Airgizmo and Garmin 496 Install Saga

Apparently, installation of the Airgizmo panel dock is quite the touchy
subject up here in the Northeast. I know this has been a subject of a
number of threads but I figured I'd relay my experience so far. Since I
would like it integrated with my Garmin 430 and 340 audio panel (for
the audio out), I'd really rather have a pro do it.

First I contacted the local FSDO located on my home field (KFRG) and
talked to the avionics guy to solicit his point of view. His view was
that it was a VFR install and as such, it only needed a logbook
entry--no 337. However, he stressed that all the FSDO's are different
on this subject and I would need to contact the installer to get their
FSDO's take. He recommended getting a 337 anyway just in case. Fair
enough, makes sense to me.

After contacting the local shops, I quickly realize that none of the
Conn. shops will touch it and neither will the shops in Westshester or
New Jersey. All their FSDO's are dead set against the install. Well,
there goes the convenience of being local. An independent guy will do
the install in Rhode Island but I am hesitant because he has not done
any of these installs and at $70/hr, I don't feel like paying for his
schooling. Islip Avionics in Long Island was just rude ("so, where's
your paperwork on the thing? You got an STC? You talked to my FSDO?
Tell me the name of the guy. I don't need his phone number I just want
to see if you know the guy's name") and besides, they were $115/hr vs.
$70 everywhere else. That was the closest I've been in a while to
telling someone I don't know to f**k off.

That leaves Pennsylvania as the closest. I have a quote from Penn
Avionics and I'm trying to get a day to go there. They've done a number
of these already and know exactly what I want and their prices are not
bad. Their FSDO is OK with it as a logbook entry but they can do the
field approval for some extra $$. They also brought up a good point in
that if I get a 337 to cover me "just in case," I'll need another 337
to take it out if I sell the plane and want to keep the 496.

If anyone in the northeast area has had better success, I'd be
interested in a PIREP.

Jay, If you're reading, you had it easy with Atlas!

Marco

Call Conrad at the Radio Shop in Worcester , MA (ORH).

508-757-6954

Tell him I told you to call. It won't do you any good, but it may help me




"Marco Leon" wrote in message
ps.com...
Apparently, installation of the Airgizmo panel dock is quite the touchy
subject up here in the Northeast. I know this has been a subject of a
number of threads but I figured I'd relay my experience so far. Since I
would like it integrated with my Garmin 430 and 340 audio panel (for
the audio out), I'd really rather have a pro do it.

First I contacted the local FSDO located on my home field (KFRG) and
talked to the avionics guy to solicit his point of view. His view was
that it was a VFR install and as such, it only needed a logbook
entry--no 337. However, he stressed that all the FSDO's are different
on this subject and I would need to contact the installer to get their
FSDO's take. He recommended getting a 337 anyway just in case. Fair
enough, makes sense to me.

After contacting the local shops, I quickly realize that none of the
Conn. shops will touch it and neither will the shops in Westshester or
New Jersey. All their FSDO's are dead set against the install. Well,
there goes the convenience of being local. An independent guy will do
the install in Rhode Island but I am hesitant because he has not done
any of these installs and at $70/hr, I don't feel like paying for his
schooling. Islip Avionics in Long Island was just rude ("so, where's
your paperwork on the thing? You got an STC? You talked to my FSDO?
Tell me the name of the guy. I don't need his phone number I just want
to see if you know the guy's name") and besides, they were $115/hr vs.
$70 everywhere else. That was the closest I've been in a while to
telling someone I don't know to f**k off.

That leaves Pennsylvania as the closest. I have a quote from Penn
Avionics and I'm trying to get a day to go there. They've done a number
of these already and know exactly what I want and their prices are not
bad. Their FSDO is OK with it as a logbook entry but they can do the
field approval for some extra $$. They also brought up a good point in
that if I get a 337 to cover me "just in case," I'll need another 337
to take it out if I sell the plane and want to keep the 496.

If anyone in the northeast area has had better success, I'd be
interested in a PIREP.

Jay, If you're reading, you had it easy with Atlas!

Marco

Steve Foley wrote:
Call Conrad at the Radio Shop in Worcester , MA (ORH).

