cabin pressure and health

Boeing funded a clinical trial to actually determine the effects of
being at an 8000 foot altitude for extended periods, and the results
were published last year in the New England Journal of Medicine. It's
an interesting read: here's the URL Many peer reviewed journal
articles require membership in an appropriate group (usually involving
fees) to be read: this one is freely available.,


http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/abstract/357/1/18

For what it's worth, the number of subjects involved, and the
inclusion/exclusion criteria were fairly limited ( a couple of
hundred people, not nearly enough to uncover rare but important
conditions that could impact health) but the population probably is
representative of those holding Class III medicals or better. It's
fair to say nothing surprising was uncovered, except to learn that
such a study had not been done long ago.

It reminds me of the old adage that we should drink 8 glasses of water
a day. That's something that has actually been debunked in a recent
study.

wrote in news:dec3c7c0-b8e7-496f-a525-36a6a6a33410
@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com:

Boeing funded a clinical trial to actually determine the effects of
being at an 8000 foot altitude for extended periods, and the results
were published last year in the New England Journal of Medicine. It's
an interesting read: here's the URL Many peer reviewed journal
articles require membership in an appropriate group (usually involving
fees) to be read: this one is freely available.,


http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/abstract/357/1/18

For what it's worth, the number of subjects involved, and the
inclusion/exclusion criteria were fairly limited ( a couple of
hundred people, not nearly enough to uncover rare but important
conditions that could impact health) but the population probably is
representative of those holding Class III medicals or better. It's
fair to say nothing surprising was uncovered, except to learn that
such a study had not been done long ago.

It reminds me of the old adage that we should drink 8 glasses of water
a day. That's something that has actually been debunked in a recent
study.




Thin air and even radiation exposure are insignificant in comparison to
the problems associated with engine oil seeping into the aircon. Some
airplanes are a lot worse than others, the older Rolls Royce powered
757s and TriStars being the worst with the Lycoming Powered Bae 146s not
far behind. Almost all have the problem to some extent or another.
All jet oils, particularly Mobil, contain huge amounts of nasties such
as organo-phosphates which affect the central nervous system and are
extremely hard to get rid of. Almost all airliners have this problem,
however, and every time you fly on one you get a certain amount of this
crap in you.
If you ever get on an airliner and you get a certain sour "smelly
socks" smell, that means there's an unusually high concentration and
that the engine seals arent doing their job. If you get enough in your
system during a flight, you'll probably have runny eyes and irritation
in your throat and sinuses. If you get a high enough dose in one flight,
you'll also have a nice tingly headache right at the top of your skull.
A major dose will bring about a night wither on, or kneeling in front of
the toilet...
It's a huge problem that the airlines and manufacturers are keeping as
quiet as possible about because of the huge liability exposure they
have. The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older turboprops
used this system as well as a small number of jets. The 787 will have
this system.



Bertie

Bertie the Bunyip wrote
The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older turboprops
used this system as well as a small number of jets. The 787 will have
this system.

The B-707 had both Bleed Air and Turbochargers. We used the Turbochargers
most of the time. An engine bleed line spun a turbine which then turned
a fresh outside air compressor.

Bob Moore
17 years in B-707s

Robert Moore wrote in
5.205:

Bertie the Bunyip wrote
The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older turboprops
used this system as well as a small number of jets. The 787 will have
this system.

The B-707 had both Bleed Air and Turbochargers. We used the Turbochargers
most of the time. An engine bleed line spun a turbine which then turned
a fresh outside air compressor.

Yeah, that was the jet exception I had noted. You were lucky you didn't
have to breath the compresser section air in that thing!
The JT8 was OK AFAIK There would have been some fumes, but the RB-211 is a
complete piece of junk. The Brits never could build an oil tight engine....




Bertie

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Robert Moore wrote in
5.205:


Bertie the Bunyip wrote

The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older turboprops
used this system as well as a small number of jets. The 787 will have
this system.

The B-707 had both Bleed Air and Turbochargers. We used the Turbochargers
most of the time. An engine bleed line spun a turbine which then turned
a fresh outside air compressor.


Yeah, that was the jet exception I had noted. You were lucky you didn't
have to breath the compresser section air in that thing!
The JT8 was OK AFAIK There would have been some fumes, but the RB-211 is a
complete piece of junk. The Brits never could build an oil tight engine....

Thats why you never change the oil in a british engine, you just change
the filter every 6000 miles, with the leak and replace of the oil, oil
changes are just a waste of time.




