Methane Cloud?

Saw just a real short clip of something on the Disc channel tonight
about how methane clouds affect aircraft. Lower pressure causes the
plane to drop because of reduced lift, and the altimeter to read a
climb because of the pressure change. I think this show may have been
in the context of bermuda triangle stuff. Maybe Im just out of the
loop but I had never heard of this happening (flying into a cloud of
methane I mean). They seemed to have some pretty reputable people
talking about it. Anyone experience this or hear of it?

the only way I could figure flying into a methane cloud serious enough to
have any effect on flight.. would be low level over a stock yard pen..

and then I think the effect would be more on the physical condition of the
pilot.. and not the aerodynamic effect of the wings or altitude sensors..

BT

"Martin" wrote in message
om...
Saw just a real short clip of something on the Disc channel tonight
about how methane clouds affect aircraft. Lower pressure causes the
plane to drop because of reduced lift, and the altimeter to read a
climb because of the pressure change. I think this show may have been
in the context of bermuda triangle stuff. Maybe Im just out of the
loop but I had never heard of this happening (flying into a cloud of
methane I mean). They seemed to have some pretty reputable people
talking about it. Anyone experience this or hear of it?

"Martin" wrote in message
om...
Saw just a real short clip of something on the Disc channel tonight
about how methane clouds affect aircraft. Lower pressure causes the
plane to drop because of reduced lift, and the altimeter to read a
climb because of the pressure change. I think this show may have been
in the context of bermuda triangle stuff. Maybe Im just out of the
loop but I had never heard of this happening (flying into a cloud of
methane I mean). They seemed to have some pretty reputable people
talking about it. Anyone experience this or hear of it?


Martin,

It's a theory that's been "floating" around for some time, but mostly
regarding it's effect on ships.

They've modeled the effect of a methane mega-bubble on bouyancy and have
shown that a large ship would basically drop like a stone if it were to sail
across such a bubble. Hence no SOS, no life boats, no sign of ship or crew.

I'm just guessing, but I'm pretty sure there would have to be a similar
effect on an aircraft due to a decrease in air density?

FWIW...

Jay Beckman
Chandler, AZ

They've modeled the effect of a methane mega-bubble on bouyancy


Whazzat? Methane dissolved in the ocean to the extent that the water's density
goes down enough to sink a ship?

Jose

--
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Teacherjh wrote:
They've modeled the effect of a methane mega-bubble on bouyancy


Whazzat? Methane dissolved in the ocean to the extent that the water's density
goes down enough to sink a ship?

Jose

A good read on this at ....
http://dsc.discovery.com/news/afp/20031020/methane.html

"Martin" wrote in message
om...
Saw just a real short clip of something on the Disc channel tonight
about how methane clouds affect aircraft. Lower pressure causes the
plane to drop because of reduced lift, and the altimeter to read a
climb because of the pressure change. I think this show may have been
in the context of bermuda triangle stuff. Maybe Im just out of the
loop but I had never heard of this happening (flying into a cloud of
methane I mean). They seemed to have some pretty reputable people
talking about it. Anyone experience this or hear of it?

I watched that Discovery episode last week and they went into detail about
the theory that methane gas bubbles could sink ships and tested the theory
in a lab with model ships and air bubbles.

There was also a theory that flying through a methane gas cloud would effect
flight; one that a piston engine would quit if there was 1% methane in the
air and another that a simulator flight into such a cloud would cause
reduced lift because of less dense air and the altimeter would climb rapidly
even though the aircraft was dropping.

http://media.dsc.discovery.com/news/...0/methane.html

"Teacherjh" wrote in message
...

They've modeled the effect of a methane mega-bubble on bouyancy


Whazzat? Methane dissolved in the ocean to the extent that the water's
density
goes down enough to sink a ship?

Jose

Yes, exactly. There are big methane-hydrate deposits off the east coast,
kept stable by the pressure at great depth. There was an oil platform lost
due to a well head blowout that caused the same effect. Lots of theories
about methane-hydrates and lowered sea levels during ice ages release of
methane causes global warming, ending ice age cycle repeats every 11-
20,000 years.