508-757-6954

Tell him I told you to call. It won't do you any good, but it may help me

I take it he won't do the install either.

Steve Foley wrote:
Call Conrad at the Radio Shop in Worcester , MA (ORH).

508-757-6954

Tell him I told you to call. It won't do you any good, but it may help me



I should have used Conrad for my 430 upgrade. He's a good guy.

KC

Download AC 43-210 from the FAA site.
This is the form for requesting a field approval. (an obstinate A&P would
probably say it needs a field approval)
I'm NOT saying one is required, but it I think it SHOULD result in a written
denial, which will be signed by an ASI with the reason for the denial.
c. Your field approval request may be denied due to the following reasons:

NOTE: If your field approval request is denied, the ASI will provide a
written response stating the reasons for the denial.

(1) The alteration or repair is a minor alteration or repair and requires
acceptable data, but does not need approved data.

(2) The alteration or repair is beyond the scope of a field approval.

(3) Some major alterations do not qualify for field approvals. The effect of
these alterations on a TC'd product may be so extensive that you would have
to apply for a new TC, amend the original TC, or apply for a Supplemental
Type Certificate (STC).

(4) The alteration or repair will result in an unsafe product.

d. After data approval has been issued or the ASI has indicated that the
alteration is going to be approved, an appropriately-rated person or agency
can perform the alteration or repair.

Take the denial to your A&P, have him call the ASI who signed the form.

It may or may not help. If nothing else, it's interesting reading.

Jim



"Marco Leon" wrote in message
ps.com...
Apparently, installation of the Airgizmo panel dock is quite the touchy
subject up here in the Northeast. I know this has been a subject of a
number of threads but I figured I'd relay my experience so far. Since I
would like it integrated with my Garmin 430 and 340 audio panel (for
the audio out), I'd really rather have a pro do it.

First I contacted the local FSDO located on my home field (KFRG) and
talked to the avionics guy to solicit his point of view. His view was
that it was a VFR install and as such, it only needed a logbook
entry--no 337. However, he stressed that all the FSDO's are different
on this subject and I would need to contact the installer to get their
FSDO's take. He recommended getting a 337 anyway just in case. Fair
enough, makes sense to me.

After contacting the local shops, I quickly realize that none of the
Conn. shops will touch it and neither will the shops in Westshester or
New Jersey. All their FSDO's are dead set against the install. Well,
there goes the convenience of being local. An independent guy will do
the install in Rhode Island but I am hesitant because he has not done
any of these installs and at $70/hr, I don't feel like paying for his
schooling. Islip Avionics in Long Island was just rude ("so, where's
your paperwork on the thing? You got an STC? You talked to my FSDO?
Tell me the name of the guy. I don't need his phone number I just want
to see if you know the guy's name") and besides, they were $115/hr vs.
$70 everywhere else. That was the closest I've been in a while to
telling someone I don't know to f**k off.

That leaves Pennsylvania as the closest. I have a quote from Penn
Avionics and I'm trying to get a day to go there. They've done a number
of these already and know exactly what I want and their prices are not
bad. Their FSDO is OK with it as a logbook entry but they can do the
field approval for some extra $$. They also brought up a good point in
that if I get a 337 to cover me "just in case," I'll need another 337
to take it out if I sell the plane and want to keep the 496.

If anyone in the northeast area has had better success, I'd be
interested in a PIREP.

Jay, If you're reading, you had it easy with Atlas!

Marco

Marco Leon wrote:



That leaves Pennsylvania as the closest. I have a quote from Penn
Avionics and I'm trying to get a day to go there. They've done a number
of these already and know exactly what I want and their prices are not
bad. Their FSDO is OK with it as a logbook entry but they can do the
field approval for some extra $$. They also brought up a good point in
that if I get a 337 to cover me "just in case," I'll need another 337
to take it out if I sell the plane and want to keep the 496.

Unbelievable. It's a minor alteration and the mechanic told you that.
But if you want to give him some money he'll write it up as a major
alteration and send it in. By the way the 337's no longer go to the
local FSDO anymore. All 337's now get sent directly to OKC so who gives
a rats ass what your local FSDO thinks?

Jay, If you're reading, you had it easy with Atlas!

