GPS Question: What to buy

Hi,

I am looking for a handheld all purpose GPS unit that can be used for aviation,
hiking, auto, etc. I want it to be capable of downloading maps (charts, street
maps, topos, etc), and be relatively inexpensive and lightweight. Is there
such a unit?

Any advice from our learned group would be greatly appreciated.

TIA

Grant

Mark Astley wrote:

Although the 196 is great, I've recently started to have second
thoughts...The problem with the Garmin is that it ONLY does GPS. However,
the weather this year has started me thinking about in-cockpit weather
updates. If I'd purchased control visions AnywhereMap
(www.controlvision.com), I'd have an upgrade path to the AnywhereWX
product. As it stands now, I'm looking at having to either sell off the
196 and buy AnywhereMap (runs on a PDA), or buy both and have more GPS
than I really
need. Just something to consider...

I've been "considering"...and it's daunting. I'd love opinions from those
that have used them on how the Anywhere compares *as a GPS* to the 196. I
did find:

http://www.anywheremap.com/pdfs/garmin_compare.pdf

but I'd hardly consider that unbiased. I mean, I'm sure it's honest. But
it's easy for them to leave off the aspects where the Garmin would reign.

Plus, I've the general fear of anything running on an MSFT environment
today. Given the news about a power plant infected by the slammer worm,
and some airline that had to do check-ins by hand because another worm took
our their computers, stability and reliability has to be a concern for
something built over Microsoft-CE or whatever those iPAQs are running.

Still, the Anywhere looks like such a nice product.

So...anyone tried both?

- Andrew

Andrew Gideon wrote in message ...
Mark Astley wrote:

Although the 196 is great, I've recently started to have second
thoughts...The problem with the Garmin is that it ONLY does GPS. However,
the weather this year has started me thinking about in-cockpit weather
updates. If I'd purchased control visions AnywhereMap
(www.controlvision.com), I'd have an upgrade path to the AnywhereWX
product. As it stands now, I'm looking at having to either sell off the
196 and buy AnywhereMap (runs on a PDA), or buy both and have more GPS
than I really
need. Just something to consider...

I've been "considering"...and it's daunting. I'd love opinions from those
that have used them on how the Anywhere compares *as a GPS* to the 196. I
did find:

http://www.anywheremap.com/pdfs/garmin_compare.pdf

but I'd hardly consider that unbiased. I mean, I'm sure it's honest. But
it's easy for them to leave off the aspects where the Garmin would reign.

Plus, I've the general fear of anything running on an MSFT environment
today. Given the news about a power plant infected by the slammer worm,
and some airline that had to do check-ins by hand because another worm took
our their computers, stability and reliability has to be a concern for
something built over Microsoft-CE or whatever those iPAQs are running.

Still, the Anywhere looks like such a nice product.

So...anyone tried both?

- Andrew


If you already have a PDA, such as an IPaq, I would recommend
www.pocketfms.com. It is free moving map GPS for a computer or PDA
with a GPS connection. You can get any GPS you want and connect it
to the PDA, or get one specifically made to connect to the PDA like a
Compact Flash GPS. I have been trying out pocketfms and it works
great, does all the things the Garmin Units do, and its free. Plus the
downloads / updates are free, and it also downloads weather
information prior to a flight if you chose.

Good luck
Tom

Ted Lindgreen wrote:

The 196 is a great GPS, but it has two "features", that, had I
know it before, would have caused me to never have bought it.

1. Lock-to-Road.
The 196 is a combined aviation/automotive/marine GPS.
For road-usage Garmin build in a feature, "Lock-to-Road",
to coverup both map- and GPS errors. As some maps are
pretty bad, and it seems to try to "fix" pre-SA GPS errors,
this can offset your actual position by hundreds of feet.
I have observed my 196 a few times to kick into "Lock-to-Road"
mode when flying above a road. Needless to say that whatever the
instrument then tells you is complete bogus, especially the HSI
is "fun" to watch.....
You will ask: "why the heck don't you disable this??".
The problem is that the 196 automagically enables again it all
the time as side-effect of other settings. There is no way to
set it to off and keep it off (this is confirmed by Garmin).
The only work-around I found sofar is it to religiously check
and reset it every time I at startup and then not touch power,
mode, settings, etc., anymore.

I've not had my 196 for as long as you've had yours, but I've never observed
this behavior. I'll look for it, though. My observation would have been that
lock-to-road is in effect in land-mode, but not in aviation mode. I wonder
whether we have different software versions. I'm on 2.7 (from memory). I think
3.0 is available but I haven't downloaded it.

Go to http://www.garmin.com and put in "lock to road" in the search field and it
lists several software changes that have been made in that feature.


2. Dead-Reckoning.
Whenever the 196 looses the satellites (which does happen
now and then near certain airports and/or with certain radio
settings), it does not tell you. Instead, it covers up this
fact and just extrapolates whatever your course was for no
less than 30 seconds. You can set an alarm on "accuracy",
but also this alarm is delayed by 30 seconds. So, if you
loose the satellites, only after 30 seconds you find out
that the information the 196 was giving you was bogus.


I have seen this behavior. My old Garmin 90 worked the same way. It's not a
problem for me.

Remove "SHIRT" to reply directly.

Interesting...
I have to note parenthetically that I have both the 195 and 196 in the
cockpit... That I fly all over the eastern USA with these units, and
sometimes in really nasty weather where they are invaluable, and rarely have
I noted a degraded EPE, and it was both units the few times it has
happened - which was maybe three times over a number of years... I do use
windshield mounted antennas, not the stub antennas... I also have never
noticed any deviation between what the 196 is calling my position and what
the localizer/DME is showing on an instrument approach, and I use the GPS on
all instrument approaches as a backup to the primary nav... YMMV

Denny

Although the 196 is great, I've recently started to have second
thoughts... ...

