Insuring a Columbia 400 & weekend only insurance

Question for insurance experts -

Insurance for the Columbia 400 is absurdly high compared to other
similar aircraft, presumably because the premiums are loaded due to
lack of significant statistics. Any idea how long potential Columbia
buyers can expect to wait for the premium to stabilize?

Can anyone recommend an insurance provider who would be willing to
discount infrequent flying, like someone who would only need to carry
insurance Friday, Saturday, and Sunday?

--
PM instructions: Caesar cipher the alpha characters in my address
using +3 as the key.

"Justin Gombos" wrote in message
news:9ciii.7426$bh5.1466@trndny01...
Question for insurance experts -

Insurance for the Columbia 400 is absurdly high compared to other
similar aircraft, presumably because the premiums are loaded due to
lack of significant statistics.

What have you been quoted, and by whom?

Any idea how long potential Columbia
buyers can expect to wait for the premium to stabilize?

Considering that the 400 has been on the market now for four years or more,
and has about 800 in the field, and has had three accidents (all CFIT), it
seems someone seeling is making lame excuses.

Can anyone recommend an insurance provider who would be willing to
discount infrequent flying, like someone who would only need to carry
insurance Friday, Saturday, and Sunday?

Nope. AAMOF, as a infrequent flyer, you're going to pay more. MUCH more.
Particularly with a high performance aircraft.

Have 3000+ hours, an IR, and fly 300+ hours a year and your rate will go WAY
down.


--
Matt Barrow
Performance Homes, LLC.
Cheyenne, WY

On Jul 2, 7:08 pm, Justin Gombos wrote:
Question for insurance experts -

Insurance for the Columbia 400 is absurdly high compared to other
similar aircraft, presumably because the premiums are loaded due to
lack of significant statistics. Any idea how long potential Columbia
buyers can expect to wait for the premium to stabilize?

Can anyone recommend an insurance provider who would be willing to
discount infrequent flying, like someone who would only need to carry
insurance Friday, Saturday, and Sunday?

You'll need to fly a lot more than that to get an insurance break.

-Robert

Robert M. Gary wrote:
On Jul 2, 7:08 pm, Justin Gombos wrote:
Question for insurance experts -

Insurance for the Columbia 400 is absurdly high compared to other
similar aircraft, presumably because the premiums are loaded due to
lack of significant statistics. Any idea how long potential Columbia
buyers can expect to wait for the premium to stabilize?

Can anyone recommend an insurance provider who would be willing to
discount infrequent flying, like someone who would only need to carry
insurance Friday, Saturday, and Sunday?

You'll need to fly a lot more than that to get an insurance break.

-Robert

I also doubt you are going to find a carrier that would be willing to start
a policy every Friday and end it on Sunday.

Ouch. Let's use Matt's number and think about insurance rates. There
are 800 hulls in the field, introduced 4 years ago. So say on average
400 hulls over 4 years.

Three crashed. So 4 years of premiums for 400 hulls has got to cover
everything, including the payout for the three crashes. I'm sure it
was more, but if you say each payout was a million dollars, 3 millions
would have to be spread over 1600 policy years That's almost $2000
each, right there.

I made lots of assumptions, of course. Make your own, and see what you
get.

Tina
On Jul 2, 10:08 pm, Justin Gombos
wrote:
Question for insurance experts -

Insurance for the Columbia 400 is absurdly high compared to other
similar aircraft, presumably because the premiums are loaded due to
lack of significant statistics. Any idea how long potential Columbia
buyers can expect to wait for the premium to stabilize?

Can anyone recommend an insurance provider who would be willing to
discount infrequent flying, like someone who would only need to carry
insurance Friday, Saturday, and Sunday?

--
PM instructions: Caesar cipher the alpha characters in my address
using +3 as the key.

wrote in message
ups.com...
Ouch. Let's use Matt's number and think about insurance rates. There
are 800 hulls in the field, introduced 4 years ago. So say on average
400 hulls over 4 years.

Three crashed. So 4 years of premiums for 400 hulls has got to cover
everything, including the payout for the three crashes. I'm sure it
was more, but if you say each payout was a million dollars, 3 millions
would have to be spread over 1600 policy years That's almost $2000
each, right there.