Well, you just say the word, Marco, and I'll be on the phone to Tony,
getting you set up for an installation at McCandless Aviation in
Waterloo...

You *were* looking for an excuse to come visit, weren't you?

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Newps wrote:

Unbelievable. It's a minor alteration and the mechanic told you that.
But if you want to give him some money he'll write it up as a major
alteration and send it in. By the way the 337's no longer go to the
local FSDO anymore. All 337's now get sent directly to OKC so who gives
a rats ass what your local FSDO thinks?

Come to think of it, he was referring to the field approval as costing
unnecessary money as well saying that there was an hourly charge for
his guys to chase down the paperwork for the approval. He was of the
same opinion as you in that this was by no means a major alteration
while mentioning the removal aspect as well. Sorry if I was not clear.

Marco

Jay Honeck wrote:
Jay, If you're reading, you had it easy with Atlas!

Well, you just say the word, Marco, and I'll be on the phone to Tony,
getting you set up for an installation at McCandless Aviation in
Waterloo...

You *were* looking for an excuse to come visit, weren't you?

;-)

You're the only place on my list to stay if I'm ever out your way! I'll
be sure to reserve the Blackbird suite weeks before I go (but I'll take
the Mustang suite in an emergency...)

Let's see...71 gallons each way according to the Jepp Flight
Planner...71x$4.20/gal = $298 x2= $600 for fuel...16 hours flight time.


Not bad. Let me talk to the wife...

Marco

Marco Leon wrote:
Apparently, installation of the Airgizmo panel dock is quite the touchy
subject up here in the Northeast. I know this has been a subject of a
number of threads but I figured I'd relay my experience so far. Since I
would like it integrated with my Garmin 430 and 340 audio panel (for
the audio out), I'd really rather have a pro do it.

First I contacted the local FSDO located on my home field (KFRG) and
talked to the avionics guy to solicit his point of view. His view was
that it was a VFR install and as such, it only needed a logbook
entry--no 337. However, he stressed that all the FSDO's are different
on this subject and I would need to contact the installer to get their
FSDO's take. He recommended getting a 337 anyway just in case. Fair
enough, makes sense to me.

After contacting the local shops, I quickly realize that none of the
Conn. shops will touch it and neither will the shops in Westshester or
New Jersey. All their FSDO's are dead set against the install. Well,
there goes the convenience of being local. An independent guy will do
the install in Rhode Island but I am hesitant because he has not done
any of these installs and at $70/hr, I don't feel like paying for his
schooling. Islip Avionics in Long Island was just rude ("so, where's
your paperwork on the thing? You got an STC? You talked to my FSDO?
Tell me the name of the guy. I don't need his phone number I just want
to see if you know the guy's name") and besides, they were $115/hr vs.
$70 everywhere else. That was the closest I've been in a while to
telling someone I don't know to f**k off.

That leaves Pennsylvania as the closest. I have a quote from Penn
Avionics and I'm trying to get a day to go there. They've done a number
of these already and know exactly what I want and their prices are not
bad. Their FSDO is OK with it as a logbook entry but they can do the
field approval for some extra $$. They also brought up a good point in
that if I get a 337 to cover me "just in case," I'll need another 337
to take it out if I sell the plane and want to keep the 496.

If anyone in the northeast area has had better success, I'd be
interested in a PIREP.

Jay, If you're reading, you had it easy with Atlas!

Marco


I haven't installed one, don't even have a 396/496 yet, but I did some
asking around as well, and got about the same answers you got. Seems
the FSDO that serves Connecticut not only won't approve them, but will
ramp any plane he sees them in and tag it as an unapproved mod. His
issue is apparently with it being PVC it won't pass the burn test for
interior furnishings (I didn't know that applied to anything other than
the fabric, but that's beside the point). I'll bet the royalite panel
overlay that is factory original won't pass the burn test either and
will generate just as much toxic fumes if ignited as that air gizmo
will. One of the Connecticut shops said that they have made sheet metal
holders similar in appearance and function to the air-gizmo, and that
there is no problem getting those past the FSDO, but the plastic ones
won't fly. He suggested a RAM mount bolted to the panel (which I think
looks clunky) as an alternative that is considerably cheaper than making
a metal Air-gizmo.