Need some advice for new pilot in training

Hello everyone,

I'm sure you probably read at least 50 "newbie" messages a week and I
apologize in advance for this one. But as the subject reads, I'm a new
pilot in training. I've only been flying for about a month now, but I
only fly once a week, so really, I've only been up four times now. I
feel comfortable with my instructor and confident in his knowledge and
experience, but I have to admit, learning to fly is much more difficult
than it sounds/looks.

So far, I feel confident in my ability to pre-flight the aircraft, taxi
on the taxi-ways, and take offs. I feel pretty good about those three
things. In other words, I can get myself in the air and establish a
steady altitude and fly (which I really enjoy). However, my instructor
is now showing me "stalls." These scare the living hell out of me!!
We've done power-off stalls for two sessions now and I know what they
feel like and can recover from them ok, but I really, really don't like
these.

Also, last session, my instructor introduced me to landings. Now, my
log book only has about four hours of flight time in it, so you can only
imagine how this went. I'm really surprised the Skyhawks landing gear
held up to my abuse. Plus, for my first attempt, I was trying to land
with an unbelievable cross-wind. The wind was blowing from right to
left and from what I can tell, my instructor had the right rudder pedal
pressed all the way down. Again, this was scary as hell. I'm still
amazed we didn't crash.

So I guess my question would be this: Can any of you guys offer some
advice on how to get through stall training and landings because right
now my confidence is shot.

Thanks in advance,
Terry

"Bubba" wrote in message
...
Hello everyone,

I'm sure you probably read at least 50 "newbie" messages a week and I
apologize in advance for this one. But as the subject reads, I'm a new
pilot in training. I've only been flying for about a month now, but I
only fly once a week, so really, I've only been up four times now. I
feel comfortable with my instructor and confident in his knowledge and
experience, but I have to admit, learning to fly is much more difficult
than it sounds/looks.

So far, I feel confident in my ability to pre-flight the aircraft, taxi
on the taxi-ways, and take offs. I feel pretty good about those three
things. In other words, I can get myself in the air and establish a
steady altitude and fly (which I really enjoy). However, my instructor
is now showing me "stalls." These scare the living hell out of me!!
We've done power-off stalls for two sessions now and I know what they
feel like and can recover from them ok, but I really, really don't like
these.

Also, last session, my instructor introduced me to landings. Now, my
log book only has about four hours of flight time in it, so you can only
imagine how this went. I'm really surprised the Skyhawks landing gear
held up to my abuse. Plus, for my first attempt, I was trying to land
with an unbelievable cross-wind. The wind was blowing from right to
left and from what I can tell, my instructor had the right rudder pedal
pressed all the way down. Again, this was scary as hell. I'm still
amazed we didn't crash.

So I guess my question would be this: Can any of you guys offer some
advice on how to get through stall training and landings because right
now my confidence is shot.

Thanks in advance,
Terry

Just think back and realize how cool it was that you were up there flying
while the rest of this planet was stuck on the ground. Then realize that it
takes everyone several hours before they get the hang of it and stick with
it. Don't give up. If it was easy, everyone would be doing it, and if
everyone was doing it, we'd have alot of stupid pilots up there flying
planes scaring the crap out of the rest of us.

Relax and enjoy it, you'll get it with time. You don't even have enough
hours yet to wipe your ass, don't worry about your landings.....

"Bubba" wrote in message
...
[...]
So I guess my question would be this: Can any of you guys offer some
advice on how to get through stall training and landings because right
now my confidence is shot.

Stalls: they don't panic me, but I did find that when an instructor showed
me what happens when you *don't* recover, but instead simply keep the
elevator held back, I became even more comfortable with them. This was in a
Cessna 172, and the nose simply bobbed a bit. Use the rudder to keep the
wings level, of course. It's actually quite a gentle maneuver, and helps
illustrate just how much of the drama of a normal stall recover is
pilot-induced.

Landings: IMHO, introducing landings on a runway with a crosswind doesn't
make much sense. Better for your instructor to find a different runway with
a parallel wind (or none at all). That said, regardless of where you start
your landings, at four hours it's WAY too soon to be worrying about whether
you'll ever get them right. If you're still trying to figure it out at 40
hours, then come back and we can all talk to you about it.

Finally, use Google Groups to look for other messages here, and on
rec.aviation.student (which would be a better place for your concerns) for
questions about stalls and landings. Lots of people have gone through what
you're going through, and the best information you can get right now is to
know that your experience is extremely similar to many other people's.

Pete

Right now, it's good that stalls scare you. That's why they're introduced
now, early in training, so you won't make the classic mistake of getting too
slow on final approach and stalling near the ground.

Pay very close attention to the sensations you feel just before the airplane
stalls: controls go "soft," you need a lot of rudder to keep the wings
level, the deck angle is odd; and when it comes time to solo, be ready to
take recovery action BEFORE the stall happens.

Don't worry about X-wind landings right now. I take it your airport has
only one runway. When you solo, your instructor will pick a calm day, or
one with a light breeze right down the runway. You won't be asked to do
X-winds seriously until your skills are much better than they are now.
Right now, just concentrate on coordinated turns, straight and level, and
stable consistent descents. When your instructor sees that you can do these
things without sweating, he/she will move on to the kind of fancy footwork
it takes to make smooth crosswind landings.

