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#1
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P-3 and AIM-9
As a young sailor (some 30+ years ago) I flew in the back of an EP-3B 'Batrack' aicraft of VQ-1. Years later, I read of the story of the two P-3As that were converted to EP-3Bs in the 1960s.
The story is that they were CIA-operated out of Taiwan, Germany, etc. with a number of modifications for intelligence collection and agent dropping and various skullduggery. When the CIA was done (by 1968) they were modified into the Navy first reconnaissance EP-3s. One intriguing part was that they were supposedly fitted with rear-firing AIM-9 Sidewinders on wing pylons. To discourage MiGs while engaged in overflights... This sounds a bit far-fetched to me...has anyone heard of such a thing? |
#2
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Larry,
I heard the same stories you did (30 years ago or so, I'm a retired AW), and I haven't been able to find anything that verifies the story. Even some of the guys I knew flying in the "spookier" P-3s, that I knew for years wouldn't verify anything. Don McIntyre Clarksville, TN |
#3
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"Keith W" wrote in message | "Larry Cauble" wrote in | message .. . || || As a young sailor (some 30+ years ago) I flew in the back of an EP-3B || 'Batrack' aicraft of VQ-1. Years later, I read of the story of the || two P-3As that were converted to EP-3Bs in the 1960s. || || The story is that they were CIA-operated out of Taiwan, Germany, etc. || with a number of modifications for intelligence collection and agent || dropping and various skullduggery. When the CIA was done (by 1968) || they were modified into the Navy first reconnaissance EP-3s. || || One intriguing part was that they were supposedly fitted with || rear-firing AIM-9 Sidewinders on wing pylons. To discourage MiGs || while engaged in overflights... || || This sounds a bit far-fetched to me...has anyone heard of such a || thing? || | | Its not that far fetched, the RAF fitted AIM-9's to its Nimrod | Maritime Patrol aircraft during the Falklands war. | | Keith I think the rear-firing part is the bit that's causing concern. Would be an interesting series of seperation trials. -- Cheers Dave Kearton |
#4
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One intriguing part was that they were supposedly fitted with rear-firing AIM-9 Sidewinders on wing pylons. To discourage MiGs while engaged in overflights... This sounds a bit far-fetched to me...has anyone heard of such a thing? Sounds a bit far-fetched to me. Too much danger of the missile hitting the horizontal stablizer on its way out. JD |
#5
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"Joe Delphi" wrote:
One intriguing part was that they were supposedly fitted with rear-firing AIM-9 Sidewinders on wing pylons. To discourage MiGs while engaged in overflights... This sounds a bit far-fetched to me...has anyone heard of such a thing? Sounds a bit far-fetched to me. Too much danger of the missile hitting the horizontal stablizer on its way out. JD It would tumble all over the place wouldn't it?...as likely impact the fuselage as anywhere I'd think, hell, the turbulence might even trash the whole missile, rip the fins off etc. -- -Gord. (use gordon in email) |
#6
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Yeah, really I'm talking crazy aerodynamics...