For $500 this looks like a decent GPS. I've always been a Garmin owner and was
considering a 196 but the "Lock to Road" feature turns me off. The PDA based
GPS systems look ok, too.

Anyone near Birmingham, Alabama using one of these systems (Airmap 500 or
PDAs)?


Trip



In article , says...

Interesting...
I have to note parenthetically that I have both the 195 and 196 in the
cockpit... That I fly all over the eastern USA with these units, and
sometimes in really nasty weather where they are invaluable, and rarely have
I noted a degraded EPE, and it was both units the few times it has
happened - which was maybe three times over a number of years... I do use
windshield mounted antennas, not the stub antennas... I also have never
noticed any deviation between what the 196 is calling my position and what
the localizer/DME is showing on an instrument approach, and I use the GPS on
all instrument approaches as a backup to the primary nav... YMMV

Denny

Although the 196 is great, I've recently started to have second
thoughts... ...

The "lock to roads feature " can be turned on or off and remembers your
preference in each mode (Aviation, Land, Water). The 196 is an awesome unit.
Wayne


"TripFarmer" wrote in message
...
For $500 this looks like a decent GPS. I've always been a Garmin owner
and was
considering a 196 but the "Lock to Road" feature turns me off. The PDA
based
GPS systems look ok, too.

In article ,
Wayne wrote:
The "lock to roads feature " can be turned on or off and remembers your
preference in each mode (Aviation, Land, Water). The 196 is an awesome unit.

Sorry, but this is only partly true:

The "lock to roads feature" can be turned on or off, but it does
NOT remember the "off" preference: in land mode it gets turn on
automatically as a side-effect of a mode change, a "go to", a route
selection, and many other key-press-seqences which seem unrelated
to this "feature" (like merily switching it on and off). In aviation
mode I have observed it to be turned on for no obvious reason
several times. In marine mode I've not yet seen it turned on, but
I hardly ever use it in this mode, so I don't know how it behaves
here..

I agree that it is a great unit, but having to check (and sometimes
reset) "lock to road" in aviation mode every time after switch-on
is silly. Actually I think it's silly that "lock to road" is present
(and can be silently working!) in aviation and water mode.

-- ted

Ted Lindgreen wrote:
In article ,
Wayne wrote:

The "lock to roads feature " can be turned on or off and remembers your
preference in each mode (Aviation, Land, Water). The 196 is an awesome unit.


Sorry, but this is only partly true:

The "lock to roads feature" can be turned on or off, but it does
NOT remember the "off" preference: in land mode it gets turn on
automatically as a side-effect of a mode change, a "go to", a route
selection, and many other key-press-seqences which seem unrelated
to this "feature" (like merily switching it on and off). In aviation
mode I have observed it to be turned on for no obvious reason
several times. In marine mode I've not yet seen it turned on, but
I hardly ever use it in this mode, so I don't know how it behaves
here..

I agree that it is a great unit, but having to check (and sometimes
reset) "lock to road" in aviation mode every time after switch-on
is silly. Actually I think it's silly that "lock to road" is present
(and can be silently working!) in aviation and water mode.


Yours seems to be the only unit with that problem. Maybe you ought to send your
unit in to Garmin and tell them to fix it.

What kind of flying are you doing that it matters if you lose your track for
30 seconds without knowing it? The only context I can imagine this making a
difference for is an IFR approach, which you shouldn't be using this for
anyway.

"Ted Lindgreen" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Andrew Gideon wrote:
Mark Astley wrote:

Although the 196 is great, I've recently started to have second
thoughts... ...
....
Still, the Anywhere looks like such a nice product.

So...anyone tried both?

I've only experience with the 196, which I own over a year and have
used extensively, but that might help you also in your decision.
At least it may focus you on some things that the sales-bla does
not tell you.

The 196 is a great GPS, but it has two "features", that, had I
know it before, would have caused me to never have bought it.

1. Lock-to-Road.
The 196 is a combined aviation/automotive/marine GPS.
For road-usage Garmin build in a feature, "Lock-to-Road",
to coverup both map- and GPS errors. As some maps are
pretty bad, and it seems to try to "fix" pre-SA GPS errors,
this can offset your actual position by hundreds of feet.
I have observed my 196 a few times to kick into "Lock-to-Road"
mode when flying above a road. Needless to say that whatever the
instrument then tells you is complete bogus, especially the HSI
is "fun" to watch.....
You will ask: "why the heck don't you disable this??".
The problem is that the 196 automagically enables again it all
the time as side-effect of other settings. There is no way to
set it to off and keep it off (this is confirmed by Garmin).
The only work-around I found sofar is it to religiously check
and reset it every time I at startup and then not touch power,
mode, settings, etc., anymore.

2. Dead-Reckoning.
Whenever the 196 looses the satellites (which does happen
now and then near certain airports and/or with certain radio
settings), it does not tell you. Instead, it covers up this
fact and just extrapolates whatever your course was for no
less than 30 seconds. You can set an alarm on "accuracy",
but also this alarm is delayed by 30 seconds. So, if you
loose the satellites, only after 30 seconds you find out
that the information the 196 was giving you was bogus.

I have had several e-mail exchanges with Garmin about this.
Although I always got promptly very (overly) polite answers
(Thank you bla bla.., etc.), when you skip the politeness,
the answer is: "yes, this is how the 196 works, and no, we
have no intention to change it".

What I want from a GPS, in fact from every aviation instrument, is
that as soon as it knows there something wrong, it raises a flag,
and not to deliberately, and silently, cover it up by "fixing" the
position, or extrapolating the past.

I'm very interested to hear how Anywhere behaves in this respect,
and may trade my 196 in for it when it behaves better.

Regards,
-- ted