MoGas users: Ethanol replacing MTBE

Cub Driver opined

On Sat, 29 Apr 2006 10:35:33 -0400, John wrote:

The federal government hasn't banned
MTBE outright (some individual states have) but will not protect oil
companies from MTBE lawsuits so MTBE is being phased out by next week in
most places.

I think you have to make that *all* places. There may be some MTBE
still being pumped out of the ground, but nobody is going to
manufacture it because Congress did not renew the immunity to
liability that companies previously had. Nobody wants to repriese the
asbestos liability monster.

My local airport was so fussy about mogas that it found a dealer in
Maine that would deliver mogas without MTBE. I don't know what will
happen to the mogas pump. I understand that there's a huge problem
about ethanol in that it can't be stored for long periods of time or
sent over long distances because water will cause the ethanol to
separate out (funny, I thought that that was why we put alcohol in our
gasoline in New Hampshire, to get the water to meld with the fuel). I
don't see how ethanol mix can sit in the ground for months or a year
without suffering the same fate. The airport just doesn't sell that
much mogas.

Different alcohol.

Or maybe non-MTBE, non-ethanol gasoline will still be available in
Maine?
-ash
Cthulhu in 2005!
Why wait for nature?

All the talk about nukes is missing the future WMD, engineered
viruses. In a few years it will be possible for a very small group of
people to design and manufacture viruses that are highly contagious
and cause a high percentage of fatalities. Yes, it would be very hard
to limit their destruction once released but to fanatics who simply
hate that does not matter.

I've been using mogas in my Tripacer for 6 years now, but we've recently
(MA) switched to ethanol. I actually had to siphon my tanks after putting in
what I thought was MTBE gas. This change along with the rapidly rising fuel
costs have me seriously considering selling the plane-something I really
don't want to do.

But here I am on a beautiful Sunday morning typing away instead of flying
away. This is a real double whammy for me. Either the rising prices OR the
ethanol thing I could probably absorb, but both together is a real killer.

mike

----- Original Message -----
From: "John"
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.piloting
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 10:35 AM
Subject: MoGas users: Ethanol replacing MTBE


To those who fly with STCs for motor fuel instead of avgas, is the
phase-out of MTBE affecting you?

"John" wrote in message ...
To those who fly with STCs for motor fuel instead of avgas, is the
phase-out of MTBE affecting you?

Martin Hotze wrote:

On Sun, 30 Apr 2006 05:44:28 -0400, Cub Driver usenet AT danford DOT net
wrote:

Then you ought to understand why few Americans give a hoot about
Germany, Russia, France, and all that.

.. and still you interfere ...

Yeah we apologize for sending hundreds of thousands of marines, sailors, and
soldiers to fight and die to interfere while cleaning up Europe's own
home-grown messes and genocide. Funny how Europe begged USA to "interfere."
Again, apologies. USA could have been non interfering while the rest of
Europeans became lampshades. Can you forgive us?

More on topic, enjoy the flying in Europe, I hear it's really popular and
available to the average person.

Martin Hotze wrote:

don't you understand that the USA gives sh*t on international law and
treaties?

"International law" is a fantasy term. As far as treaties go, you're
mistaken.

Martin Hotze wrote:

On 30 Apr 2006 05:46:15 -0700, Jay Honeck wrote:

I would have thought that the terrorist attacks in Madrid and London
might have shocked the peoples of Europe into awareness, but this did

well, I think we are aware. But we are not trying to call other people
"camel ****ers" or try to bring them "our culture". well, we have some
extreme right wingers here, too.

Huh? Who's "we?" Please attempt to explain yourself. Oh wait....



not happen. Only when Europe outgrows this infantile stage, and truly
engages in the diplomatic world, will the free world be able to

we are very sorry that we have to be in _this_ diplomatic world. We have to
endure the visit of the president of the US in our capitol. It costs us

millions to host him and closes businesses and restricts the rights of
_our_ citizens.

So in other words your country "restricted the rights of [your] citizens. But
naturally you can't blame your country for what it did that you don't like, so
you have to blame someone else. Wait, you're from Europe!

