Kite flying

by "Grumman-581" Apr 19, 2006 at
01:44 AM


wrote in message
oups.com...
Maybe that'll rid us of our resident r.a.p. troll?

Not as quick as a 12-gauge though...



Ooooh. I bet my 12-guage is bigger than yours. LOL.

On 2006-04-19, Skylune wrote:
LOL. So the kids I saw were in violation of the FARS!!! That is
hysterical.

Why is it hysterical?

Kids flying kites should study the FARs. LOL.

If you engage in any activity at any age, it behooves you (or your
guardian, in the case of kids) to at least have a passing awareness of
laws that may be governing you. Flying kites on 1000 foot strings on an
airport departure path is every bit as brain dead as letting your kids
ride their bikes on the wrong side of a main road.

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by Jim Logajan Apr 18, 2006 at 09:56 PM




There are laws that cover kite flying under certain conditions - airports

are in fact covered by the regs. Relevant regs are in FAR part 101
"Moored balloons, kites, unmanned rockets and unmanned free balloons".

Quotes from some specific sections (see the FAR for the entire section):

"§ 101.13 Operating limitations.
(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, no person may
operate a moored balloon or kite—

(1) Less than 500 feet from the base of any cloud;

(2) More than 500 feet above the surface of the earth;

(3) From an area where the ground visibility is less than three miles; or

(4) Within five miles of the boundary of any airport.

(b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to the operation of a
balloon or kite below the top of any structure and within 250 feet of it,

if that shielded operation does not obscure any lighting on the
structure."

§ 101.15 Notice requirements.
No person may operate an unshielded moored balloon or kite more than 150
feet above the surface of the earth unless, at least 24 hours before
beginning the operation, he gives the following information to the FAA
ATC facility that is nearest to the place of intended operation:

(a) The names and addresses of the owners and operators.

(b) The size of the balloon or the size and weight of the kite.

(c) The location of the operation.

(d) The height above the surface of the earth at which the balloon or
kite is to be operated.

(e) The date, time, and duration of the operation.

§ 101.17 Lighting and marking requirements.
(a) No person may operate a moored balloon or kite, between sunset and
sunrise unless the balloon or kite, and its mooring lines, are lighted so

as to give a visual warning equal to that required for obstructions to
air navigation in the FAA publication “Obstruction Marking and Lighting”.

(b) No person may operate a moored balloon or kite between sunrise and
sunset unless its mooring lines have colored pennants or streamers
attached at not more than 50 foot intervals beginning at 150 feet above
the surface of the earth and visible for at least one mile. "



It would seem to me that kite manufacturers are at risk of a lawsuit if
they don't post all these legal restrictions on their products. Doubtful
a collision with a kite would cause a crash, but it could present a
distraction for pilots that like to buzz low over the treetops.

I wonder if a collision with a kite is an FAA reportable incident. And,
would that then constitute sufficient proof of illegal low flying?

On 2006-04-19, Skylune wrote:
I wonder if a collision with a kite is an FAA reportable incident. And,
would that then constitute sufficient proof of illegal low flying?

Like anything, it depends.

The notification requirement would be covered by NTSB 830 rather than
the FAA's regs. NTSB 830 says that it would be reportable, if:

(a) An aircraft accident or any of the following listed incidents
occur:
(1) Flight control system malfunction or failure;
(2) Inability of any required flight crewmember to perform
normal
flight duties as a result of injury or illness;
(3) Failure of structural components of a turbine engine
excluding
compressor and turbine blades and vanes;
(4) In-flight fire; or
(5) Aircraft collide in flight.
(6) Damage to property, other than the
aircraft, estimated to exceed
$25,000 for repair (including materials and
labor) or fair market value
in the event of total loss, whichever is
less.

Since a kite is not an aircraft, straight off the bat, it's not a
collision with another aircraft. If the collision with the kite causes
any of the other things listed above, then yes - it'll be reportable. If
it results in a bit of broken string, scratched paintwork and soiled
underwear, then no, it's not reportable.

As for the proof of illegal flying, this depends on:
- how long was the kite string? If it was over 500 feet, and the
aircraft was in an uncongested area, then no it wouldn't (and the kite
flyer may be in trouble).
- Was the aircraft approaching for landing or departing for takeoff? In
which case, no again.

Of course, if the string was 100 feet long and the plane wasn't taking
off or landing, then I'm sure the FAA could easily nail the pilot.

