taking off for the first time

I have never piloted an aircraft. I do flight simulation from time to
time. Currently I am messing with radio controlled aircraft. There are
simulators for that also.

Having only simulation experience, but I'm wondering about how piloting
is taught. Getting to the point, why not use a long runway and have the
student take off just enough for the wheels to leave the ground and
then immediately touch down?

Again, inexperienced with the real thing, but isn't landing so
difficult/critical to warrant special treatment like that?

Trainer runways are not long enough?
The wear and tear would be too much?
That maneuver would be too difficult for a beginner to coordinate?

Genuinely curious. Thank you.

I'm wondering about how piloting
is taught. Getting to the point, why not use a long runway and have the
student take off just enough for the wheels to leave the ground and
then immediately touch down?

This excercise would not teach what you think it would. Much of the
"trick" to landing is the approach, and in order to teach how to
approach the runway, you need to be far enough away from it, and
pointing in an appropriate direction. One then flies a pattern
(generally one flies parallel to the runway, and then makes a squarish
u-turn while descending and adjusting speed, flaps, and other
controls. If you do this right, the next "trick" is learning when to
flare and by how much. This requires learning the "sight picture" of
what the runway looks like when close on approach. This is different
from what it would look like just after takeoff.

One thing sometimes done in training is to approach and then fly a few
feet above the runway. This helps new pilots learn not to overcontrol.

btw, there's no such thing as a "trainer runway". Student pilots use
regular runways, and mix with regular air traffic. They just have an
instructor aboard until they can handle that much on their own.

Jose
(r.a.student retained, though I don't follow that group; I'm on
r.a.piloting)
--
Freedom. It seemed like a good idea at the time.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote:

btw, there's no such thing as a "trainer runway".

Right. I was thinking small aircraft, and was trying to concisely
distinguish between a short runway and a long runway. In other words, a
student small aircraft pilot isn't going to have the length of a 747
runway.

Student pilots to use regular runways, and mix with regular air
traffic. They just have an instructor aboard until they can handle
that much on their own.

This is a great exercise with more advanced primary students, but you would
be amazed at how difficult it actually is. When you're first learning to
land, we're working hard to get the airplane nice and stabalized on final.
This gives the student plenty of time to think about his/her control inputs,
to get used to controlling, and the chance to make a mistake or two.

Normally (at least with me in the right seat) the last part of landing that
comes together is the final 10 or 15 feet. When some kind of minor upset
occurs (as it almost invariably does when passing through the tree line, and
then entering ground effect), the student needs to learn to be quick enough
in his/her recovery. This is where your suggestion shines, as it forces the
student to rapidly transition from takeoff attitude to landing attitude
while handling the winds.

(Disclaimer - while this is a great lesson for a day where you otherwise
might not be flying due to weather, make sure the ceilings are high enough
that you could go around if you have to. I've seen people do these with
100-foot ceilings in non-gyro aircraft, and it makes me nervous.)

-Rob
"John Doe" wrote in message
...
I have never piloted an aircraft. I do flight simulation from time to
time. Currently I am messing with radio controlled aircraft. There are
simulators for that also.

Having only simulation experience, but I'm wondering about how piloting
is taught. Getting to the point, why not use a long runway and have the
student take off just enough for the wheels to leave the ground and
then immediately touch down?

Again, inexperienced with the real thing, but isn't landing so
difficult/critical to warrant special treatment like that?

Trainer runways are not long enough?
The wear and tear would be too much?
That maneuver would be too difficult for a beginner to coordinate?

Genuinely curious. Thank you.

"John Doe" wrote in message
...
Jose wrote:

btw, there's no such thing as a "trainer runway".

Right. I was thinking small aircraft, and was trying to concisely
distinguish between a short runway and a long runway. In other words, a
student small aircraft pilot isn't going to have the length of a 747
runway.

Sometimes they do, but that's definately learning to swim in the deep end of
the pool.

Most runways are five to ten times the length necessary for a trainer to
take off anyway, but the instructor will still have them fly around the
pattern to set up for normal approach.

-c

The only thing I would add to the other's excellent replies; you should
begin the New Year by going down to your local airport and signing-up for an
introductory flight,,, you may find it 'hooks you in' like it did all of
us.....

There's nothing like that beautiful picture outside your windscreen or the
feel and sound of the mains as they gently (hopefully g) 'chirp' as they
touch the runway......

--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

If you had the student takeoff for the first time and immediately land again
you would be subjecting him immediately to the most critical and dangerous
part of flying.... the flare and landing. And this would be before he had
an opportunity at altitude to experiment with the flight controls to see how
they react. At 5,000' you can make lots of errors with no problem. At
10', descending to land, you have to do everything right.

--

Darrell R. Schmidt
B-58 Hustler History: http://members.cox.net/dschmidt1/
-

"John Doe" wrote in message
...
I have never piloted an aircraft. I do flight simulation from time to
time. Currently I am messing with radio controlled aircraft. There are
simulators for that also.

Having only simulation experience, but I'm wondering about how piloting
is taught. Getting to the point, why not use a long runway and have the
student take off just enough for the wheels to leave the ground and
then immediately touch down?

Again, inexperienced with the real thing, but isn't landing so
difficult/critical to warrant special treatment like that?

Trainer runways are not long enough?
The wear and tear would be too much?
That maneuver would be too difficult for a beginner to coordinate?

Genuinely curious. Thank you.

"Cecil Chapman" wrote:

The only thing I would add to the other's excellent replies; you
should begin the New Year by going down to your local airport and
signing-up for an introductory flight,,, you may find it 'hooks you
in' like it did all of us.....

There's nothing like that beautiful picture outside your windscreen
or the feel and sound of the mains as they gently (hopefully g)
'chirp' as they touch the runway......

Can you fly and post to Usenet at the same time?



--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -




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"John Doe" wrote in message
...
"Cecil Chapman" wrote:

The only thing I would add to the other's excellent replies; you
should begin the New Year by going down to your local airport and
signing-up for an introductory flight,,, you may find it 'hooks you
in' like it did all of us.....

There's nothing like that beautiful picture outside your windscreen
or the feel and sound of the mains as they gently (hopefully g)
'chirp' as they touch the runway......

Can you fly and post to Usenet at the same time?

That's coming pretty soon, though many people can now from airliners.


--
Matt
---------------------
Matthew W. Barrow
Site-Fill Homes, LLC.
Montrose, CO

"Matt Barrow" wrote:
"John Doe" wrote in message

Can you fly and post to Usenet at the same time?

That's coming pretty soon, though many people can now from airliners.

I understand that limited Internet service is available via mobile
phones, but can you reference any post ever to Usenet while flying?