Pawnee Tow Release

On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 3:11:15 PM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:
On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 8:43:07 AM UTC-4, Walt Connelly wrote:
Bob Youngblood;997736 Wrote:
On Monday, August 5, 2019 at 1:16:45 AM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:-
I am currently rebuilding another Pawnee and converting from a spray
plane to a tow plane. Extensive work has been completed on this bird,
and I am about ready to install the tow hook. This is the third Pawnee
that I have converted and I have used the hopper dump handle as the tow
release handle which provides a huge amount of leverage and also a easy
to get to location. I most cases the tow handle release is located on
the floor, which causes the pilot to reach down to get to the handle. In
this case the hopper release handle is just to the left side of the
pilot and requires no bending down and allows the pilot to keep their
eye on flying the plane. It requires just a bit of modification to make
this conversion and in my case the inspector was impressed with the
application.
If any of you are considering converting a Pawnee you should consider
this modification. -
Kirk, that is in fact a very nice system. Take yours off the Pawnee and
send it to me. Times are tough and I am running low on cash, thinking
about calling JJ Wentworth for a small advance. Bob


Bob, the system on your Yellow Gorilla should be the standard throughout
the towing world. Everyone agrees the handle down, parallel to the
floor is difficult to access in an emergency and unsafe. The Schweizer
tow hook standardly installed is equally unsafe. While there is no way
to make towing completely safe for the tow pilot, at too low an altitude
a kiting glider is a death sentence and there is no justifiable reason
for any facility to continue with a release system proven to fail when
it needs to work the most. Just my humble opinion.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow Pilot
Now happily flying helicopters.




--
Walt Connelly

Walt, thanks for the kind words. I first made that arrangement on Dusty, my first Pawnee, and then on to the Yellow Gorilla. After many tows and other tow pilots examining the system they all have been in agreement with your observation. I am now completing a new Pawnee which is named Towpecker, it too will have the same release mechanism that even has better performance.. Bob

Bob

Would it be possible to get some pictures of your release set up? Our Pawnee the floor mounted lever which is not acceptable and we are looking at alternatives.

Bruce Cynamon
Weirsdale Glider Club

On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 at 10:32:06 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 3:11:15 PM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:
On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 8:43:07 AM UTC-4, Walt Connelly wrote:
Bob Youngblood;997736 Wrote:
On Monday, August 5, 2019 at 1:16:45 AM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:-
I am currently rebuilding another Pawnee and converting from a spray
plane to a tow plane. Extensive work has been completed on this bird,
and I am about ready to install the tow hook. This is the third Pawnee
that I have converted and I have used the hopper dump handle as the tow
release handle which provides a huge amount of leverage and also a easy
to get to location. I most cases the tow handle release is located on
the floor, which causes the pilot to reach down to get to the handle. In
this case the hopper release handle is just to the left side of the
pilot and requires no bending down and allows the pilot to keep their
eye on flying the plane. It requires just a bit of modification to make
this conversion and in my case the inspector was impressed with the
application.
If any of you are considering converting a Pawnee you should consider
this modification. -
Kirk, that is in fact a very nice system. Take yours off the Pawnee and
send it to me. Times are tough and I am running low on cash, thinking
about calling JJ Wentworth for a small advance. Bob


Bob, the system on your Yellow Gorilla should be the standard throughout
the towing world. Everyone agrees the handle down, parallel to the
floor is difficult to access in an emergency and unsafe. The Schweizer
tow hook standardly installed is equally unsafe. While there is no way
to make towing completely safe for the tow pilot, at too low an altitude
a kiting glider is a death sentence and there is no justifiable reason
for any facility to continue with a release system proven to fail when
it needs to work the most. Just my humble opinion.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow Pilot
Now happily flying helicopters.




--
Walt Connelly

Walt, thanks for the kind words. I first made that arrangement on Dusty, my first Pawnee, and then on to the Yellow Gorilla. After many tows and other tow pilots examining the system they all have been in agreement with your observation. I am now completing a new Pawnee which is named Towpecker, it too will have the same release mechanism that even has better performance. Bob

Bob

Would it be possible to get some pictures of your release set up? Our Pawnee the floor mounted lever which is not acceptable and we are looking at alternatives.