Bertie

James wrote in
:



Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Robert Moore wrote in
5.205:


Bertie the Bunyip wrote

The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older
turboprops used this system as well as a small number of jets. The
787 will have this system.

The B-707 had both Bleed Air and Turbochargers. We used the
Turbochargers most of the time. An engine bleed line spun a turbine
which then turned a fresh outside air compressor.


Yeah, that was the jet exception I had noted. You were lucky you
didn't have to breath the compresser section air in that thing!
The JT8 was OK AFAIK There would have been some fumes, but the
RB-211 is a complete piece of junk. The Brits never could build an
oil tight engine....

Thats why you never change the oil in a british engine, you just
change the filter every 6000 miles, with the leak and replace of the
oil, oil changes are just a waste of time.



True, and they actually don't change the oils in RB 211s either! That is
part of the problem. As jet oil ages it gets thinner and leaks more
easily, and it also gets smellier.




Bertie

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

Robert Moore wrote in
5.205:


Bertie the Bunyip wrote

The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older turboprops
used this system as well as a small number of jets. The 787 will have
this system.

The B-707 had both Bleed Air and Turbochargers. We used the Turbochargers
most of the time. An engine bleed line spun a turbine which then turned
a fresh outside air compressor.


Yeah, that was the jet exception I had noted. You were lucky you didn't
have to breath the compresser section air in that thing!
The JT8 was OK AFAIK There would have been some fumes, but the RB-211 is a
complete piece of junk. The Brits never could build an oil tight engine....




Bertie
We should be thankfull that the british did not supply the electrics,
AKA Lucas the prince of darkness, otherwise the cabin would be full of
smoke, and nothing would work!

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...
Robert Moore wrote in
5.205:

Bertie the Bunyip wrote
The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older turboprops
used this system as well as a small number of jets. The 787 will have
this system.

The B-707 had both Bleed Air and Turbochargers. We used the Turbochargers
most of the time. An engine bleed line spun a turbine which then turned
a fresh outside air compressor.

Yeah, that was the jet exception I had noted. You were lucky you didn't
have to breath the compresser section air in that thing!
The JT8 was OK AFAIK There would have been some fumes, but the RB-211 is
a
complete piece of junk. The Brits never could build an oil tight
engine....




Bertie

Damn, I wish they would have let you design it. It would have been perfect,
uh.

"Dakota" luv2^fly99@cox.^net wrote in
:


"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...
Robert Moore wrote in
5.205:

Bertie the Bunyip wrote
The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older
turboprops used this system as well as a small number of jets. The
787 will have this system.

The B-707 had both Bleed Air and Turbochargers. We used the
Turbochargers most of the time. An engine bleed line spun a turbine
which then turned a fresh outside air compressor.

Yeah, that was the jet exception I had noted. You were lucky you
didn't have to breath the compresser section air in that thing!
The JT8 was OK AFAIK There would have been some fumes, but the
RB-211 is a
complete piece of junk. The Brits never could build an oil tight
engine....




Bertie

Damn, I wish they would have let you design it. It would have been
perfect, uh.


Couldn't have done any worse...


Bertie

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...


Thin air and even radiation exposure are insignificant in comparison to
the problems associated with engine oil seeping into the aircon. Some
airplanes are a lot worse than others, the older Rolls Royce powered
757s and TriStars being the worst with the Lycoming Powered Bae 146s not
far behind. Almost all have the problem to some extent or another.
All jet oils, particularly Mobil, contain huge amounts of nasties such
as organo-phosphates which affect the central nervous system and are
extremely hard to get rid of. Almost all airliners have this problem,
however, and every time you fly on one you get a certain amount of this
crap in you.
If you ever get on an airliner and you get a certain sour "smelly
socks" smell, that means there's an unusually high concentration and
that the engine seals arent doing their job. If you get enough in your
system during a flight, you'll probably have runny eyes and irritation
in your throat and sinuses. If you get a high enough dose in one flight,
you'll also have a nice tingly headache right at the top of your skull.
A major dose will bring about a night wither on, or kneeling in front of
the toilet...
It's a huge problem that the airlines and manufacturers are keeping as
quiet as possible about because of the huge liability exposure they
have. The next generation are eschewing bleed air driven pressurisation
and going to seperate supercharger systems. A lot of older turboprops
used this system as well as a small number of jets. The 787 will have
this system.



Bertie

I'll forward this to all the airlines and let them know their pilots are
concerned enough to be posting to the world.