Basically - your second question can't be given a straight yes or no -
it depends on the circumstances.

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by Dylan Smith Apr 19, 2006 at 02:29 PM


On 2006-04-19, Skylune wrote:
LOL. So the kids I saw were in violation of the FARS!!! That is
hysterical.

Why is it hysterical?

Kids flying kites should study the FARs. LOL.

If you engage in any activity at any age, it behooves you (or your
guardian, in the case of kids) to at least have a passing awareness of
laws that may be governing you. Flying kites on 1000 foot strings on an
airport departure path is every bit as brain dead as letting your kids
ride their bikes on the wrong side of a main road



It is ludicrous because the rules say you cannot fly a kite within 5 miles
of the airport boundary, not simply off the departure and arrival ends of
the runway. 5 miles! LOL.
The kite manufacturers should have liability warnings on the kites. Who
on earth could know that?

I suppose there are rules against raising carrier pigeons near GA airports
also. If those stupid little new hover crafts become popular, I am sure
that the FAA will somehow limit their usage as well. What about small
model planes? Are these also restricted?

Damn, I'm starting to understand why the STN people say that GA airports
should be required to purchase all land in a 25 mile radius. ;-)

("De Loon" wrote)
Not as quick as a 12-gauge though...

Ooooh. I bet my 12-guage is bigger than yours. LOL.


You're bragging about 3 inches? g


Montblack
2 3/4" - Remington model 1100
http://hunting.about.com/od/toppicks/tp/tp_autoshotguns.htm

On 2006-04-19, Skylune wrote:
It is ludicrous because the rules say you cannot fly a kite within 5 miles
of the airport boundary, not simply off the departure and arrival ends of
the runway. 5 miles! LOL.

No it doesn't say that at all. I suggest you read 14 CFR 101.13 *in
full*. In particular paragraph (b). You most certainly CAN fly a kite
within 5 miles of an airfield boundary. Paragraph (b) lists the common
sense exceptions.

that the FAA will somehow limit their usage as well. What about small
model planes? Are these also restricted?

There are regulations on model planes, too, as far as the altitude they
can be flown at. They are, after all, in the air committing aviation, so
this is in the FAA's domain. Why do you think it's stupid, ludicrous or
somehow hysterical that kites and models (both potentially dangerous
objects) have some kind of regulations from the administration that
happens to regulate the airspace they fly in?

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
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Skylune wrote:

I saw a few kids flying kites over the weekend. It occurred to me: What
if they were flying the kites real high in the vicinity of GA airports? I
don't think there are any laws about kite flying off airport property.


I used to fly RC planes at a park that was with in 3 miles of KOKC.
When the real planes flew over, they were higher than the RC planes.
However, the typical traffic patters didn't bring planes over the park,
so it was pretty rare to have one directly over head. I wonder if the
controllers saw us on radar? The engine was the only thing in most
planes that would reflect radar and they aren't very big. Anyway, no
one from the FAA ever came by to complain and we used to fly there on a
pretty regular basis. There were kids flying kites at that same park, as
I recall the RC planes were usually quite a bit higher than the kites,
however there was this one time an RC helicopter impacted a kite, the
kite's death was instantaneous, the helicopter died shortly after, when
it fell to the ground. I'm sure it was a spectacular impact, but I
didn't turn my head quick enough to see it

--
Chris W
KE5GIX

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Your City Council/Park Board should post signs in the parks.



--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
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"Ross Richardson" wrote in
message ...
| We have a small city park on the north end of our airport.
It is not
| uncommon to sometimes have to dodge kites on the approach
to the
| airport. Usually have the police go out and explain the
situation to them.
|
| Ross
| KSWI
|
| wrote:
|
| Some kites have up to 500 feet of line or more.
| mike s
|
| Robert M. Gary wrote:
|
| Wow, how high were they flying those kits? 100 feet
would seem quite
| high for a kite. Maybe I'm wrong here.
|
| -Robert
|
|

by "Montblack" Apr 19, 2006 at 11:03
AM


("De Loon" wrote)
Not as quick as a 12-gauge though...

Ooooh. I bet my 12-guage is bigger than yours. LOL.


You're bragging about 3 inches? g



;-). But the barrel length is 20" and pumps out 9 shots.

http://www.mossberg.com/pcatalog/Specpurp.htm