[USA] What do you think of the 20 Meter 2 Seat Class?

USA glider pilots, should the 20 Meter 2 Seat Class be included in
World Championships?

See
http://sites.google.com/site/20meter2seat/
for further information.

RS

On Jan 25, 4:34*pm, R S wrote:
USA glider pilots, should the 20 Meter 2 Seat Class be included in
World Championships?

Seehttp://sites.google.com/site/20meter2seat/
for further information.

RS

Yes

On Jan 25, 4:34*pm, R S wrote:
USA glider pilots, should the 20 Meter 2 Seat Class be included in
World Championships?

Seehttp://sites.google.com/site/20meter2seat/
for further information.

RS

Sure as long as you get rid of one from World, Club, Standard, 15M,
18M or Open. It is time to reduce the number of classes at the
international level. You can race anything you want at the national
level, but there should only be about three classes at the world
Level.

Better yet, combine the 18M with a 20M class and make one new class.
Does it really need to state if it is one two, or three seats?

Who is going to support these teams and pay the costs to send seven or
eight teams to the internationals? How many contests do we need to
hold for all the types? What different skills are you showing with
the different classes? Where are you going to find enough qualified
pilots to fly them in the internationals. The US representative to
the Club class will have never finished higher than 7th in a US
Nationals and that was six years ago. Are we really sending our best
pilots or should we be investing in improving or pilots to be able to
do better internationally?

Yes we are stuck in the philosophy that everyone should feel good
about flying their favorite glider. That is fine, we have the US
Sports Class and the international Club class for most of that. We do
not need more classes at the international level. Enough is enough!

From the document:
"... the IGC is asked to consider the option of replacing the World
Class or the future 13,5 m class with the 20 m two seater class,
provided a suitable solution for the WC/13,5 m class can be found."

/Lars

On Tue, 26 Jan 2010 05:41:25 -0800 (PST), lrbj
wrote:

From the document:
"... the IGC is asked to consider the option of replacing the World
Class or the future 13,5 m class with the 20 m two seater class,
provided a suitable solution for the WC/13,5 m class can be found.

Comparing the number of Duo Discus and DG-1000s to the number of
PW-5s, there can only be one solution... get rid of the World class.
The sooner, the better.

On Jan 26, 8:19*pm, Andreas Maurer wrote:
On Tue, 26 Jan 2010 05:41:25 -0800 (PST), lrbj

wrote:
From the document:
"... the IGC is asked to consider the option of replacing the World
Class or the future 13,5 m class with the 20 m two seater class,
provided a suitable solution for the WC/13,5 m class can be found.

Comparing the number of Duo Discus and DG-1000s to the number of
PW-5s, there can only be one solution... get rid of the World class.
The sooner, the better.

Andreas,

Is that the plan? Help beautify the world by getting rid of World
Class?

Ray Lovinggood
(And some probably say that getting rid of me would help beautify the
world...)

On Jan 26, 6:46*pm, rlovinggood wrote:
On Jan 26, 8:19*pm, Andreas Maurer wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2010 05:41:25 -0800 (PST), lrbj

wrote:
From the document:
"... the IGC is asked to consider the option of replacing the World
Class or the future 13,5 m class with the 20 m two seater class,
provided a suitable solution for the WC/13,5 m class can be found.

Comparing the number of Duo Discus and DG-1000s to the number of
PW-5s, there can only be one solution... get rid of the World class.
The sooner, the better.

Andreas,

Is that the plan? *Help beautify the world by getting rid of World
Class?

Ray Lovinggood
(And some probably say that getting rid of me would help beautify the
world...)

Unfortunately there is probalby not enough interesting stuff in a PW5s
to make them worth grinding up. No carbon fiber. Can you grind up the
PW5 and use it to make fiberglass flock/filler for building bits on
20m class?

Darryl

On Tue, 26 Jan 2010 18:46:25 -0800 (PST), rlovinggood
wrote:


Is that the plan? Help beautify the world by getting rid of World
Class?

Well... I'm pretty sure you agree that a PW-5 doesn't add a lot of
beauty to the world, don't you?

*The US representative to
the Club class will have never finished higher than 7th in a US
Nationals and that was six years ago. *Are we really sending our best
pilots or should we be investing in improving or pilots to be able to
do better internationally?


I agree we need fewer classes. However, the above is due to the US
curiously shoot-self-in-foot pilot selection policy, not due to the
IGC creating too many classes. US club pilots may not have
participated in an FAI worlds, and must qualify in a "club" glider,
ruling out over 1/2 of the sports class entrants. The UK will send to
the club worlds....Andy Davis and G Dale. (The equivalent in the US
of, say, Karl Striedieck and Gary Ittner.) Good luck US, we're going
to need it!

John Cochrane

On Jan 27, 8:29*am, John Cochrane
wrote:
*The US representative to
the Club class will have never finished higher than 7th in a US
Nationals and that was six years ago. *Are we really sending our best
pilots or should we be investing in improving or pilots to be able to
do better internationally?

I agree we need fewer classes. However, the above is due to the US
curiously shoot-self-in-foot pilot selection policy, not due to the
IGC creating too many classes. US club pilots may not have
participated in an FAI worlds, and must qualify in a "club" glider,
ruling out over 1/2 of the sports class entrants. The UK will send to
the club worlds....Andy Davis and G Dale. (The equivalent in the US
of, say, Karl Striedieck and Gary Ittner.) Good luck US, we're going
to need it!

John Cochrane

Really... Pilot Selection Policy is the problem? ... Really!

There have been a great number of U.S. "Big Names" finishing much
lower than than 7th in the "real" FAI Classes at Worlds over the past
MANY, MANY WGC's. Has the current Pilot Selection Policy been the
problem there??? And they have had the benefit of racing here at home
under the same classes and in the same ships they will at worlds. So
what is their excuse? Maybe because it is tough AND we persist with
tasking strategies and scoring formulas that are tailored for the
US,and the US alone.

The real problem is that U.S. Club Class Pilots do not race their
peers who specialize in club class, ever, until getting to Europe.
Give me a Club Class here like the Europeans have - Exactly like they
have, and I and others will concentrate on it, and when the people
who can afford own the newest ships "slum" to our affordability level
in apickup "old glider, will kick a great many "Big Name"/FAI Class
Pilot tail-ends.... Go Get'em Sean and Ryszard - real club class
pilots in real club class ships here in the USA..

I wish you the very best at worlds this summer BB - the US needs
someone, anyone, to win since its been a very long time indeed and we
need the boost. But until you actually go over to Europe, race under
their conditions and stipulations, in the pressure cooker of worlds,
and place higher than 7th; I will hold off crowning you "better" than
anyone we've sent to club class under the current selection policies.

If anyone can't tell, this constant denigration of the club class
concept and by association my skills, AND the skills of the other
pilots we have sent to Club Class WGC's, really ... ANGERS ME!

Thanks to the growing Club Class movement in the U.S., especially
those in Region 5. I only wish I could get to that regional to fly
club class here in the USA - unfortunately I will be going for another
national title with my girls rowing team at that time of year. Change
the dates or get some more club class waivers going and I'm there!

Respectfully if not angrily ,
Tim McAllister EY

If anyone wants to talk Club Class in Little Rock, look for the
bearded guy with steam coming out of his ears and maybe a Club Class
WGC US Team or event shirt on...