Flight Recorder for SSA Badges

I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

On Nov 18, 9:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:
I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

LX Nano seems the clear feature leader in the portable IGC approved
Flight recorder market and its well priced at ~US$600 on the street.
Internal battery or external powered. Bluetooth support. Available
now. That is what I'd buy.

Many USA pilots are going to gain a IGC flight recorder via their
PowerFLARM and if they have a portable model then its obviously a
portable IGC flight recorder as well (suitable for use on all FAI
badges up to and including the 3 diamonds). So another option is to
encourage use of or rent a PowerFLARM. That $500 cost of a flight
recorder helps offset around a third of the purchase price of a
PowerFLARM so something to think about.

Darryl

On Nov 18, 11:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:
I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.

On Nov 18, 9:22*am, Tony wrote:
On Nov 18, 11:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:

I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. *Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. *I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. *I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. *They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. *Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.

On Nov 18, 9:22*am, Tony wrote:
On Nov 18, 11:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:

I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. *Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. *I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. *I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. *They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. *Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.

Oops! I hit 'send' instead of 'discard'. I'm sure the OP is trying
to SIMPLIFY more than economize. Yes, it's cheaper to use a postion
recorder and baro some badge flights, but it's also a PITA! I'm voting
with Daryll: get an LX Nano and be done.

On Nov 18, 11:33*am, Grider Pirate wrote:
On Nov 18, 9:22*am, Tony wrote:



On Nov 18, 11:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:

I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. *Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. *I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. *I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. *They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. *Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.

Oops! *I hit 'send' instead of 'discard'. *I'm sure the OP is trying
to SIMPLIFY more than economize. *Yes, it's cheaper to use a postion
recorder and baro some badge flights, but it's also a PITA! I'm voting
with Daryll: get an LX Nano and be done.

i also suggested the Nano if a full IGC approved flight recorder is
what they want. I'm not convinced that an electronic flight recorder
is really more simple than a barograph. I did a bunch of state
records this season with a FlywithCE/barograph combination and it was
not that difficult to do the paperwork and application. There is
plenty of paperwork and setup to be done with either type of device
before and after the flight. also plenty of failure modes for each.
any of us with any experience with any type of flight recording device
can attest to that.

On Nov 18, 9:55*am, Tony wrote:
On Nov 18, 11:33*am, Grider Pirate wrote:



On Nov 18, 9:22*am, Tony wrote:

On Nov 18, 11:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:

I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. *Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. *I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. *I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. *They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. *Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.

Oops! *I hit 'send' instead of 'discard'. *I'm sure the OP is trying
to SIMPLIFY more than economize. *Yes, it's cheaper to use a postion
recorder and baro some badge flights, but it's also a PITA! I'm voting
with Daryll: get an LX Nano and be done.

i also suggested the Nano if a full IGC approved flight recorder is
what they want. *I'm not convinced that an electronic flight recorder
is really more simple than a barograph. *I did a bunch of state
records this season with a FlywithCE/barograph combination and it was
not that difficult to do the paperwork and application. *There is
plenty of paperwork and setup to be done with either type of device
before and after the flight. also plenty of failure modes for each.
any of us with any experience with any type of flight recording device
can attest to that.

Tony. Congratulations you passed the IGC flight recorder puzzle test
and have a badge to prove it. Many other people beat their head
against this and give up. And yes an IGC flight recorder still
involves a lot of stuff but any operation who standardizes on one
recording device for all badges flights (where any recording device is
needed) is going to have an easier time. Especially when they need to
understand all the rule and different device nuances and then need to
explain that to renters, explain it again, and again, and again,....

At $600 price and if used by any reasonable number of people per year
the per-use cost is very low -- I just do not see why any commercial
operation (where I presume people's time cost money) would want to
dick around with barographs when there is a portable IGC recorder
available for $600.

Darryl

On Nov 18, 12:06*pm, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On Nov 18, 9:55*am, Tony wrote:



On Nov 18, 11:33*am, Grider Pirate wrote:

On Nov 18, 9:22*am, Tony wrote:

On Nov 18, 11:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:

I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. *Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. *I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. *I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. *They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. *Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.

Oops! *I hit 'send' instead of 'discard'. *I'm sure the OP is trying
to SIMPLIFY more than economize. *Yes, it's cheaper to use a postion
recorder and baro some badge flights, but it's also a PITA! I'm voting
with Daryll: get an LX Nano and be done.

i also suggested the Nano if a full IGC approved flight recorder is
what they want. *I'm not convinced that an electronic flight recorder
is really more simple than a barograph. *I did a bunch of state
records this season with a FlywithCE/barograph combination and it was
not that difficult to do the paperwork and application. *There is
plenty of paperwork and setup to be done with either type of device
before and after the flight. also plenty of failure modes for each.
any of us with any experience with any type of flight recording device
can attest to that.

