Nervous flyer considering learning to glide

I'm a nervous flyer who spends a lot of time as a commercial aircraft
passenger. My number one anxiety is that freefall feeling when the
plane drops, like you'd get on a rollercoster (I don't like those
either).

As a bet with myself, I bought a trial lesson at my local gliding club
in SE England. It started out with an aerotow to 2000 ft, which had a
bit of the dreaded turbulance (the instructor said "it's been a bit
bumpy all day"). But the rest of the flight was fun and when we landed
I'd have gone back up again if I could.

Does anyone know if it's possible for people to overcome the fear of
freefall through gliding? I'm keen to do some more flying, but I
wonder if my fear will be a barrier for me.

Another question is winch vs aerotow. My local club does both. I did
aerotow, but I saw someone else winch launch. The winch is much
cheaper, but it looked really scary as an observer: the glider must
have been at a 45 degree angle, and I wonder what the accelleration in
the cockpit would be. I'd like to try a winch launch, but I'm worried
that it may be too much for me. Can anyone give any insight to what
it feels like in the glider? There are plenty of youtube vids, but
they can't show what it feels like.

On 02/08/15 21:37, Caecilius wrote:
But the rest of the flight was fun and when we landed
I'd have gone back up again if I could.

I think you have just answered many of your questions, albeit
indirectly.

Some people feel less afraid if they or their instructor are
"in control" and can explain what's happening.


The winch is much
cheaper, but it looked really scary as an observer: the glider must
have been at a 45 degree angle, and I wonder what the accelleration in
the cockpit would be.

About the same as you get in a high performance car or
motorbike along the ground. When you rotate the speed
is more-or-less constant so there is no acceleration;
it is like sitting in a chair (or bathtub) and rocking
the chair back onto its back legs.


I'd like to try a winch launch, but I'm worried that it may be too
much for me. Can anyone give any insight to what
it feels like in the glider? There are plenty of youtube vids, but
they can't show what it feels like.

Sometimes you hear people screaming all the way up the launch.
The last time I heard that she came down with a big grin
on her face and went straight back up again. YMMV, of course.

Key point: talk to you instructor. Tell them your hopes and fears,
and if you are enjoying/hating something. They are well used to
accommodating all sorts of people on trial flights, and will
adjust the flight accordingly. At my club, not in the SE, there is
zero macho element amongst the instructors; they get their kicks
out of people /enjoying/ their flight.

Talk to people that have just had their first winch launch,
and see what they experienced.

On Sun, 02 Aug 2015 21:37:36 +0100, Caecilius
wrote:

I'm a nervous flyer who spends a lot of time as a commercial aircraft
passenger. My number one anxiety is that freefall feeling when the
plane drops, like you'd get on a rollercoster (I don't like those
either).

[snip]

Caecilius, here's something you might want to try. Get on a roller
coaster, and at the first drop, note what your stomach muscles do:
they probably clench tight. On the next drop, consciously FORCE them
to relax, and I'll bet you find it better. By the end of the ride, you
may feel you've whipped a demon.

rj

Here are links to some articles by Derek Piggott which you might find helpful.
They are focused on student training, but have some good tips for low G sensitivity.

www.glidingcaboolture.org.au/ReducedG.doc

https://groups.google.com/d/topic/re...on/sdjzAVtN6es

On Sun, 02 Aug 2015 21:37:36 +0100, Caecilius wrote:

I'm a nervous flyer who spends a lot of time as a commercial aircraft
passenger. My number one anxiety is that freefall feeling when the plane
drops, like you'd get on a rollercoster (I don't like those either).

As a bet with myself, I bought a trial lesson at my local gliding club
in SE England. It started out with an aerotow to 2000 ft, which had a
bit of the dreaded turbulance (the instructor said "it's been a bit
bumpy all day"). But the rest of the flight was fun and when we landed
I'd have gone back up again if I could.

The turbulence effect has a lot to do with speed. Think racing power
boats slamming into waves versus a sail boat travelling at a similar
speed to the waves: the first goes BAM BAM into the waves while the
sailboat rides over them. Same effect: an airliner at 250+ knots punches
through air movements while a glider at 50-80 knots is slow enough to let
you feel the air movement for what it is and use it to keep the glider in
the air and fly it where you want to go.