We even have to seal duct covers just like the Germans had
to do during his last visit. With such friends you don't need enemies.

So if it is such a burden for your great nation to have the honor of hosting
world leaders, why send out the invitations? Surely a great nation such as
yours doesn't sit around waiting for the phone to ring and then be ordered
around by another country's leader!

effectively counter Islamo-Fascism.

Until then, I'm afraid we're on our own.

You are on your own, but you (the US) is trying to shove everyone your
opinion and viewpoint up his ass.

Unlike you of course! Ha! You are starting to really crack me up.


Just give it a try and leave everybody alone with their problems. Maybe
you're right and we have to come back whining and asking for your help.
Then you can decide and demand whatever you want for your help. You never
gave it a try.

Don't call us, we'll call you. Have a nice day.

"LWG" wrote in message
. ..
Iran invaded and held sovereign American territory. What more does a
country need to justify war?

Since Iran's action was, according to "International Law", an act of war,
nothing.

" the USA has nothing to do there. No _actual_ threat, no declaration of
war
from Iran, no attack from Iran, nothing - according to international law
that would justify an invasion (by US troops). Ah well .. wait a minute
..
you never gave sh*t on international law.

Nor has international law given a ****, either.

It's one thing to be rock-brained stupid, but to post it on a world-wide
medium is really reaching the pinnacle.

"Marissa Bealey" wrote in message
...
Martin Hotze wrote:

don't you understand that the USA gives sh*t on international law and
treaties?

"International law" is a fantasy term. As far as treaties go, you're
mistaken.


Martin is a mental ward escapee (yup, they left the door unlocked at the
funny farm)...ignore him.

Cub Driver wrote:

On Sat, 29 Apr 2006 10:12:16 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
wrote:

But there is a shortage of alcohol so when they
run out of E85 they can't sell straight gasoline.

Worse, you can't send the mix through pipelines for long distances, as
I understand it, meaning that NE states have to scramble.

While all this goes on, there is a tarrif of 51 cents a gallon on
imported ethanol! You might ask your congressman about that....

Richard "Dick" Durbin (Democrat-Illinois) was just asked that by Jim
Cramer on Meet the Press. He stated that he does not want the tariff
removed and he strongly supports it to discourage ethanol imports. It's
ok apparently to import oil from unfriendly countries, but he doesn't want
a drop of ethanol coming in from say Brazil, unless it's taxed high enough
to make it unworkable.

He also says that he does NOT support more nuclear power but also does NOT
support more oil, gas, or coal generation either. Instead he favors more
hybrid cars and electric cars (to get their power from those generators he
doesn't want, you see.)

If any of this makes any sense at all to you and you live in Illinois,
keep voting for that guy. If you missed the discussion, I think CNBC will
rerun it tonight.

Ash Wyllie wrote:

Cub Driver opined

On Sat, 29 Apr 2006 10:35:33 -0400, John wrote:

The federal government hasn't banned
MTBE outright (some individual states have) but will not protect oil
companies from MTBE lawsuits so MTBE is being phased out by next week in
most places.

I think you have to make that *all* places. There may be some MTBE
still being pumped out of the ground, but nobody is going to
manufacture it because Congress did not renew the immunity to
liability that companies previously had. Nobody wants to repriese the
asbestos liability monster.

My local airport was so fussy about mogas that it found a dealer in
Maine that would deliver mogas without MTBE. I don't know what will
happen to the mogas pump. I understand that there's a huge problem
about ethanol in that it can't be stored for long periods of time or
sent over long distances because water will cause the ethanol to
separate out (funny, I thought that that was why we put alcohol in our
gasoline in New Hampshire, to get the water to meld with the fuel). I
don't see how ethanol mix can sit in the ground for months or a year
without suffering the same fate. The airport just doesn't sell that
much mogas.

Different alcohol

Nope. Ethyl Alchol "absorbs" water that comes across. Actually the ethanol
get mixed in solution with the water. That is why it is used to remove water
from gas tanks.