Kneeboards, etc.

I'm a newly minted PP-ASEL flying a C-182. I was wondering what
different solutions pilots have come up with for cockpit data and
checklist management. I've tried kneeboards and find them somewhat
limiting and limited. What do the rest of you do to manage
checklists, charts, airport info, etc?
Right now I'm flying VFR but plan on instrument training when I have
some more time under my belt. I'm sure the data management needs
change when flying IFR.
Thanks for any tips or suggestions.
CPW

On 19 Mar 2006 15:14:19 -0800, "cpw" wrote:

I'm a newly minted PP-ASEL flying a C-182. I was wondering what
different solutions pilots have come up with for cockpit data and
checklist management. I've tried kneeboards and find them somewhat
limiting and limited. What do the rest of you do to manage
checklists, charts, airport info, etc?
Right now I'm flying VFR but plan on instrument training when I have
some more time under my belt. I'm sure the data management needs
change when flying IFR.
Thanks for any tips or suggestions.
CPW

I mostly fly a PA28 (or C172) and use a Tri-Fold kneeboard to carry
checklist, alternate approach charts, pens, pencil, plotter, etc. etc.
I also have a yoke mount clipboard for the flightplan and approach
plate in use with attachments for clock/timer, torch and spare
pen/pencils.

The nice thing about the 182 is the big space between the two front
seats. There is plenty of room to place a small duffle to hold anything
you need within easy reach.
I made my own flip-style checklist which I pick up and set down as I
need it.
I use a kneeboard to write frequencies, weather, clearances, etc.
I also keep a copy of my flight log attached to record all the
incidental times (start/stop, wheels on/wheels off, time arrived at fix,
etc.)
I fold my charts for the area/route I am flying and set them between the
seats when not looking at them.
A flight calculator, handheld radio and headlamp/flashlight are in the
bag between the seats along with spare batteries/battery packs.

I used a word processor and made my own customized checklist. After I
got it down just right I laminated it. I put it in the side pocket. For
a writing pad, I use a 1/2 size yellow pad (4 1/4 x 6 1/2). For charts
I got www.airchart.com VFR and IFR binder charts. I prefer the WACs, he
give s you the whole country in one easy package. For approach plates,
I use the bound govt ones (the pages dont come out which is good
because that means they are always where they should be, and the govt
ones are less expensive). I just put them on the floor when not on my
knee. I always have a couple of pens and a pad of stickies. I put my
heading into the heading bug, altitude into the altitude bug and freqs
into the radio. When things get busy, I have no time to write those
down. I do write down my route clearances.

You can try all the fancy kneeboards but I found I was better off
without them. Just more clutter. I'm kind of a minimalist, but you find
most pro pilots just use the pad of paper from the hotel and the charts
the way they come from the issuer.

With a stick, either center or side, a fancy military style
kneeboard is nice, with a control wheel, the kneeboard gets
in the way. For general use, I like the cheap vinyl
secretary 5x8 yellow pad with a clear plastic insert, which
can hold an approach plate. I write on the yellow pad and
stick a plate under the clear plastic. I use a Third Hand
clip from Sporty's to hold it on my thigh. It is light and
cheap and can be slid to the side out of the way.

There is room in the slot behind the pad for a couple of
plotters and pencils.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Doug" wrote in message
ups.com...
|I used a word processor and made my own customized
checklist. After I
| got it down just right I laminated it. I put it in the
side pocket. For
| a writing pad, I use a 1/2 size yellow pad (4 1/4 x 6
1/2). For charts
| I got www.airchart.com VFR and IFR binder charts. I prefer
the WACs, he
| give s you the whole country in one easy package. For
approach plates,
| I use the bound govt ones (the pages dont come out which
is good
| because that means they are always where they should be,
and the govt
| ones are less expensive). I just put them on the floor
when not on my
| knee. I always have a couple of pens and a pad of
stickies. I put my
| heading into the heading bug, altitude into the altitude
bug and freqs
| into the radio. When things get busy, I have no time to
write those
| down. I do write down my route clearances.
|
| You can try all the fancy kneeboards but I found I was
better off
| without them. Just more clutter. I'm kind of a minimalist,
but you find
| most pro pilots just use the pad of paper from the hotel
and the charts
| the way they come from the issuer.
|

I'm not a fan of kneeboards when used in yoke equipped aircraft. I had a
friend killed demonstrating a P38 while wearing a kneeboard that was
considered a major contributing cause in the crash.
As for GA airplanes with yokes, I just don't like the distance equation
between the yoke and the kneeboard as the yoke comes aft in it's normal
travel for positive pitch.
It's a judgment call of course, and some pilots do use them and haven't
complained of issues, but my business is flight safety, and I always make it
a point to mention how I feel about kneeboards when asked, or when not asked
:-) if someone posts here about using them.
Just be extremely careful and aware of the possible control confliction
issue.
Dudley Henriques

