HUD view of a near-miss

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006 03:08:07 -0500, Roger wrote:

On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:11:15 -0500, "Darkwing"

wrote in message
et...
Here's a very close call as recorded through the HUD camera of a T-38C.
Scott Wilson
http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=qLVtstYAZLY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVtstYAZLY


That was about as close as it gets without aluminum scraps flying.

Back in the '80s, the Navy aviation safety magazine APPROACH had an article
about a Tempo Pinto trainer on final that struck a Cessna 150. The nosegear of
the jet basically ran over the wing root of the 150. Both planes landed safely.
the Cessna had a huge dent in the wing, the Pinto had a scuff on the nosewheel
tire. In other words, this was an actual collision between two metal airplanes
without aluminum scraps flying....

Ron Wanttaja

"Ron Wanttaja" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 14 Dec 2006 03:08:07 -0500, Roger wrote:

On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:11:15 -0500, "Darkwing"

wrote in message
. net...
Here's a very close call as recorded through the HUD camera of a T-38C.
Scott Wilson
http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=qLVtstYAZLY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVtstYAZLY


That was about as close as it gets without aluminum scraps flying.

Back in the '80s, the Navy aviation safety magazine APPROACH had an
article
about a Tempo Pinto trainer on final that struck a Cessna 150. The
nosegear of
the jet basically ran over the wing root of the 150. Both planes landed
safely.
the Cessna had a huge dent in the wing, the Pinto had a scuff on the
nosewheel
tire. In other words, this was an actual collision between two metal
airplanes
without aluminum scraps flying....

Ron Wanttaja

I've had a couple close calls in my day. They suck.

---------------------------
DW

"Ron Wanttaja" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 14 Dec 2006 03:08:07 -0500, Roger wrote:

On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:11:15 -0500, "Darkwing"

wrote in message
et...
Here's a very close call as recorded through the HUD camera of a
T-38C.
Scott Wilson
http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=qLVtstYAZLY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVtstYAZLY


That was about as close as it gets without aluminum scraps flying.

Back in the '80s, the Navy aviation safety magazine APPROACH had an
article
about a Tempo Pinto trainer on final that struck a Cessna 150. The
nosegear of
the jet basically ran over the wing root of the 150. Both planes landed
safely.
the Cessna had a huge dent in the wing, the Pinto had a scuff on the
nosewheel
tire. In other words, this was an actual collision between two metal
airplanes
without aluminum scraps flying....

Ron Wanttaja

I have read somewhere that most midair collisions are "fender benders" and
that the aircraft land safely and go on to fly again. We mostly hear of the
most spectacular accidents--just as we do with cars and trucks.

Peter

Peter Dohm wrote:



I have read somewhere that most midair collisions are "fender benders" and
that the aircraft land safely and go on to fly again. We mostly hear of the
most spectacular accidents--just as we do with cars and trucks.

When I was at GFK, home of UND, I was working the day one Piper Cadets
prop sawed the stabilator of another in mid air. There were about 25 or
so slices, approax 3 inches long the full length of the stab. Neither
pilot reported a collision and both dummied up after landing and talking
to their parents/lawyers. It wasn't until the next set of students came
out to preflight their planes that the tail damage was discovered. They
then realized it was a midair because of how close together the slices
were. A little more investigation found the other aircraft on the ramp
with the paint from the stab on its prop.

"Frank Stutzman" wrote...

A friend of mine flew A-6s in several Red Flag exercises. He has several
such near
miss stories. I think the best was when he was running along at about
500' agl
when he had a F-16 (F-15?) overtake him from below and then immediately
pull up in
an immelmann turn in front of him.

During the de-briefing, the other pilot was asked about this maneuver and
why he
did it. Basically, he was focused on what he was doing and never saw the
A-6,
before, during, or after his turn.

Fat chance! It sounds like a well-known "maneuver" known as "thumping"!

Also, I don't think I've ever seen anyone fly lower in exercises like that
than the Brits flying Buccaneers for the Oman AF (mid 80s). They would
regularly fly under our A-6s that were ingressing at 200' or less...

John Weiss wrote:
"Frank Stutzman" wrote...
A friend of mine flew A-6s in several Red Flag exercises. He has several
such near
miss stories. I think the best was when he was running along at about
500' agl
when he had a F-16 (F-15?) overtake him from below and then immediately
pull up in
an immelmann turn in front of him.

During the de-briefing, the other pilot was asked about this maneuver and
why he
did it. Basically, he was focused on what he was doing and never saw the
A-6,
before, during, or after his turn.

Fat chance! It sounds like a well-known "maneuver" known as "thumping"!

Also, I don't think I've ever seen anyone fly lower in exercises like that
than the Brits flying Buccaneers for the Oman AF (mid 80s). They would
regularly fly under our A-6s that were ingressing at 200' or less...



