"Rescue" flight, PPL

Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight, the
clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I agreed
to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

As I understand it you are not allowed to make a profit from the flight.
I'm not aware of any restriction that prevents you from accepting the
free use of an aircraft - and if it was an issue re sharing you could
have made the instructor PIC on the return leg.
That's how it would work in Canada.
In the US? I'll leave someone else to address that one.

Tony
--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Cessna 172H C-GICE


In article ,
"Joe Johnson" wrote:

Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight, the
clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I agreed
to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

I've done that for people (and instructors) with the understanding that they
would recriprocate should I ever be in that situation. People being
friendly and helping each other out.

Besides, there is a "cost" to me, the opportunity cost of my time.

Don't make a habit of it, though.


"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
m...
Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight,
the
clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I
agreed
to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

Yes, you were bad. You broke the rules and the FAA could suspend your
license. I've seen the opinion letter.

I went round and round on this since our club doesn't make members pay when
they move the plane for maintenance.
I called up our local FSDO and asked if this kind of thing was a violation.
They said, "Of course not, that's the most ridiculous thing I ever heard.
Who told you that?"

I faxed them a copy of the FAA counsel's opinion letter and they called back
to say sheepishly that I was right. However they said that they have far
too much to do to ever worry about something like that.

Here's how it works in the real world:

You aren't going to get in trouble doing things like moving planes for
friends in the normal course of flying. However, if the FAA finds out that
you have "friends" all over the region and are racking up 20 - 40 hours of
free flight time moving planes while building time for your commercial
license, they may use the regulation to shut you down.

They may also use something like this that you did only once or twice if
they want to yank your chain for some other reason. For example, if they
are pretty sure that you are the guy who flew under the bridge last week and
can't prove it.

--

Roger Long



"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
m...
Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight,
the
clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I
agreed
to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

Roger gave you the correct answer. Yes, technically they could claim it
was "compensation" and come after you. Should you have let that stop
you? No... I would have done it, and I suspect most all of us on this
list would have also - without a second thought.

You were just "helping out" and I would hate to live where we were all
so terrified of big brother that we were afraid to give a friend a lift
to pick up his plane, or help out some folks stuck away from home.
Should you worry about a letter from the FAA for this - absolutely not.

So where *does* the rare action come from? It usually comes from
repeated actions, where someone has a vested interest in stopping you
from doing it. One of the cases on the books is glider tow, where the
company operating the aircraft will exchange free flight time if one of
the pilots who is also power rated and checked out will work a couple of
hours of tow first. [Nothing wrong with a bunch of glider pilots simply
trading off who tows whom. This is a different situation.]

Here the private pilot is getting free flight time in exchange for
flying duties. Yes, it's done all the time, so why this action? Well,
it COULD have simply come to the attention of some FAA type hanging
around. But more likely a commercial tow pilot who couldn't get enough
work dropped a dime on the FBO.

Let's restate the problem so we can see some absurdities and discover why
lawyers have more money than the rest of us...

It is illegal in our hypothetical state to carry passengers in a motor
vehicle for compensation unless one has a chauffeur's license or a
commercial driver's license.

My girlfriend calls me and tells me her car has broken down. She asks me to
come pick her up.

I am otherwise occupied, so I ask my neighbor for assistance.

My neighbor does not own a car. Normally, he rents or borrows one when he
needs a car.

My neighbor doesn't have a chauffeur's license or a commercial driver's
license; he only has an ordinary driver's license.

I ask my neighbor if he will take my car and go pick up my girlfriend.

Is my neighbor's usage of my car "compensation", placing him in violation of
the licensing laws?



"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
m...
Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight,
the
clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I
agreed
to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

Is your neighbor logging the driving time in his logbook for the
furtherance of a commercial drivers license??

ducking
Dave

Bill Denton wrote:
Let's restate the problem so we can see some absurdities and discover why
lawyers have more money than the rest of us...

It is illegal in our hypothetical state to carry passengers in a motor
vehicle for compensation unless one has a chauffeur's license or a
commercial driver's license.

My girlfriend calls me and tells me her car has broken down. She asks me to
come pick her up.

I am otherwise occupied, so I ask my neighbor for assistance.

My neighbor does not own a car. Normally, he rents or borrows one when he
needs a car.

My neighbor doesn't have a chauffeur's license or a commercial driver's
license; he only has an ordinary driver's license.

I ask my neighbor if he will take my car and go pick up my girlfriend.

Is my neighbor's usage of my car "compensation", placing him in violation of
the licensing laws?



"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
m...

Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight,

the

clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I

agreed

to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

James M. Knox wrote:

Roger gave you the correct answer.

Hey, Roger: Any change that you could provide a reference to that letter
(ie. a place online from which I could print this out)? It's something I
think my club should see.

[...]
So where *does* the rare action come from?

What about a case where an accident occurs during the "free" flight? Could
an insurance company use this to create additional problems?

- Andrew

Dave S wrote:

Is your neighbor logging the driving time in his logbook for the
furtherance of a commercial drivers license??

At the point where the needed hours are logged and any further hours
don't help in that regard does it suddenly get legal?

Free flying time is compensation. You broke the rules. Don't do it any more.