Bruce Cynamon
Weirsdale Glider Club

Bruce, I would be glad to send you some pics of the tow release handle that I have developed on both of my Pawnee's. I never liked the release handle on the floor, it is difficult to get to regardless of an emergency or not. The Pawnee came with a hopper release handle located on the left side of the cockpit rising from beneath the floor and extends about three feet up in a forward position. If the pilot needed to dump the hopper the handle was there and made for easy access.
I used this same assembly as my tow release handle. The assembly itself sits in a two bushing support, super strong and easy to configure fora tow release handle. I did a bit of tig welding on the attach point to attach the release cable at the proper angle and guided the cable back to the Tost release assembly. This assembly works beautifully and ensures greater safety and easy access. Walt visited our club and looked at how I had done the tow release, his opinion of the release has been been backed by many tow pilots that have flown the Yellow Gorilla and other Pawnee tow pilots.
Safety comes first for the tow pilot, my next tow will not be my first, and damn sure don't want it o be the last. Bob

Bruce Cynamon
Weirsdale Glider Club

Bruce,

Curious as to what days your club is active. Would like to drop by and have a look. What glider/gliders do you have? While I have no interest in towing ever again, with the proper ship I might be interested in catching a thermal. I own property up in your area.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow Pilot (7000 TOWS)
Now Happy Helicopter Pilot.

On Wednesday, February 26, 2020 at 8:07:25 AM UTC-5, wrote:
Bruce Cynamon
Weirsdale Glider Club

Bruce,

Curious as to what days your club is active. Would like to drop by and have a look. What glider/gliders do you have? While I have no interest in towing ever again, with the proper ship I might be interested in catching a thermal. I own property up in your area.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow Pilot (7000 TOWS)
Now Happy Helicopter Pilot.

Walt

We do not have a regular schedule, we fly when the conditions look good and the tow plane is available. I emailed you my phone number, drop me a line and we can let you know when we will flying.

Bruce

On Wednesday, February 26, 2020 at 7:36:39 AM UTC-5, Bob Youngblood wrote:
On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 at 10:32:06 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 3:11:15 PM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:
On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 8:43:07 AM UTC-4, Walt Connelly wrote:
Bob Youngblood;997736 Wrote:
On Monday, August 5, 2019 at 1:16:45 AM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:-
I am currently rebuilding another Pawnee and converting from a spray
plane to a tow plane. Extensive work has been completed on this bird,
and I am about ready to install the tow hook. This is the third Pawnee
that I have converted and I have used the hopper dump handle as the tow
release handle which provides a huge amount of leverage and also a easy
to get to location. I most cases the tow handle release is located on
the floor, which causes the pilot to reach down to get to the handle. In
this case the hopper release handle is just to the left side of the
pilot and requires no bending down and allows the pilot to keep their
eye on flying the plane. It requires just a bit of modification to make
this conversion and in my case the inspector was impressed with the
application.
If any of you are considering converting a Pawnee you should consider
this modification. -
Kirk, that is in fact a very nice system. Take yours off the Pawnee and
send it to me. Times are tough and I am running low on cash, thinking
about calling JJ Wentworth for a small advance. Bob


Bob, the system on your Yellow Gorilla should be the standard throughout
the towing world. Everyone agrees the handle down, parallel to the
floor is difficult to access in an emergency and unsafe. The Schweizer
tow hook standardly installed is equally unsafe. While there is no way
to make towing completely safe for the tow pilot, at too low an altitude
a kiting glider is a death sentence and there is no justifiable reason
for any facility to continue with a release system proven to fail when
it needs to work the most. Just my humble opinion.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow Pilot
Now happily flying helicopters.




--
Walt Connelly

Walt, thanks for the kind words. I first made that arrangement on Dusty, my first Pawnee, and then on to the Yellow Gorilla. After many tows and other tow pilots examining the system they all have been in agreement with your observation. I am now completing a new Pawnee which is named Towpecker, it too will have the same release mechanism that even has better performance. Bob

Bob

Would it be possible to get some pictures of your release set up? Our Pawnee the floor mounted lever which is not acceptable and we are looking at alternatives.

Bruce Cynamon
Weirsdale Glider Club

Bruce, I would be glad to send you some pics of the tow release handle that I have developed on both of my Pawnee's. I never liked the release handle on the floor, it is difficult to get to regardless of an emergency or not.. The Pawnee came with a hopper release handle located on the left side of the cockpit rising from beneath the floor and extends about three feet up in a forward position. If the pilot needed to dump the hopper the handle was there and made for easy access.
I used this same assembly as my tow release handle. The assembly itself sits in a two bushing support, super strong and easy to configure fora tow release handle. I did a bit of tig welding on the attach point to attach the release cable at the proper angle and guided the cable back to the Tost release assembly. This assembly works beautifully and ensures greater safety and easy access. Walt visited our club and looked at how I had done the tow release, his opinion of the release has been been backed by many tow pilots that have flown the Yellow Gorilla and other Pawnee tow pilots.
Safety comes first for the tow pilot, my next tow will not be my first, and damn sure don't want it o be the last. Bob

Bob

Would appreciate any information you can provide. Are you in Vero Beach by chance? That is not terribly far from here, one or more of us could come over for a look see.