Tony. Congratulations you passed the IGC flight recorder puzzle test
and have a badge to prove it. Many other people beat their head
against this and give up. And yes an IGC flight recorder still
involves a lot of stuff but any operation who standardizes on one
recording device for all badges flights (where any recording device is
needed) is going to have an easier time. Especially when they need to
understand all the rule and different device nuances and then need to
explain that to renters, explain it again, and again, and again,....

At $600 price and if used by any reasonable number of people per year
the per-use cost is very low -- I just do not see why any commercial
operation (where I presume people's time cost money) would want to
dick around with barographs when there is a portable IGC recorder
available for $600.

Darryl

Darryl when I was working on my Silver Badge I did eventually get the
point of beating my head on the wall and nearly giving up. Giving up
on doing the paperwork and getting a good trace that is. I always
seemed to fly further when I didn't have the barograph on board
anyway.

Last winter I spent a lot of time actually reading the Sporting Code
and the SSA Badge and Record guide and started preparing for flights
by the book. I was amazed at how well it worked out. Instead of having
the barograph/FR be an afterthought it was actually part of the
planning for the flight and by golly things started working out.
Managed to get my gold badge legs and something like 17 state records
all through on the first try! Also OO'd for at least 6 Silver badge
legs using barographs, 2 using a FR, and 2 state records and they all
went through too! I must be living right!

yes standardizing on one device is a good idea, be that a replogle
barograph or an FR. there is approximately equal preflight dicking
around associated with either one, IMO. If they want their renters to
be able to fly for Diamond Goal then the FR is the obvious choice. No
doubt the Nano is probably the best choice. That is why I just bought
one.

Although I do need to remember to make a box in the Cherokee for that
Winter Barograph I have. Gotta have that ready for the eventual
diamond distance attempt.

Data loggers have come a long way and have all come down in price and will
likely continue to do so as long as there is competition from other
manufacturers.The FlyWithCE recorder
http://www.wingsandwheels.com/flywit...xx_gps_dat.htm really
started the revolution to bringing prices down at just a little over
$100..the Colibri
http://www.wingsandwheels.com/lx_nav...x7007_coli.htm did the
same to reduce costs from the older Cambridge loggers and has become one of
the most popular and reliable loggers since it was introduced . The Colibri
introduced USB and MicroSD Cards as serial devices were on their way
out..Don't overlook the ERIXX IGC Data-Logger,
http://www.imi-gliding.com/en/erixx-...-recorder.html tiny and simple and
best of all no one has to be an IT professional to run any of these newer
devices, most will download directly to a PC with USB plug in or simple SD
Card reader as is the Nano
http://www.wingsandwheels.com/lx_nav...ano_flight.htm and any
of the aforementioned loggers produce FAI/IGC files that are easy to view
with any flight planning software like SeeYou without having to go through
complicated conversion processes like the original loggers.
Like everyone else I have several options all available and all can ship
same day from stock.
tim
Please visit the Wings & Wheels website at www.wingsandwheels.com


if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.




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On Nov 18, 10:22*am, Tony wrote:
On Nov 18, 11:01*am, Carl6703 wrote:

I would like to retire our old Barographs and replace them with a
portable Flight Recorder that could be rented to candidates for SSA
badges. *Does anyone have any suggestions for a portable flight
recorder which would meet the badge requirements? Thanks.

Carl Baxter
Turf Soaring

if you want to eliminate the barographs completely i'd say go with the
LXNAV Nano. *Extremely small, entirely self contained in a unit that
is smaller than my cell phone, costs about the same as a 15 yr old
volkslogger or cambridge unit (~$600 at cumulus soaring and wings and
wheels and maybe others), easy operation. *I just picked one up and am
looking forward to using it this upcoming season. *I would think it
would be a great setup for rental.

just curious, why are you looking to retire the barographs? if you're
wanting your renters to be able to do closed course silver and gold
distance legs you can get some FlywithCE recorders (~$120 at Wings and
Wheels) to use in conjunction with the barographs. *They have been
approved as "Position Recorders" in the USA to replace cameras and
turnpoint photos. *Of course the Barograph alone is still all you need
to do free distance silver, gold and diamond distance and altitude
gains and silver duration.

Tony,

Getting a Badge Candidate set up with barograph is a task no one seems
eager to undertake. Then there are the periodic calibrations required
and the interpretation of the trace. The width of the line seems
important some times. Does anyone know if the LXNAV Nano will require
periodic calibrations for badge use?

Carl