Actually, I made a mistake: one of those three was a COL350, there's a bunch
more of those, plus the 300's, and the insurance would be based, I assume,
over the Columbia line which numbers in the thousands. I'm not sure if the
300/350/400 series is assessed as a single type.

In the Columbia line (seperae from the Lancair kits), from what I can see,
there's not been one accident from loss of control. That's rather
interesting given the Columbia high wing loading.

One thing is that the COL400 prices out at $550-600K so you're insurance
would be higher just from that. Compared to a new A36 or Mooney, their
accident history is much better. I'm not sure how the safety features would
figure in, but the Columbia's have numerous features compared to the A36 and
Mooneys.

I made lots of assumptions, of course. Make your own, and see what you
get.

Tina
On Jul 2, 10:08 pm, Justin Gombos
wrote:
Question for insurance experts -

Insurance for the Columbia 400 is absurdly high compared to other
similar aircraft, presumably because the premiums are loaded due to
lack of significant statistics. Any idea how long potential Columbia
buyers can expect to wait for the premium to stabilize?

Can anyone recommend an insurance provider who would be willing to
discount infrequent flying, like someone who would only need to carry
insurance Friday, Saturday, and Sunday?

--
PM instructions: Caesar cipher the alpha characters in my address
using +3 as the key.

In article ,
"Matt Barrow" wrote:

Actually, I made a mistake: one of those three was a COL350, there's a bunch
more of those, plus the 300's, and the insurance would be based, I assume,
over the Columbia line which numbers in the thousands. I'm not sure if the
300/350/400 series is assessed as a single type.

Reference material:

http://www.gama.aero/dloads/2006GAMA...alDatabook.pdf

"john smith" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Matt Barrow" wrote:

Actually, I made a mistake: one of those three was a COL350, there's a
bunch
more of those, plus the 300's, and the insurance would be based, I
assume,
over the Columbia line which numbers in the thousands. I'm not sure if
the
300/350/400 series is assessed as a single type.

Reference material:

http://www.gama.aero/dloads/2006GAMA...alDatabook.pdf

Thanks, but I'm not really into 'Trivia Pursuit'.

"john smith" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Matt Barrow" wrote:

Actually, I made a mistake: one of those three was a COL350, there's a
bunch
more of those, plus the 300's, and the insurance would be based, I
assume,
over the Columbia line which numbers in the thousands. I'm not sure if
the
300/350/400 series is assessed as a single type.

Reference material:

http://www.gama.aero/dloads/2006GAMA...alDatabook.pdf

Thanks...interesting (and shows what happens when to make generalizations
:~( )

They don't include Lancairs, which has been maknig kit planes, using the
same basic design since at least the early 90's. MOF, the distinction
forced them to change the name to Columbia. That was rather the point I was
trying to make. Bad move on my part.

Also, that may or may not be a factor in how insurance is priced.
Overwhelmingly, the insurance is going to be a factor of the pilot, not the
aircraft. Unless the aircraft has particular characteristics, such as a
converted military aircraft, I doubt (could be wrong) the insurance cost is
going to be unusual.

In the context of the original post (boy, has this group got the tendancy to
go off on tangents!) it was a pilot flying VERY FEW hours each month in an
aircraft that goes over a half-million $$$, complaining about the cost of
insurance. He never did come back with the numbers for the "comparable"
aircraft price quotes. He also didn't answer whether he had an IR (that make
a HUGH difference), nor how much TT he had.

In article ,
"Matt Barrow" wrote:

"john smith" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Matt Barrow" wrote:

Actually, I made a mistake: one of those three was a COL350, there's a
bunch
more of those, plus the 300's, and the insurance would be based, I
assume,
over the Columbia line which numbers in the thousands. I'm not sure if
the
300/350/400 series is assessed as a single type.

Reference material:

http://www.gama.aero/dloads/2006GAMA...alDatabook.pdf

Thanks, but I'm not really into 'Trivia Pursuit'.

It isn't.
It provides the number of aircraft/make/models built by the various
manufacturers. It tells how many 300's, 350's and 400's were made.
Through the end of 2006...
300's - 75
350's - 124
400's - 286
Total Columbia aircraft produced since 1995 -2006 is 485.
Where did you get the "thousands" number?