ping Dan Thomas/weird crashes.

I'm wondering about foul-play going on here,
http://canadianpress.google.com/arti...KW6KPMty3h8HjQ

When his dad crashed a few months ago it was big
news cuz a little girl survived, but now he crashes with
a really strange debris field.

It's really strange to me.
Ken

Piper Malibu down east of Edmonton 5 sob

FYI

http://news.google.ca/nwshp?hl=en&ta...577933&topic=h

http://discussions.flightaware.com/v...?p=47890#47890

http://www.aviation.ca/component/opt...4184/catid,55/

Condolences to family & friends.

"Ken S. Tucker" wrote in message
...
I'm wondering about foul-play going on here,
http://canadianpress.google.com/arti...KW6KPMty3h8HjQ

When his dad crashed a few months ago it was big
news cuz a little girl survived, but now he crashes with
a really strange debris field.

It's really strange to me.
Ken

Foul play, that would be insane, more like a CSI episode than real life.

On Mar 28, 8:27 pm, "Ken S. Tucker" wrote:
I'm wondering about foul-play going on here,http://canadianpress.google.com/arti...os2CRKW6KPMty3...

When his dad crashed a few months ago it was big
news cuz a little girl survived, but now he crashes with
a really strange debris field.

It's really strange to me.
Ken

No real idea. It's about 100 nm Northeast of us, and we had
snow at the time. I would think the pilot was IFR certified if he was
flying a jetprop like that one. The way the radar track jiggles around
yet maintains a steady track toward their destination,, and the fact
that the pilot told ATC that they had technical problems, there might
have been some structural issue involved. Beyond that, I can't
speculate. A large debris field suggests inflight breakup.
Bad for the families involved, especially the pilot's family,
who lost members in another crash last fall.

Dan

On Mar 29, 1:03*am, "Private" wrote:
Piper Malibu down east of Edmonton 5 sob

FYI

http://news.google.ca/nwshp?hl=en&ta...577933&topic=h

http://discussions.flightaware.com/v...?p=47890#47890

http://www.aviation.ca/component/opt...temid,306/func...

Condolences to family & friends.

The pic that is posted on the Flightaware site is interesting. Is
shows an almost complete cockpit with very little damage. Too bad
these guys couldn't have hit a 20 foot deep pile of fluffy powder
snow. They might have survived...

Godspeed to all involved..

Ben

On Mar 29, 3:22 pm, " wrote:
On Mar 29, 1:03 am, "Private" wrote:

Piper Malibu down east of Edmonton 5 sob

FYI

http://news.google.ca/nwshp?hl=en&ta...577933&topic=h

http://discussions.flightaware.com/v...?p=47890#47890

http://www.aviation.ca/component/opt...temid,306/func...

Condolences to family & friends.

The pic that is posted on the Flightaware site is interesting. Is
shows an almost complete cockpit with very little damage. Too bad
these guys couldn't have hit a 20 foot deep pile of fluffy powder
snow. They might have survived...

Godspeed to all involved..

Ben

On the news a few minutes ago, the TSB guys indicated that it had
been an inflight breakup. That can be caused by several factors,
including spiralling out of control, severe turbulence, or some pre-
existing flaw leading to structural failure. It will take the
investigators some time to figure it out, and even then they're
sometimes not sure. I won't speculate further, but will say that
inflight structural failure is one of the things that scares me most;
the other is a midair collision. I pay a lot of attention to the
structural inspections of our aircraft, and have my eyeballs all over
the place when VFR.
Deep snow wouldn't help much if it was an inflight breakup. Most
frequent failures involve the tail, and an airplane will stick its
nose straight down if the stab departs.

Dan

"Ken S. Tucker" wrote in
:

I'm wondering about foul-play going on here,
http://canadianpress.google.com/arti...s2CRKW6KPMty3h
8
HjQ

When his dad crashed a few months ago it was big
news cuz a little girl survived, but now he crashes with
a really strange debris field.

It's really strange to me.
Ken


Why don't you go buy one. Or you could nmake one out of paper.

Then you could go and try and duplicate it!



