Would this plane have flown?

http://www.thegaryhouse.com/aircraftdamage/

I was down in a remote area of Mexico this last weekend and a truck
backed into my aileron. I was lucky that the driver had a sat phone and
I was able to call an A&P to come down to Mexico and swap it for me.
However, all the local pilots, and the A&P who came down seemed to
think it would have flown ok as was. From a simply academic point of
view I"m curious what you guys think.

-Robert

("Robert M. Gary" wrote)
http://www.thegaryhouse.com/aircraftdamage/


I wonder how the damaged aileron would have reacted to slow flight vs. a
little speed ...better or worse?


Montblack
Don't show your pics to a B-17 crew member. :-)

yes.

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
oups.com...
http://www.thegaryhouse.com/aircraftdamage/

I was down in a remote area of Mexico this last weekend and a truck
backed into my aileron. I was lucky that the driver had a sat phone and
I was able to call an A&P to come down to Mexico and swap it for me.
However, all the local pilots, and the A&P who came down seemed to
think it would have flown ok as was. From a simply academic point of
view I"m curious what you guys think.

-Robert

Just looking at the photo, I would have been concerned about the outer
attach point for possible post impact misalignment that might under load
cause an issue, but that being said, I've flown prop fighters on ferry
permits that looked worse off than this.
The bottom line is that you had a known damaged airframe and a take off
decision to make that involved a go/no go without looking inside the aileron
for hidden damage.
If the guys that won't be in the airplane are right, and you don't have a
problem, you're gold. If on the other hand, if the guys not going in the
airplane are wrong, and you do have a problem.........well......they're not
in the airplane......and you might be dead!
My decision would have been to have it looked at before I flew it out.
Dudley Henriques

"Robert M. Gary" wrote:

http://www.thegaryhouse.com/aircraftdamage/

I was down in a remote area of Mexico this last weekend and a truck
backed into my aileron. I was lucky that the driver had a sat phone and
I was able to call an A&P to come down to Mexico and swap it for me.
However, all the local pilots, and the A&P who came down seemed to
think it would have flown ok as was. From a simply academic point of
view I"m curious what you guys think.

Most likely it would have flown fine--perhaps a bit out of trim.

The question one has to ask oneself in such situations is "do I really want
to be a test pilot?"

It is not impossible that the deformed control surface would have fluttered,
with possibly disastrous results.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
oups.com...
http://www.thegaryhouse.com/aircraftdamage/

I was down in a remote area of Mexico this last weekend and a truck
backed into my aileron. I was lucky that the driver had a sat phone and
I was able to call an A&P to come down to Mexico and swap it for me.
However, all the local pilots, and the A&P who came down seemed to
think it would have flown ok as was. From a simply academic point of
view I"m curious what you guys think.

-Robert



I think it would have done OK!

"Dudley Henriques" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
oups.com...
http://www.thegaryhouse.com/aircraftdamage/

I was down in a remote area of Mexico this last weekend and a truck
backed into my aileron. I was lucky that the driver had a sat phone and
I was able to call an A&P to come down to Mexico and swap it for me.
However, all the local pilots, and the A&P who came down seemed to
think it would have flown ok as was. From a simply academic point of
view I"m curious what you guys think.

-Robert

Just looking at the photo, I would have been concerned about the outer
attach point for possible post impact misalignment that might under load
cause an issue, but that being said, I've flown prop fighters on ferry
permits that looked worse off than this.
The bottom line is that you had a known damaged airframe and a take off
decision to make that involved a go/no go without looking inside the
aileron
for hidden damage.
If the guys that won't be in the airplane are right, and you don't have a
problem, you're gold. If on the other hand, if the guys not going in the
airplane are wrong, and you do have a problem.........well......they're
not
in the airplane......and you might be dead!
My decision would have been to have it looked at before I flew it out.
Dudley Henriques

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
oups.com...
[...]
However, all the local pilots, and the A&P who came down seemed to
think it would have flown ok as was. From a simply academic point of
view I"m curious what you guys think.

Playing the odds, sure...pretty good chance it would've flown, and probably
with very little noticeable effect. But there's no way to know for sure,
short of a test flight. It could've been quite bad.

Also, while it's not clear the A&P who came to fix it bothered to check, I
would always be concerned at hidden damage. A relatively small force at the
wingtip can exert a much higher force closer to the fuselage, and of course
even out there at the wingtip who knows how the force of the impact was
transmitted through the airframe. I would be less concerned about the
damage to the aileron (which appears to be mostly cosmetic), and more about
potential damage elsewhere.

The classic rule applies: "when in doubt..."

Pete

My guess is yes - but seriously out of trim for sure. I'd do an empty
trip around the pattern for evaluation. Assuming the handling is
tolerable, load up but keep the speed down.

This is a case where it is really not correct to simply rely on an A&P
mechanic for such a decision. The training they receive doesn't really
include the consequences of aerodynamic variences although their
experience may be very valuable. It really is a situation where the
judgements and experiences of other pilots etc is as valid as any A&P
could give. I definitely don't want to put A&Ps down, but they don't
walk on water - they are only human in their ability to evaluate.

The damage appears to be confined to the trailing edge of
the aileron, so it would be out of trim. But the
reflections and paint otherwise look straight and
unwrinkled. A ferry permit could be issued for such a
condition and an inspection for range of motion, security,
etc signed of by an A mechanic and of course it would be
finally up to the pilot whether to fly. I would not want to
fly it IFR, most ferry permits only allow Day/VFR.

Since the wing looks good at the tip/aileron area, I'd also
want to see the wing attach points since the strength of the
wing and its lever arm would have a lot of force applied to
the spar points. I'd look for wrinkles, cracked paint along
the fuselage. I'd still look that over, just changing the
aileron doesn't complete the inspection.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Dudley Henriques" wrote in
message
ink.net...
|
| "Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
|
oups.com...
| http://www.thegaryhouse.com/aircraftdamage/
|
| I was down in a remote area of Mexico this last weekend
and a truck
| backed into my aileron. I was lucky that the driver had
a sat phone and
| I was able to call an A&P to come down to Mexico and
swap it for me.
| However, all the local pilots, and the A&P who came down
seemed to
| think it would have flown ok as was. From a simply
academic point of
| view I"m curious what you guys think.
|
| -Robert
|
| Just looking at the photo, I would have been concerned
about the outer
| attach point for possible post impact misalignment that
might under load
| cause an issue, but that being said, I've flown prop
fighters on ferry
| permits that looked worse off than this.
| The bottom line is that you had a known damaged airframe
and a take off
| decision to make that involved a go/no go without looking
inside the aileron
| for hidden damage.
| If the guys that won't be in the airplane are right, and
you don't have a
| problem, you're gold. If on the other hand, if the guys
not going in the
| airplane are wrong, and you do have a
problem.........well......they're not
| in the airplane......and you might be dead!
| My decision would have been to have it looked at before I
flew it out.
| Dudley Henriques
|
|