"cpw" wrote in message
oups.com...
I'm a newly minted PP-ASEL flying a C-182. I was wondering what
different solutions pilots have come up with for cockpit data and
checklist management. I've tried kneeboards and find them somewhat
limiting and limited. What do the rest of you do to manage
checklists, charts, airport info, etc?
Right now I'm flying VFR but plan on instrument training when I have
some more time under my belt. I'm sure the data management needs
change when flying IFR.
Thanks for any tips or suggestions.
CPW

cpw wrote:
I'm a newly minted PP-ASEL flying a C-182. I was wondering what
different solutions pilots have come up with for cockpit data and
checklist management. I've tried kneeboards and find them somewhat
limiting and limited. What do the rest of you do to manage
checklists, charts, airport info, etc?
Right now I'm flying VFR but plan on instrument training when I have
some more time under my belt. I'm sure the data management needs
change when flying IFR.
Thanks for any tips or suggestions.
CPW

I have tried numerous gizmos over the years, and I have learned through
this process that the ultimate cockpit organization comes from reducing
the number of items. These days for short VFR trips I don't carry
anything except a sectional. For IFR, it depend on the weather
condition. If the weather is VFR, I don't bother pulling an approach
chart out. Even an enroute chart is not absolutely essential because we
get radar vectored anyway. I am not saying don't carry all the other
stuff; you should keep them within reach, but they don't have to be
right there in front.

"cpw" wrote in message
oups.com...
I'm a newly minted PP-ASEL flying a C-182. I was wondering what
different solutions pilots have come up with for cockpit data and
checklist management. I've tried kneeboards and find them somewhat
limiting and limited. What do the rest of you do to manage
checklists, charts, airport info, etc?

I use a kneeboard. Freak accidents aside, it works quite well.

I own a fancier "lapboard", complete with a large plastic-covered area for
charts, a smaller clipboard suitable for notes and approach charts, and a
storage area for charts, pens, etc. I used it during my instrument
training, and for a little while after that, but I never did get used to it.
It always seemed like it was in the way more than it was helping. I haven't
used it in years.

The instrument charts in particular work quite well on a regular kneeboard,
and I find it easy to fold VFR charts for knee- or lap-top use as well. I
make sure my various charts and references for the flight are organized in
my flight bag (which is always close at hand), but only have the ones I
actually am using at the moment on my knee. As someone else mentioned,
keeping things to the bare minimum goes a long way to efficient use of the
space.

Pete

On Mon, 20 Mar 2006 01:28:57 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
wrote:

I'm not a fan of kneeboards when used in yoke equipped aircraft. I had a
friend killed demonstrating a P38 while wearing a kneeboard that was
considered a major contributing cause in the crash.
As for GA airplanes with yokes, I just don't like the distance equation
between the yoke and the kneeboard as the yoke comes aft in it's normal
travel for positive pitch.
It's a judgment call of course, and some pilots do use them and haven't
complained of issues, but my business is flight safety, and I always make it
a point to mention how I feel about kneeboards when asked, or when not asked
:-) if someone posts here about using them.
Just be extremely careful and aware of the possible control confliction
issue.
Dudley Henriques


A very interesting reply Dudley. I have short legs so sit fully
forward in PA28/C172. I also make a point of reducing the seat height
to it's lowest to give maximum clearance for just that reason. When
checking for 'controls full & free movement' it's the mid range fully
left or right which affects me! Unfortunately my wife has very much
longer legs and I have to remember to warn her when I'm checking 'full
& free movement' :-)

David

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Mar 2006 01:28:57 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
wrote:

I'm not a fan of kneeboards when used in yoke equipped aircraft. I had a
friend killed demonstrating a P38 while wearing a kneeboard that was
considered a major contributing cause in the crash.
As for GA airplanes with yokes, I just don't like the distance equation
between the yoke and the kneeboard as the yoke comes aft in it's normal
travel for positive pitch.
It's a judgment call of course, and some pilots do use them and haven't
complained of issues, but my business is flight safety, and I always make
it
a point to mention how I feel about kneeboards when asked, or when not
asked
:-) if someone posts here about using them.
Just be extremely careful and aware of the possible control confliction
issue.
Dudley Henriques


A very interesting reply Dudley. I have short legs so sit fully
forward in PA28/C172. I also make a point of reducing the seat height
to it's lowest to give maximum clearance for just that reason. When
checking for 'controls full & free movement' it's the mid range fully
left or right which affects me! Unfortunately my wife has very much
longer legs and I have to remember to warn her when I'm checking 'full
& free movement' :-)

David

As I said David, it's a toss up, like everything else in the add on goodies
category you can stuff in the cockpit with you :-)
A lot depends on the specific airplane you're flying as to exactly where
something will go. You can put something one place in one airplane that will
conflict like hell in the next one you fly.
The basic answer with these things is to be aware, which obviously you are.
What I would do in your case is to actually sit down in the cockpit of each
airplane of choice on the ramp and physically check your favored seat
position vs control movement vs the exact kneeboard of choice. You will
either find it's a non issue or a POSSIBLE issue. If it's a POSSIBLE issue
in any situation,(consider the crosswind flare carefully) then make your
decision based on this input.
Dudley Henriques