I'm sorry, I thought you knew . . .
50 feet is low level. Anything higher is
cruising-along-on-the-highway-on-a-Sunday-afternoon, aka asking to see
if Mr. FlAK is at home :-(

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006 06:55:37 -0800, Ron Wanttaja
wrote:

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006 03:08:07 -0500, Roger wrote:

On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:11:15 -0500, "Darkwing"

wrote in message
. net...
Here's a very close call as recorded through the HUD camera of a T-38C.
Scott Wilson
http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=qLVtstYAZLY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVtstYAZLY


That was about as close as it gets without aluminum scraps flying.

Back in the '80s, the Navy aviation safety magazine APPROACH had an article
about a Tempo Pinto trainer on final that struck a Cessna 150. The nosegear of
the jet basically ran over the wing root of the 150. Both planes landed safely.
the Cessna had a huge dent in the wing, the Pinto had a scuff on the nosewheel
tire. In other words, this was an actual collision between two metal airplanes
without aluminum scraps flying....

Now that *is*close*! :-)) it also fits the proper definition of a
Near Miss in that he *nearly* missed the other plane. :-))

Ron Wanttaja
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006 06:55:37 -0800, Ron Wanttaja
wrote:

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006 03:08:07 -0500, Roger wrote:

On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:11:15 -0500, "Darkwing"

wrote in message
. net...
Here's a very close call as recorded through the HUD camera of a T-38C.
Scott Wilson
http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=qLVtstYAZLY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVtstYAZLY


That was about as close as it gets without aluminum scraps flying.

Back in the '80s, the Navy aviation safety magazine APPROACH had an article
about a Tempo Pinto trainer on final that struck a Cessna 150. The nosegear of
the jet basically ran over the wing root of the 150. Both planes landed safely.
the Cessna had a huge dent in the wing, the Pinto had a scuff on the nosewheel
tire. In other words, this was an actual collision between two metal airplanes
without aluminum scraps flying....

Likewise back in the 60's there was a "Flying Farmers" fly-in at
Midland's Barstow airport (3BS). The airport was basically covered
with airplanes.

I witnessed two planes, the classic landing one on top of the other. I
no longer remember the top one but the bottom was a Piper Cub. The
top plane's mains rolled right over the Cub's wings almost from
trailing edge to leading edge forcing the Cub down. Of course at this
time the pilot on top realized something was wrong and pulled up. The
Cub nosed down and rolled 90 degrees, but recovered almost
immediately. His right wing tip was only inches off the ground with
people scattering to get out of the way.

No injuries and no damage except to maybe a few pair of shorts.
Of course this doesn't count as both were tube and fabric rather than
metal. :-))

BTW the Beech factory had a Debonair there as a demonstration plane. I
took one look and said, "I'm going to have one of those some day!".
Little did I know it'd be that same airplane about 37 years later.


Ron Wanttaja
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Roger wrote:
On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:11:15 -0500, "Darkwing"
theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com wrote:


wrote in message
et...

Here's a very close call as recorded through the HUD camera of a T-38C.
Scott Wilson
http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=qLVtstYAZLY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVtstYAZLY


That was about as close as it gets without aluminum scraps flying.


It can get closer.
Many years back as a student I was landing a Piper Colt on 36. A
Comanche was flying the express way East to West. The end of 18/36 is
about as close to the road as it can get. That would put me at 300
feet or less at that point. There is an over pass about a city block
to my left (West).
The Comanche not only went under us and had to pull up a bit for the
over pass, he put the top of his vertical stab less than a foot below
us. I had this flash and the impression of looking at rivets.
He was past us before either the instructor or I jumped and we have
fast reaction times. The speeds may have been way less, but the mess
would have been just about as bad.

How did you measure the distance with such accuracy?

Matt

"Roger" wrote in message
...
Likewise back in the 60's there was a "Flying Farmers" fly-in at
Midland's Barstow airport (3BS). The airport was basically covered
with airplanes.

I witnessed two planes, the classic landing one on top of the other. I
no longer remember the top one but the bottom was a Piper Cub. The
top plane's mains rolled right over the Cub's wings almost from
trailing edge to leading edge forcing the Cub down. Of course at this
time the pilot on top realized something was wrong and pulled up. The
Cub nosed down and rolled 90 degrees, but recovered almost
immediately. His right wing tip was only inches off the ground with
people scattering to get out of the way.

No injuries and no damage except to maybe a few pair of shorts.

The other definition of an "accident".

Of course this doesn't count as both were tube and fabric rather than
metal. :-))

BTW the Beech factory had a Debonair there as a demonstration plane. I
took one look and said, "I'm going to have one of those some day!".
Little did I know it'd be that same airplane about 37 years later.

"It's deja vu all over again" - Yogi Berra