Plastic Interior Parts?

O.K. With the new seat belts on order and the pending order of the
carpet, wall kit, and seat covers, the last 2 items are the headliner
and the window surround plastic. The headliner is in good shape with
only a slight variation in the color here and there. I will do the "Kiwi
shoe polish trick" for that. Last part (aside from painting the seat
frames) is the plastic. Yes, I already looked at Plane Plastics and
Vantage. Totally, absolutely, criminally outrageous pricing. Ten buck
parts selling for two hundred dollars. Even with the "airplane"
surcharge, an entire Piper remake should only cost about $200. There
ain't any certification, tracking, insurance, or other "excuse" for
these prices.

Any other suppliers out there that are not smoking crack? If not, I will
take them out, repair the one or 2 cracks, paint them, and put 'em back
in. 5 hours labor, 1 $4 can of white plastic spray paint, a dab of
epoxy, and a couple dozen new chrome #6 screws and finishing washers.
Even if I price my time at $100/hour, it is still WAY less expensive
than what these pirates want.

Thanks,
Mike

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That's what we did Mike, with our 172..

The paint to use is called SEM, designed for painting plastic. We HAD
to buy one peice ($$$$) - cause most of it was missing...

We get compliments on our interior all the time.

Total cost was about $300 CDN, including the 175 dollar new part...

We repaired the cracks by epoxying fiberglass cloth reinforcement on
the back, finished with autobody filler/putty and painted.

Dave

On 27 Mar 2005 13:30:13 GMT, Mike Spera wrote:

O.K. With the new seat belts on order and the pending order of the
carpet, wall kit, and seat covers, the last 2 items are the headliner
and the window surround plastic. The headliner is in good shape with
only a slight variation in the color here and there. I will do the "Kiwi
shoe polish trick" for that. Last part (aside from painting the seat
frames) is the plastic. Yes, I already looked at Plane Plastics and
Vantage. Totally, absolutely, criminally outrageous pricing. Ten buck
parts selling for two hundred dollars. Even with the "airplane"
surcharge, an entire Piper remake should only cost about $200. There
ain't any certification, tracking, insurance, or other "excuse" for
these prices.

Any other suppliers out there that are not smoking crack? If not, I will
take them out, repair the one or 2 cracks, paint them, and put 'em back
in. 5 hours labor, 1 $4 can of white plastic spray paint, a dab of
epoxy, and a couple dozen new chrome #6 screws and finishing washers.
Even if I price my time at $100/hour, it is still WAY less expensive
than what these pirates want.

Thanks,
Mike

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Airplane parts arent alway expensive because of certification, it's the
limited demand that makes them pricey.

"Mike Spera" wrote in message
...
O.K. With the new seat belts on order and the pending order of the
carpet, wall kit, and seat covers, the last 2 items are the headliner
and the window surround plastic. The headliner is in good shape with
only a slight variation in the color here and there. I will do the "Kiwi
shoe polish trick" for that. Last part (aside from painting the seat
frames) is the plastic. Yes, I already looked at Plane Plastics and
Vantage. Totally, absolutely, criminally outrageous pricing. Ten buck
parts selling for two hundred dollars. Even with the "airplane"
surcharge, an entire Piper remake should only cost about $200. There
ain't any certification, tracking, insurance, or other "excuse" for
these prices.

Any other suppliers out there that are not smoking crack? If not, I will
take them out, repair the one or 2 cracks, paint them, and put 'em back
in. 5 hours labor, 1 $4 can of white plastic spray paint, a dab of
epoxy, and a couple dozen new chrome #6 screws and finishing washers.
Even if I price my time at $100/hour, it is still WAY less expensive
than what these pirates want.

Thanks,
Mike


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I second what Dave said about SEM paints. They are great. For fixing cracks,
or missing pieces, you might want to try the fiberglass/epoxy/silk approach
(all these materials are available in hobby stores, etc). Time consuming,
but cheaper than new parts.

When I did the interior of my Seneca, the one part I didn't do was to
replace the overhead airt vent outlets. $550 EACH!
"Mike Spera" wrote in message
...
O.K. With the new seat belts on order and the pending order of the
carpet, wall kit, and seat covers, the last 2 items are the headliner
and the window surround plastic. The headliner is in good shape with
only a slight variation in the color here and there. I will do the "Kiwi
shoe polish trick" for that. Last part (aside from painting the seat
frames) is the plastic. Yes, I already looked at Plane Plastics and
Vantage. Totally, absolutely, criminally outrageous pricing. Ten buck
parts selling for two hundred dollars. Even with the "airplane"
surcharge, an entire Piper remake should only cost about $200. There
ain't any certification, tracking, insurance, or other "excuse" for
these prices.