Seth
N8110R

"John Doe" wrote in message
news:ag10f.57708$8q.9073@lakeread01...

"Bubba" wrote in message
...
Hello everyone,

I'm sure you probably read at least 50 "newbie" messages a week and I
apologize in advance for this one. But as the subject reads, I'm a new
pilot in training. I've only been flying for about a month now, but I
only fly once a week, so really, I've only been up four times now. I
feel comfortable with my instructor and confident in his knowledge and
experience, but I have to admit, learning to fly is much more difficult
than it sounds/looks.

So far, I feel confident in my ability to pre-flight the aircraft, taxi
on the taxi-ways, and take offs. I feel pretty good about those three
things. In other words, I can get myself in the air and establish a
steady altitude and fly (which I really enjoy). However, my instructor
is now showing me "stalls." These scare the living hell out of me!!
We've done power-off stalls for two sessions now and I know what they
feel like and can recover from them ok, but I really, really don't like
these.

Also, last session, my instructor introduced me to landings. Now, my
log book only has about four hours of flight time in it, so you can only
imagine how this went. I'm really surprised the Skyhawks landing gear
held up to my abuse. Plus, for my first attempt, I was trying to land
with an unbelievable cross-wind. The wind was blowing from right to
left and from what I can tell, my instructor had the right rudder pedal
pressed all the way down. Again, this was scary as hell. I'm still
amazed we didn't crash.

So I guess my question would be this: Can any of you guys offer some
advice on how to get through stall training and landings because right
now my confidence is shot.

Thanks in advance,
Terry

Just think back and realize how cool it was that you were up there flying
while the rest of this planet was stuck on the ground. Then realize that
it takes everyone several hours before they get the hang of it and stick
with it. Don't give up. If it was easy, everyone would be doing it, and
if everyone was doing it, we'd have alot of stupid pilots up there flying
planes scaring the crap out of the rest of us.

Relax and enjoy it, you'll get it with time. You don't even have enough
hours yet to wipe your ass, don't worry about your landings.....

"Seth Masia" wrote in message
...
Right now, it's good that stalls scare you. That's why they're introduced
now

I hope you're not instructing.

Stalls aren't supposed to scare you. They are supposed to teach you about
slow flight and about recovering from stalls.

If an instructor ever scares you on purpose, that should be the last flight
you ever have with that instructor.

Pete

Bubba wrote:
Hello everyone,

I'm sure you probably read at least 50 "newbie" messages a week and I
apologize in advance for this one. But as the subject reads, I'm a new
pilot in training. I've only been flying for about a month now, but I
only fly once a week, so really, I've only been up four times now. I
feel comfortable with my instructor and confident in his knowledge and
experience, but I have to admit, learning to fly is much more difficult
than it sounds/looks.

So far, I feel confident in my ability to pre-flight the aircraft, taxi
on the taxi-ways, and take offs. I feel pretty good about those three
things. In other words, I can get myself in the air and establish a
steady altitude and fly (which I really enjoy). However, my instructor
is now showing me "stalls." These scare the living hell out of me!!
We've done power-off stalls for two sessions now and I know what they
feel like and can recover from them ok, but I really, really don't like
these.

Also, last session, my instructor introduced me to landings. Now, my
log book only has about four hours of flight time in it, so you can only
imagine how this went. I'm really surprised the Skyhawks landing gear
held up to my abuse. Plus, for my first attempt, I was trying to land
with an unbelievable cross-wind. The wind was blowing from right to
left and from what I can tell, my instructor had the right rudder pedal
pressed all the way down. Again, this was scary as hell. I'm still
amazed we didn't crash.

So I guess my question would be this: Can any of you guys offer some
advice on how to get through stall training and landings because right
now my confidence is shot.

Thanks in advance,
Terry

Stalls: do them until they are fun. :-) Actually, you are not the first
student who did not like stalls. Check over on rec.aviation.student and
you will find that out real quick. In fact, you will want to sign up
over there because this is just the beginning of questions that you
will have that the folks over there will help with.

Okay, you are uncomfortable with stalls at first. I didn't like them,
either. Most people don't. One way I help my students to become more
comfortable with them is I make the students hold on the yoke by the
center stem only. This keeps the student from turning the yoke and
banking the plane. Then, instead of recovering immediately, I have the
student just hold the airplane in a stall and keep the nose straight
and the wings level using rudder only. Do this with power off stalls
only, of course. I make a game out of it: how long can you keep the
wing from dipping? Pretty soon the student realizes that the airplane
is not going to do anything that he doesn't allow it to do.

Power on stalls are pretty easy to recover from. Most students pitch
too high and get too abrupt a recovery. As long as your airspeed keeps
coming back you will eventually stall. Once you do stall, just relax
the back pressure a little; too many people think they have to push the
yoke forward. You don't, just relax a little and the nose will come
down enough to break the stall. You will find that you can move in and
out of a power on stall just bobbing the nose up and down a little. Try
to see how little movement you can do it with.