Bruce

On Thursday, February 27, 2020 at 10:35:12 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wednesday, February 26, 2020 at 7:36:39 AM UTC-5, Bob Youngblood wrote:
On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 at 10:32:06 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 3:11:15 PM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:
On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 8:43:07 AM UTC-4, Walt Connelly wrote:
Bob Youngblood;997736 Wrote:
On Monday, August 5, 2019 at 1:16:45 AM UTC-4, Bob Youngblood wrote:-
I am currently rebuilding another Pawnee and converting from a spray
plane to a tow plane. Extensive work has been completed on this bird,
and I am about ready to install the tow hook. This is the third Pawnee
that I have converted and I have used the hopper dump handle as the tow
release handle which provides a huge amount of leverage and also a easy
to get to location. I most cases the tow handle release is located on
the floor, which causes the pilot to reach down to get to the handle. In
this case the hopper release handle is just to the left side of the
pilot and requires no bending down and allows the pilot to keep their
eye on flying the plane. It requires just a bit of modification to make
this conversion and in my case the inspector was impressed with the
application.
If any of you are considering converting a Pawnee you should consider
this modification. -
Kirk, that is in fact a very nice system. Take yours off the Pawnee and
send it to me. Times are tough and I am running low on cash, thinking
about calling JJ Wentworth for a small advance. Bob


Bob, the system on your Yellow Gorilla should be the standard throughout
the towing world. Everyone agrees the handle down, parallel to the
floor is difficult to access in an emergency and unsafe. The Schweizer
tow hook standardly installed is equally unsafe. While there is no way
to make towing completely safe for the tow pilot, at too low an altitude
a kiting glider is a death sentence and there is no justifiable reason
for any facility to continue with a release system proven to fail when
it needs to work the most. Just my humble opinion.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow Pilot
Now happily flying helicopters.




--
Walt Connelly

Walt, thanks for the kind words. I first made that arrangement on Dusty, my first Pawnee, and then on to the Yellow Gorilla. After many tows and other tow pilots examining the system they all have been in agreement with your observation. I am now completing a new Pawnee which is named Towpecker, it too will have the same release mechanism that even has better performance. Bob

Bob

Would it be possible to get some pictures of your release set up? Our Pawnee the floor mounted lever which is not acceptable and we are looking at alternatives.

Bruce Cynamon
Weirsdale Glider Club

Bruce, I would be glad to send you some pics of the tow release handle that I have developed on both of my Pawnee's. I never liked the release handle on the floor, it is difficult to get to regardless of an emergency or not. The Pawnee came with a hopper release handle located on the left side of the cockpit rising from beneath the floor and extends about three feet up in a forward position. If the pilot needed to dump the hopper the handle was there and made for easy access.
I used this same assembly as my tow release handle. The assembly itself sits in a two bushing support, super strong and easy to configure fora tow release handle. I did a bit of tig welding on the attach point to attach the release cable at the proper angle and guided the cable back to the Tost release assembly. This assembly works beautifully and ensures greater safety and easy access. Walt visited our club and looked at how I had done the tow release, his opinion of the release has been been backed by many tow pilots that have flown the Yellow Gorilla and other Pawnee tow pilots.
Safety comes first for the tow pilot, my next tow will not be my first, and damn sure don't want it o be the last. Bob

Bob

Would appreciate any information you can provide. Are you in Vero Beach by chance? That is not terribly far from here, one or more of us could come over for a look see.

Bruce

Yes, I live in Vero, here all the time

I am looking for information on the proper shock cord rings to use on a Pawnee landing gear converted to towing. If you can help, I would love to talk to you. Doug Witkowski (512) 431-6579

On Friday, June 26, 2020 at 12:35:46 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I am looking for information on the proper shock cord rings to use on a Pawnee landing gear converted to towing. If you can help, I would love to talk to you. Doug Witkowski (512) 431-6579

Doug, the shock cord assembly varied on different models and serial numbers.. Take into consideration the max gross weight of the particular model and understand that is is how the different cord was determined. Shock cords were either 5/8 or 3/4 inch diameter. You can refer to page 40 of the piper PA25 parts manual for the exact part number.There was a serial number that held 3 cords, most only held 2 and I would never put three on a Pawnee used for towing only, it makes for a gear that has no cushion or stretch, like riding a bronco bull!I have installed several of these bungee cords on the Pawnee gear for a few planes. Trust me , it is a or can be a very dangerous ordeal. I will get a few pics out to you tomorrow showing my cord arrangement. Bob

On Friday, June 26, 2020 at 12:35:46 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I am looking for information on the proper shock cord rings to use on a Pawnee landing gear converted to towing. If you can help, I would love to talk to you. Doug Witkowski (512) 431-6579

Depends on which Pawnee. We have a 180 Pawnee and use two 1080 bungees(not 1080HD)
Now the gear actually moves.
This experience not applicable to 235's.
FWIW
UH

I am looking for information on relocating the tow release handle on the Pawnee PA25 from the floor to forward of the throttle.
Thanks,
Dan DeWitt 765 744 4132