Any other suppliers out there that are not smoking crack? If not, I will
take them out, repair the one or 2 cracks, paint them, and put 'em back
in. 5 hours labor, 1 $4 can of white plastic spray paint, a dab of
epoxy, and a couple dozen new chrome #6 screws and finishing washers.
Even if I price my time at $100/hour, it is still WAY less expensive
than what these pirates want.

Thanks,
Mike


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___
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I feel your pain. We just placed an order with Plane Parts for some
interior items for our Arrow. One overhead vent console, 2 louvered vents,
4 floor vent cups, one floor rib cover. Total cost: $333.60 plus shipping.

But the reason the cost is so high isn't just (or even primarily) the
"aviation surcharge". Its the exceedingly low volume in which these parts
are produced. Take the overhead console, for example. Plane Parts may sell
just one or two per month of the particular part we needed. Yet, to design
and make the tooling they need to produce the part may have cost several
thousand dollars.

And have you priced automotive plastic parts lately? The headlamp lens for
a typical car may cost well over a hundred bucks. If it's a Mercedes the
price may be several hundred.

--
-Elliott Drucker

OK..... I will fess up!

All the materials used (except the SEM paint) came from a hobby
workshop that is prolific in the production of Radio Control model
Aircraft...

(mine)

Dave


On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 11:02:52 -0500, "tom418"
wrote:

I second what Dave said about SEM paints. They are great. For fixing cracks,
or missing pieces, you might want to try the fiberglass/epoxy/silk approach
(all these materials are available in hobby stores, etc). Time consuming,
but cheaper than new parts.

Intellectually, I know that the low volume radically affects the
economics, but it really is hard to get over. When I think back on what
it costs to have an injection mold made... well they ARE really
expensive. Also, given the HUNDREDS of little bits and pieces needed for
all these planes and models, each requiring a different mold. O.K.

I'm over it (I'm still going to repaint the old stuff!!!).

As for automotive plastic, I usually buy aftermarket. Most of it is
pretty good.

Mike



wrote:

I feel your pain. We just placed an order with Plane Parts for some
interior items for our Arrow. One overhead vent console, 2 louvered vents,
4 floor vent cups, one floor rib cover. Total cost: $333.60 plus shipping.

But the reason the cost is so high isn't just (or even primarily) the
"aviation surcharge". Its the exceedingly low volume in which these parts
are produced. Take the overhead console, for example. Plane Parts may sell
just one or two per month of the particular part we needed. Yet, to design
and make the tooling they need to produce the part may have cost several
thousand dollars.

And have you priced automotive plastic parts lately? The headlamp lens for
a typical car may cost well over a hundred bucks. If it's a Mercedes the
price may be several hundred.


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"Mike Spera" wrote in message
...
Yes, I already looked at Plane Plastics and
Vantage. Totally, absolutely, criminally outrageous pricing. Ten buck
parts selling for two hundred dollars. Even with the "airplane" surcharge,
an entire Piper remake should only cost about $200. There ain't any
certification, tracking, insurance, or other "excuse" for these prices.

Well Mike, I see we disagree.
First I take exception to the term PIRATE.
(but Pirate Plastics would be a cool name )
I manufacture low volume plastic parts for a living.
So lets look at a few things.

Tool amortization............I own the tools to make the parts,l they aren't
cheap.
Machine amortization......I own the capital equipment to make the parts,
they aren't cheap
LABOR.........................I have the skilled people who make the parts.
People aren't cheap
Overhead.......................I get to pay all the taxes, utility, rent,
advertising and ALL the other costs.
Material cost..................Plastic is "solid oil" it isn't cheap. I've
seen 2 price increases this year alone
the first was 21.5% the second was ONLY
15%
PMA compliance costs.... I get to reverse engineer and create a drawing for
EACH PART, PROVE IT FITS to the local MIDO guys, have it added to my PMA
supplement, specify the material used, identify the vendor of the material,
maintain lot tracability, comply with the Fastener Quality Act, cockpit
flammability standards, VOC emission limits from the EPA and solid waste
regulatory folks. I get to maintain a Quality Program and have everything in
order for periodic inspections by the MIDO guys.

THEN I GET TO ADD PROFIT and watch people complain about why stuff costs
what it does.

Scott.

THEN I GET TO ADD PROFIT and watch people complain about why stuff costs
what it does.

Ah, welcome to the business world. :-)

I, for one, am VERY thankful that you guys are out there making these parts.
If we had to rely on Piper (for example), we'd be paying exponentially
more -- and they'd be just as crappy as the originals.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Ditto! Some day soon, our plane will need a few of those $200 each window
surround moldings. I'm not looking forward to the day and I'll do
everything possible to put it off as long as possible. I'm just thankful
that you CAN add a profit to your parts and are able to stay in business.
Think of what would happen if Wal Mart suddenly started carrying them and
demanded that you cut your prices down to unprofitable levels. Just ask me
how I know, but give me the chance to have a few beers before you want me to
respond.
Jim