Does anyone know if it's possible for people to overcome the fear of
freefall through gliding?

As somebody who, as a schoolboy, went through French Pass (NZ) in a DC3
(Dakota) piston engined airliner below the hilltops and banging up and
down 500 feet in the turbulence while thinking "Ride 'em Cowboy!" while
every sudden drop caused a massed REECCHH to ring round the cabin and
drown out the engines, I couldn't possibly comment!

I'm keen to do some more flying, but I wonder
if my fear will be a barrier for me.

Only you can know that. All I can say is that
(1)at typical gliding speeds the turbulence smooths out and
(2) you'll quickly learn that sequence of sink, cobble stones, surge
upward says you've just found a thermal and now is the time to circle in
it and ride it upwards.

Another question is winch vs aerotow. My local club does both. I did
aerotow, but I saw someone else winch launch. The winch is much
cheaper, but it looked really scary as an observer: the glider must have
been at a 45 degree angle, and I wonder what the accelleration in the
cockpit would be. I'd like to try a winch launch, but I'm worried that
it may be too much for me.

I LOVE winch launching. At first you'll think Bloody Hell, that
ACCELERATES and WTF just happened? Five or six launches later your brain
catches up and you start to follow it through. Most people are flying the
top of the launch after 10-15 launches and are being given control
earlier and earlier until they're flying the whole launch. In my club
you're flying complete winch launches before you're considered good
enough to try landing.

Can anyone give any insight to what it feels
like in the glider?

for the first few, you notice the acceleration and everything seems to
happen too fast to follow, but this quickly passes. After this the
acceleration feels normal and you notice only its lack if the winch isn't
working properly (or your instructor has asked for a power fade).

A winch launch is fast: on our winch you do 0-60 in five seconds (Ferrari
territory) and are off at 1200ft plus after 35 seconds, so things can go
wrong correspondingly fast. However a large part of winch training is to
teach you how to recognise developing problems and deal with them. By the
time you go solo you'll be up to speed on this. And, at my club all
pilots do a winch launch refresher each year to make sure we remain
sharp. This isn't a simple "Can yer still remember how the fly after the
winter layoff" test, but "If I put you in this situation, can you handle
it?".

Side comment: gliding in the UK is a no-blame culture. By this I mean
that nobody is bollocked for owning up to doing something stupid or
damaging something: it is treated as a learning opportunity. The only
crime is to not own up.

There are plenty of youtube vids, but they can't
show what it feels like.

Agreed: you have to do it to understand the sheer YES! of flying a good
launch, contacting and slotting into a thermal and flying up and away.

Re aero tows: a personal view. Most UK training gliders are stable during
a winch launch, but all gliders must be flown very accurately to hold
position behind a tug. I, personally found staying in position behind a
tug much harder than flying a winch launch. In addition, a winch launch
to 1200 ft takes 35 secs, while an aero tow to 2000ft is more like 5
minutes plus of intense concentration. I didn't get an aerotow tow solo
sign-off until I had been solo off the winch for over a year and that
felt about right.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

Personally, I myself feel nervous and uneasy on commercial flights. It doesn't help that any of the elegance and glamour that commercial air travel once had is completely missing today what with the "cram-em-in" cabins and invasive and humiliating security checks one is occasionally submitted to. I've been aviation mad as long as I can remember but was 28 when I finally managed to take my first glider lesson. I involuntarily closed my eyes when we hit little patches of sink on tow (and the reduced G was really no worse than that in an elevator starting down) but asked the instructor to do a sharp stall and found I could handle it. By the time we got to doing full spins in the Blanik I was absolutely loving everything about flying. I remember wishing I could do spins more because A: they were fun and B: unlike the circuit and landing they were pretty simple to perform. That was 1998. I've got nearly 1300 hours now and just came down from a great wave flight in an ASW-15B where I repeatedly got to 12,500" (limited by airspace where I fly) and was having a blast running at near maneuvering speed for long straight glides north, south, east and west of the home field. I've only had the opportunity to take a winch launch once but I actually found it a thoroughly enjoyable experience.