On the other hand, does anyone remember the Soviet sub overflown by a Navy P-3 in the 1980s that had a mockup small SAM launcher up on the sail? There was some turbulence after that photo hit the fan... So -- if you think you've got intell collectors watching you, paint up a blue missile all authentic colors and mount it on a pylon facing backwards... Hope that word filters through to the bad guys and who knows? Maybe that MiG pilot will twitch a bit, thereby causing him to miss. The Chinese Nationalists lost a lot of aircraft over the years, including several P2Vs (RB-69As). Quote:
Here's a photo of a black-painted P-3 at NAF Naha in October of 1966 for maintenance. According to www.vpnavy.net it's buno 149678, an EP-3B of VQ-1. It was later converted to an EP-3B and was in VQ-1 but in October of 1966 it was still a P-3A, albeit modified, and belonged to the CIA/ROCAF and was flying from Taiwan, etc. Note the CHINAT insignia, along with a few odd bumps and whatnot, including adapter rails on the wing pylons... |
#7
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Gord Beaman wrote in
: "Joe Delphi" wrote: One intriguing part was that they were supposedly fitted with rear-firing AIM-9 Sidewinders on wing pylons. To discourage MiGs while engaged in overflights... This sounds a bit far-fetched to me...has anyone heard of such a thing? Sounds a bit far-fetched to me. Too much danger of the missile hitting the horizontal stablizer on its way out. JD It would tumble all over the place wouldn't it?...as likely impact the fuselage as anywhere I'd think, hell, the turbulence might even trash the whole missile, rip the fins off etc. I doubt they would stay on the rails much past 100 knots. The wind blast on the blunt back end (nozzle) would probably blow them off. The missiles aren't mechanically locked to the rail, just held in place by the spring loaded detent, which had been known to loosen over time, leading to separations upon recovery, as documented here - http://www.airdisaster.com/forums/pr...ad.php?t=51707 . Adding a small fairing over the nozzle might alleviate that problem, but I'm really doubtful that this whole rear-firing thing was ever done. Dave in San Diego |
#8
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Dave in San Diego wrote in
: Gord Beaman wrote in : "Joe Delphi" wrote: One intriguing part was that they were supposedly fitted with rear-firing AIM-9 Sidewinders on wing pylons. To discourage MiGs while engaged in overflights... This sounds a bit far-fetched to me...has anyone heard of such a thing? Sounds a bit far-fetched to me. Too much danger of the missile hitting the horizontal stablizer on its way out. JD It would tumble all over the place wouldn't it?...as likely impact the fuselage as anywhere I'd think, hell, the turbulence might even trash the whole missile, rip the fins off etc. I doubt they would stay on the rails much past 100 knots. The wind blast on the blunt back end (nozzle) would probably blow them off. The missiles aren't mechanically locked to the rail, just held in place by the spring loaded detent, which had been known to loosen over time, leading to separations upon recovery, as documented here - http://www.airdisaster.com/forums/pr...ad.php?t=51707 . Adding a small fairing over the nozzle might alleviate that problem, but I'm really doubtful that this whole rear-firing thing was ever done. Dave in San Diego I know, it's not kool to follow up your own posts, but I just had to. The NSC site has the originals of the 'Winder pics in the above link, and the details - http://www.safetycenter.navy.mil/pho...ive/photo3.htm Dave in San Diego |
#9
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"Dave Kearton" wrote in message ... "Keith W" wrote in message | "Larry Cauble" wrote in | message .. . || || As a young sailor (some 30+ years ago) I flew in the back of an EP-3B || 'Batrack' aicraft of VQ-1. Years later, I read of the story of the || two P-3As that were converted to EP-3Bs in the 1960s. || || The story is that they were CIA-operated out of Taiwan, Germany, etc. || with a number of modifications for intelligence collection and agent || dropping and various skullduggery. When the CIA was done (by 1968) || they were modified into the Navy first reconnaissance EP-3s. || || One intriguing part was that they were supposedly fitted with || rear-firing AIM-9 Sidewinders on wing pylons. To discourage MiGs || while engaged in overflights... || || This sounds a bit far-fetched to me...has anyone heard of such a || thing? || | | Its not that far fetched, the RAF fitted AIM-9's to its Nimrod | Maritime Patrol aircraft during the Falklands war. | | Keith I think the rear-firing part is the bit that's causing concern. True enough , that part would be a bitch, forward firing AIM-9's I can believe but not pointing backwards. Keith ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#10
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Larry Cauble wrote: As a young sailor (some 30+ years ago) I flew in the back of an EP-3B 'Batrack' aicraft of VQ-1. Years later, I read of the story of the two P-3As that were converted to EP-3Bs in the 1960s. y Cauble Hmm When were you in Q1 ??? I was There 30+ years ago too, only I flew the other two. Rick Everett, Washington |
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