Bertie

On Mar 29, 5:37 pm, wrote:
On Mar 29, 3:22 pm, " wrote:



On Mar 29, 1:03 am, "Private" wrote:

Piper Malibu down east of Edmonton 5 sob

FYI

http://news.google.ca/nwshp?hl=en&ta...577933&topic=h

http://discussions.flightaware.com/v...?p=47890#47890

http://www.aviation.ca/component/opt...temid,306/func...

Condolences to family & friends.

The pic that is posted on the Flightaware site is interesting. Is
shows an almost complete cockpit with very little damage. Too bad
these guys couldn't have hit a 20 foot deep pile of fluffy powder
snow. They might have survived...

Godspeed to all involved..

Ben

On the news a few minutes ago, the TSB guys indicated that it had
been an inflight breakup. That can be caused by several factors,
including spiralling out of control, severe turbulence, or some pre-
existing flaw leading to structural failure. It will take the
investigators some time to figure it out, and even then they're
sometimes not sure. I won't speculate further, but will say that
inflight structural failure is one of the things that scares me most;
the other is a midair collision. I pay a lot of attention to the
structural inspections of our aircraft, and have my eyeballs all over
the place when VFR.
Deep snow wouldn't help much if it was an inflight breakup. Most
frequent failures involve the tail, and an airplane will stick its
nose straight down if the stab departs.

Dan

http://www.canada.com/globaltv/natio...7adfa6&k=54326

On Mar 30, 9:04 am, wrote:
On Mar 29, 5:37 pm, wrote:



On Mar 29, 3:22 pm, " wrote:

On Mar 29, 1:03 am, "Private" wrote:

Piper Malibu down east of Edmonton 5 sob

FYI

http://news.google.ca/nwshp?hl=en&ta...577933&topic=h

http://discussions.flightaware.com/v...?p=47890#47890

http://www.aviation.ca/component/opt...temid,306/func...

Condolences to family & friends.

The pic that is posted on the Flightaware site is interesting. Is
shows an almost complete cockpit with very little damage. Too bad
these guys couldn't have hit a 20 foot deep pile of fluffy powder
snow. They might have survived...

Godspeed to all involved..

Ben

On the news a few minutes ago, the TSB guys indicated that it had
been an inflight breakup. That can be caused by several factors,
including spiralling out of control, severe turbulence, or some pre-
existing flaw leading to structural failure. It will take the
investigators some time to figure it out, and even then they're
sometimes not sure. I won't speculate further, but will say that
inflight structural failure is one of the things that scares me most;
the other is a midair collision. I pay a lot of attention to the
structural inspections of our aircraft, and have my eyeballs all over
the place when VFR.
Deep snow wouldn't help much if it was an inflight breakup. Most
frequent failures involve the tail, and an airplane will stick its
nose straight down if the stab departs.

Dan

http://www.canada.com/globaltv/natio...ce7fefa-920d-4...

Thanks Dan, (tears aside).
"Dean Braithwaite, chief flight instructor at the Edmonton Flying
Club"
sounds good in that ref.
We've recently discussed the importance of the Artificial
Horizon in this group,

Maybe the pilot ascended above 12500, that can **** up
judgement, went spiral dive (blam) and blamed the AH,
for judgement error. The debris field indicates an aircraft
structural anomally at high altitude.

My GUESS is he was trying to ascend above the weather,
did a stall in lowered air density, converted to a spiral dive,
that shattered the a/c in a few hundred feet at fairly high
altitude.
In a spiral dive the a/c is using gravity to accelerate, it's
like jumping off a building and it comes on fast.

Every pilot must know when he's in a spiral dive and
how to correct it.
Hard input will shatter the a/c, especially if IAS is near
red line, which happens quickly, so be gentle.

In my experience, gentle application of elevator with
reverse aileron is ok. However, jerking the elevator
can snug the turn and exceed the g-rating, specially
if the airlerons are used inappropriately.
I'd like to hear an expert opinion.
Ken

On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 17:14:05 -0700 (PDT), "Ken S. Tucker"
wrote:


Maybe the pilot ascended above 12500, that can **** up
judgement, went spiral dive (blam) and blamed the AH,
for judgement error

Malibu is pressurized, horn goes off with cabin alt over 10K.