I can't guarantee that you will have as little trouble with nervousness as I did once I actually got into soaring for real but there's certainly a very good chance that you'll be fine. Just remember that soaring can easily turn into an addiction or obsession so be prepared to spend a lot of time - and money - doing it. If you live in an area where there is a definite "soaring season" and they don't fly for the four or five winter months be prepared for withdrawal symptoms unless you're well off enough to travel to somewhere where they do operate during that time period. Man, I wish I had enough money to spend my winters in Omarama!

Originally Posted by Caecilius

I'm a nervous flyer who spends a lot of time as a commercial aircraft
passenger. My number one anxiety is that freefall feeling when the
plane drops, like you'd get on a rollercoster (I don't like those
either).

As a bet with myself, I bought a trial lesson at my local gliding club
in SE England. It started out with an aerotow to 2000 ft, which had a
bit of the dreaded turbulance (the instructor said "it's been a bit
bumpy all day"). But the rest of the flight was fun and when we landed
I'd have gone back up again if I could.

Does anyone know if it's possible for people to overcome the fear of
freefall through gliding? I'm keen to do some more flying, but I
wonder if my fear will be a barrier for me.

Another question is winch vs aerotow. My local club does both. I did
aerotow, but I saw someone else winch launch. The winch is much
cheaper, but it looked really scary as an observer: the glider must
have been at a 45 degree angle, and I wonder what the accelleration in
the cockpit would be. I'd like to try a winch launch, but I'm worried
that it may be too much for me. Can anyone give any insight to what
it feels like in the glider? There are plenty of youtube vids, but
they can't show what it feels like.

Things might be different for you based on what fears and feeling you encounter, but here's my take:

First, I have a fear of falling. You will not find me going up a ladder to put up Christmas lights, nor do you find me hiking to the edge of mountains. Therefore I do not go on the drop rides at amusement parks either....

Yet I fly a Pilatus B4, and I like to do tail slides and have fun pitching over 180 degrees, swinging back before stabilizing straight down, then pulling back to level. But I am in control, strapped in, etc, so it doesn't bother me at all, and neither does any other maneuver. While going out soaring, I rarely fee any hard drops like you do on airliners, but I am an east coast US flyer. I experience more kicks UP than drops down. Love soaring.

I think as others have said, if you are in charge, flying the ship, loving the great visibility, you'll have no issues.

Squeak

On Sun, 02 Aug 2015 21:37:36 +0100, Caecilius
wrote:

I'm a nervous flyer who spends a lot of time as a commercial aircraft
passenger. My number one anxiety is that freefall feeling when the
plane drops, like you'd get on a rollercoster (I don't like those
either).

[snip]


Many thanks to everyone who replied. Your comments have been very
useful.

The reduced G document links from Glider RN were especially useful:
they are talking about exactly the feeling I dislike, and it's good to
hear that I'm not alone and that there are people worse than me (I
don't think I'd freeze up).

The winch launch details are useful as well. 0-60 in 5 seconds sounds
like doing the quarter mile at santa pod (a UK drag strip) as a
passenger: scary, but bearable.

I think I'll have to have a few more trys at this, and perhaps the
club will let me help out a bit with some of the unskilled work so I
can watch and pick up things gradually.

On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 4:37:40 PM UTC-4, Caecilius wrote:
I'm a nervous flyer who spends a lot of time as a commercial aircraft
passenger. My number one anxiety is that freefall feeling when the
plane drops, like you'd get on a rollercoster (I don't like those
either).

One thing not mentioned by other respondents:
Make sure your seat-belts are TIGHT.
Then wriggle around a bit and tighten again.
Tight belts will make any reduced-G sensation MUCH less uncomfortable.

Have Fun!

Am Montag, 3. August 2015 14:43:04 UTC+2 schrieb Squeaky:

First, I have a fear of falling. You will not find me going up a ladder
to put up Christmas lights, nor do you find me hiking to the edge of
mountains. Therefore I do not go on the drop rides at amusement parks
either....

Similar thing here - no ladders & I hate see-through stairways.

I started gliding late (29 yrs) and in a foreign language so I learnt German & flying at the same time. Flying was far easier...

In the meantime I have over 1200 hours & fly a pretty good 18m glider (plus passengers in club 2-seaters)...