Methane hydrate exists as ice
http://marine.usgs.gov/fact-sheets/g...tes/title.html
http://sepwww.stanford.edu/public/do...96/paper_html/
http://www.gsfc.nasa.gov/topstory/20011212methane.html

"Jay Beckman" wrote in message news:d_Bnc.17385$k24.10128@fed1read01...
"Martin" wrote in message
om...
Saw just a real short clip of something on the Disc channel tonight
about how methane clouds affect aircraft. Lower pressure causes the
plane to drop because of reduced lift, and the altimeter to read a
climb because of the pressure change. I think this show may have been
in the context of bermuda triangle stuff. Maybe Im just out of the
loop but I had never heard of this happening (flying into a cloud of
methane I mean). They seemed to have some pretty reputable people
talking about it. Anyone experience this or hear of it?


The main problem will be the motor will quit running because of the
lack of oxygen. The plane will fall from the skies for sure then.....
It's that gravity thing ya know. g

Martin,

It's a theory that's been "floating" around for some time, but mostly
regarding it's effect on ships.

They've modeled the effect of a methane mega-bubble on bouyancy and have
shown that a large ship would basically drop like a stone if it were to sail
across such a bubble. Hence no SOS, no life boats, no sign of ship or crew.

I'm just guessing, but I'm pretty sure there would have to be a similar
effect on an aircraft due to a decrease in air density?

FWIW...

Jay Beckman
Chandler, AZ

On Mon, 10 May 2004 03:17:58 +0000, Teacherjh wrote:


They've modeled the effect of a methane mega-bubble on bouyancy


Whazzat? Methane dissolved in the ocean to the extent that the water's density
goes down enough to sink a ship?

Jose


Well, I don't think it was dissolved. I recently watched a show called,
"Diving the Bermuda Triangle", or something like that. They showed
footage of a large area on the sea floor where steady streams of bubbles
popped up from the floor and rose to the surface. Seems this is called a
methane field. It's theorized that an undersea quake could cause the
floor to shift enough to release a huge bubble of methane. They did some
research to show that a large enough methane bubble could easily sink a
ship. They also tested to see what effect it would have on a plane's
motor. On a large rotory engine, only 1% methane contamination was
required to cause the engine to quit. Less than 1% was enough
to cause an RPM drop. As it approaches 1%, sputtering occurs and then
finally, the engine quiets.

This theory, while unproven, seems to get some support because the
"Bermuda Triangle" appears to have large methane fields scattered
throughout.

They hoped to use this knowledge to locate planes which were lost during
WWII. Oddly, they found 5-planes, that crashed at 5-different times that
were all within 1.5 miles of each other, but no known methane field
exists in the area. When reviewing the paperwork of the discovered
planes, it appears that several of the planes did sputter and quit.
And, the flight of planes which they expected to find in a methane field,
were not found. Go figure.

It was an interesting story.

The theory does not pan out because it is based on a false premise: that the
Bermuda triangle exists. There is nothing supporting the idea that flying or
sailing through there is any more dangerous than anywhere else. Since the
Bermuda triangle is a myth, any explanation of why it exists is going to
have more holes in it than the sea has bubbles. Simply put, the Bermuda
triangle is a high traffic area and thus gets more accidents. Adjusting the
accident rate for the amount of traffic going through there shows the
Bermuda triangle to be no more dangerous than anywhere else.

There are methane fields in other parts of the world, too, and volcanic
vents of all types that release large volumes of all kinds of obnoxious
gases. Whether these events are dangerous to ships or aircraft is one thing.
They might be and it should be investigated. But they are not the cause of
the "Bermuda triangle."

There is nothing mysterious about any of the wrecks found in the area so
far.

The Discovery Channel has a distressing amount of crap on it that is not
science. It seems obsessed with paranormal phenomena, spiritualism, and
UFOs.