraft Maintenance Engineers

In addition there are many additional ratings covering
Night
VFR OTT
Instrument
Second Officer
Passenger carrying (ultralight)
Flight Instructor
other Classes
Types
Floats

Link to CARs (Canadian Aviation Regulations)
http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/re.../cars/menu.htm
Part IV - Personnel Licensing and Training subpart 1
http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/re...4/subpart1.htm
has a list and training requirements for the various licences and permits.

I agree there can be major differences between a Licence (or License) and a
Certificate or a Permit. AFAIK, Permits are not valid or recognized outside
of their country of issue. I do not fully understand the difference in the
USA between a License (correct spelling in US usage?) and a Certificate. I
would appreciate enlightenment.

Happy landings,

"Robert Moore" wrote in message
5.250...
snip
I would be somewhat leery of any educational institution that calls a
pilot "certificate" a "license".

There are major differences between the two.

Bob Moore
ATP CFI
PanAm (retired)

Hello Bob,
with respect,
The OP did not indicate their country of concern, in Canada at least (and I
suspect many others) the correct term (and spelling) is Licence.

PPL = Private pilot Licence (class = aeroplane or other)
CPL = Commercial Pilot Licence - aeroplane
ATPL = Airline Transport Pilot Licence - aeroplane
GPL = Glider Pilot Licence
BPL = Balloon Pilot Licence

Other Pilot Permits are available -
Student Pilot Permit
Gyroplane Pilot Permit
Ultra-light Aeroplane Pilot Permit
RPP = Recreational Pilot Permit - Aeroplane
Recreational Pilot Permit - Helicopter

Other available Licences cover -
Flight Engineers
Air Traffic Controllers
Aircraft Maintenance Engineers

In addition there are many additional ratings covering
Night
VFR OTT
Instrument
Second Officer
Passenger carrying (ultralight)
Flight Instructor
other Classes
Types
Floats

Link to CARs (Canadian Aviation Regulations)
http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/re.../cars/menu.htm
Part IV - Personnel Licensing and Training subpart 1
http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/re...4/subpart1.htm
has a list and training requirements for the various licences and permits.

I agree there can be major differences between a Licence (or License) and a
Certificate or a Permit. AFAIK, Permits are not valid or recognized outside
of their country of issue. I do not fully understand the difference in the
USA between a License (correct spelling in US usage?) and a Certificate. I
would appreciate enlightenment.

Happy landings,