Now, you might think that messing around like this you might get into a
spin. Well, what of it? You have your instructor along and he is
supposed to know how to recover from mistakes like that. Even so, it is
unlikely because what I have you doing is just hovering on the edge of
a stall. Hanging on to the center of the yoke is also going to keep you
from making inappropriate aileron inputs.

Usually when a student is having trouble with landing he has not
prepared well enough with slow flight and ground reference maneuvers.
Granted, the student begins landing almost from the first lesson, but
serious study of landings should begin only after the basic work has
been mastered. I usually hold off on landing practice until just before
solo, but that is still about half the pre-solo work you have to do --
crosswind landings, recovering from landing errors, no-flap landings,
etc.

Look for these common errors: not looking far enough down the runway,
pulling up the nose too soon ("fear of runway"), and poor airspeed
control. Never practice more than three landings in a row before having
your instructor demonstrate another one. It helps to keep from
developing bad landing habits.

Don't worry about the Skyhawk's landing gear. For certification they
drop the plane from something like 20 feet and if the gear doesn't
break, it passes. I can almost guarantee that you will hurt yourself
before you hurt the gear, with the exception of the nose gear. If you
must make a bad landing, at least don't drop it on the nose gear. It
just is not built to take it. Neither is the propeller, engine, or
firewall, all of which can be easily damaged by landing on the nose
gear. So don't do it.

Its is not at all unusual for you to feel that way at this
point in your training. After you have practiced landings
and stalls more you will fear them less and one day soon
you'll be out there and discover yourself doing them
remarkably well.

Persistance and diligence is the name of the game.

In article ,
"Peter Duniho" wrote:

"Seth Masia" wrote in message
...
Right now, it's good that stalls scare you. That's why they're introduced
now

I hope you're not instructing.

Stalls aren't supposed to scare you. They are supposed to teach you about
slow flight and about recovering from stalls.

If an instructor ever scares you on purpose, that should be the last flight
you ever have with that instructor.

Pete



Wow!!! Thanks to everyone who responded. I found the
rec.aviation.student group and will start posting more questions there.
I will see if my instructor will let me try holding on to the center of
the yoke for a stall recovery, that sounds ideal. I know the first time
I tried recovering from a stall, I pushed the yoke as far forward as it
would go and all I saw was ground. Scary, yes, but my instructor said
not to push that far, instead just nice and gentle push on the yoke only
enough to recover from the stall and gain some airspeed. I think this
weekend, I will feel more comfortable.

At four hours of flight time, I kinda felt it was a little early to
learn landings as well, but I have assumed my flight instructor knows
what he is doing. Maybe I should speak up and tell him when I feel
comfortable moving on to a new technique.

Anyway, thank you so much to everyone for your responses. I will
definitely keep reading this group and the rec.aviation.student as well.

Terry

Bubba wrote:

At four hours of flight time, I kinda felt it was a little early to
learn landings as well, but I have assumed my flight instructor knows
what he is doing.

It's never too early to learn how to land. I have a friend who soloed
with less than four hours in his log book. His first couple of lessons
never left the pattern. They were all take-offs, landings, and touch &
go's. Of course that was back in the 60's and they had a difference
emphasis back them.

In my case, we started working on landings the very first lesson. My
third lesson was focused completely on skills needed for landing
(stalls, simulated pattern over a corn field, and actual landings
including a go-around). By five hours I was doing touch & go's.

Since landing is a mandatory part of every flight, I feel that teaching
it early and often is the right approach. The sooner you start working
on it, the easier it will be. The first few hours of flight training
are very important to establishing habits and skills that will be with
you for the rest of your flying "career". An important skill like
landing deserves to be included in that time.


-m
--
## Mark T. Dame
## VP, Product Development
## MFM Software, Inc. (http://www.mfm.com/)
"In accord with UNIX philosophy, Perl gives you enough rope to
hang yourself."
-- Programming perl, Larry Wall and Randal L. Schwartz

"Bubba" wrote in message
...
[...]
At four hours of flight time, I kinda felt it was a little early to
learn landings as well, but I have assumed my flight instructor knows
what he is doing. Maybe I should speak up and tell him when I feel
comfortable moving on to a new technique.

Just to clarify, I agree with Mark. My point was that four hours is too
early to be *worried* about whether you'll have trouble with landings. I
never suggested it was too early to introduce landings (though I did suggest
difficult crosswind landings might be inappropriate that early).

I will, however, agree with your thought of communicating with your
instructor about your comfort level with various aspects of training. You
should be able to trust your instructor, and I'll recommend you give him the
benefit of the doubt with respect to decisions about when to introduce new
topics. But at the same time, it's important for you to provide him with
feedback about how the learning process is going for you, and your feelings
about specific types of flight.

One of the great advantages of one-on-one training (as opposed to classroom)
is the ability for the instructor to tailor the instruction to the student,
and for the student to provide the feedback necessary for the instructor to
be able to do that. Don't make the all-too-common mistake of failing to
make full use of this advantage.

Pete