Insurance

On Tue, 26 Sep 2006 00:04:38 GMT, "Vaughn Simon"
wrote:


"Jose" wrote in message
om...
Which is why I only rent cheap, elderly airplanes

A cheap elderly airplane can do damage to costly things and people too. You
are not covered for that without renters insurance.

Oh I buy the insurance, but I buy just enough hull insurance to pay for the
elderly hull. It leaves me more money for actual flying.

Vaughn



I'm with you on this. I fly older 172s to limit my exposure.
Liability insurance is cheap and easy to get, and I have it. On the
other hand, hull insurance for renters is expensive and not generally
available in large numbers. So, I'm covered for the damage that I may
do to costly things or people and I have enough hull coverage to cover
most of the damage to a "cheap" plane.
Rich Russell

"Bob Gardner" wrote in message
. ..
Because the FBO's insurance protects him, not you? If you cause damage to
his airplane, his insurance will cover his costs and then come after you.

Does that actually happen, though, other than in cases of gross negligence
by the pilot? I know about subrogation, but I've never heard of it being
invoked. Has anyone here ever had to pay for damage to a rental plane? (Many
FBOs include the rental pilot as an insured party, but of course that's a
different matter--the question here is what happens if that's not the case.)

--Gary

Does that actually happen, though, other than in cases of gross negligence
by the pilot? I know about subrogation, but I've never heard of it being
invoked.

Yes, it does happen, I know personally of an individual (student pilot)
who asked the FBO up front "Am I covered under your policy?, Do I need
renters insurance?". The answer was yes you are covered, and no you
dont need insurance.

Fast forward a couple of months, and the pilot is flying his first solo
x/c into an unfamiliar airport, and he has a rough landing resulting in
a prop strike. The airplane is recovered, repaired and the returned to
service. The pilot goes on to complete his PVT certificate. A couple
months go by. The pilot then receives a threatening demand letter from
the FBO's insurer asking him to repay the $10000+ repair bill.

My opinions:

- Dont EVER rely on someone else to provide insurance coverage for you.
Even if you have thoroughly have read and understood their insurance
contract, how do you know that they paid the bill that month and that
the policy is even in force?

- Get SOME renters insurance. ANY amount is better than none at all.
What you are really buying is legal representation. Even if you get
named in some trivial lawsuit it can be very costly to clear your name.


Richard

wrote in message
oups.com...
Fast forward a couple of months, and the pilot is flying his first solo
x/c into an unfamiliar airport, and he has a rough landing resulting in
a prop strike. The airplane is recovered, repaired and the returned to
service. The pilot goes on to complete his PVT certificate. A couple
months go by. The pilot then receives a threatening demand letter from
the FBO's insurer asking him to repay the $10000+ repair bill.

Ok, thanks, that's good to know. (Did he end up having to pay the bill?)

- Dont EVER rely on someone else to provide insurance coverage for you.
Even if you have thoroughly have read and understood their insurance
contract, how do you know that they paid the bill that month and that
the policy is even in force?

If the FBO advertises in writing that rental pilots are covered by its
insurance, and that turns out not to be the case (due to a lapse in the
FBO's premium payments, or for any other reason), then I'd imagine that the
pilot could sue to recover from the FBO any damages that the insurance
company had sued to recover from the pilot.

--Gary

I carry $25K Hull coverage for the light twin I rent, it also covers for all
other aircraft.
I also carry the "standard" liability coverage.

The Flight School from which I rent, does not require enough to cover the
entire aircraft. Only enough to cover the deductible. As most insurance
policies are underwritten to the same carrier.. they won't sub to far to
recover.

B

"Mark A. Deal" wrote in message
...
I passed my checkride two months ago and now rent aircraft from my flight
school.

Can anybody give me the FL20 overview of the insurance I should be
carrying and why I'll need it?

Father of three, husband of one, self employed. :~)

Thoughts?

--
Mark Deal

BTIZ wrote:

I carry $25K Hull coverage for the light twin I rent, it also covers for
all other aircraft.

where did you find a renter insurance covering twins? avemco
no longer covers that...

--Sylvain

mine is with AVEMCO and they just renewed my policy last August.
what you do have to be careful of.. is they do not cover "experimental"..
your buddies RV-8
BT

"Sylvain" wrote in message
t...
BTIZ wrote:

I carry $25K Hull coverage for the light twin I rent, it also covers for
all other aircraft.

where did you find a renter insurance covering twins? avemco
no longer covers that...

--Sylvain

On 2006-09-25, Bob Gardner wrote:
Because the FBO's insurance protects him, not you? If you cause damage to
his airplane, his insurance will cover his costs and then come after you.

I can't be the only one to think insurance is a scam. The insurance
companies get it both ways - the FBO gets "insured", and then each
renter has to insure against the FBO's insurance company litigating!
Really, the FBO's insurance isn't aircraft insurance, it's legal cover
because they aren't really covering the aircraft as such - they are
covering the legal action to sue the renter.

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de

On 2006-09-25, Robert M. Gary wrote:
fault). Renter's insurance *only* covers situations where you are at
fault. This is also why you cannot "borrow" your friends plane because
if a wheel falls off his policy will not cover the accident because you
were not named,

That depends on your friend's insurance: most policies have an "open
pilot" policy which states if you have the required level of experience,
you can fly the aircraft and be covered by the insurance.

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
On 2006-09-25, Bob Gardner wrote:
Because the FBO's insurance protects him, not you? If you cause damage to
his airplane, his insurance will cover his costs and then come after you.

I can't be the only one to think insurance is a scam. The insurance
companies get it both ways - the FBO gets "insured", and then each
renter has to insure against the FBO's insurance company litigating!

I guess that depends on what the coverage costs. Insurance companies insure
against a specific risk. In the case of the FBO, assuming the FBO has not
agreed to hold the renter harmless, then if they had no insurance they would
still have the right to go after the renter.

But there is considerable expense and risk associated with that. So most
FBOs choose instead to consolidate that risk into an insurance policy.

Assuming the insurance company is charging a premium appropriate to coverage
of that risk, rather than appropriate to the actual risk of an airplane
being flown hundreds of hours a year by the average rental pilot, I see
nothing wrong with the strategy.

And for what it's worth, whether you think it's a scam or not, the scenario
is not unique to aviation insurance.

Really, the FBO's insurance isn't aircraft insurance, it's legal cover
because they aren't really covering the aircraft as such - they are
covering the legal action to sue the renter.

If you understand that, then why do you say the coverage is a scam? Two
different policies, taken out by two different individuals, to cover two
entirely different activities.

Pete