Twenty minutes in the queue awaiting the new and improved FSS

On Tue, 01 May 2007 15:08:18 GMT, Larry Dighera
wrote in :

On Tue, 1 May 2007 09:39:18 -0400, "Peter R."
wrote in :

I know I
would feel more confident talking to a briefer familiar with local Colorado
Rocky Mountain-induced weather more so than a briefer in (Florida, Ohio,
Maine, or anywhere else but there) who can only read the text from the
current and forecast conditions.

Did you mention that in your complaints to:

http://www.afss.com/feedback/
http://surveys.aopa.org/cgi-bin/qweb...cgi?idx=SP46SS


There's more AFSS contact information he
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...d_martin_info/

Dan Courain: Director, Lockheed Martin FS21 Team:
?subject=Feedback/Comments

http://www.faa.gov/contact/
Flight Service Stations: Send comments or complaints about weather
briefings and other flight planning services provided to pilots
through the Flight Service Stations, to: .
http://www.faa.gov/contact_faa/?retu...5FHB4D8%2AL%0A

http://www.lmafsshr.com/

Federal Aviation Administration
1-866-TELL-FAA (1-866-835-5322)

On Wed, 02 May 2007 02:18:29 GMT, "Steven P. McNicoll"
wrote in
. net:


Why do you CALL for a briefing at all?

In addition to other reasons, because in the event of a TFR PD, FSS
personnel may be culpable as well as the pilot if they failed to brief
the TFR, thus mitigating pilot culpability.

On Wed, 2 May 2007 06:20:27 -0700, "Matt Barrow"
wrote in
:

I don't know if it would hold up, but a detailed and time stamped print out
of the data should suffice (or maybe not).

Thanks for clearing that up. :-(

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
news

In addition to other reasons, because in the event of a TFR PD, FSS
personnel may be culpable as well as the pilot if they failed to brief
the TFR, thus mitigating pilot culpability.


A telephone briefing that misses a TFR would mitigate pilot culpability but
an internet briefing that misses a TFR would not mitigate pilot culpability?
Why would that be?

In article ,
"Matt Barrow" wrote:

Why do you CALL for a briefing at all?

I, for one, call because I can do it literally minutes before engine
start.

WiFi.

$$$$ I'm not willing to spend.

--
Bob Noel
(goodness, please trim replies!!!)

On Wed, 02 May 2007 22:35:31 GMT, "Steven P. McNicoll"
wrote in
.net:


"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
news

In addition to other reasons, because in the event of a TFR PD, FSS
personnel may be culpable as well as the pilot if they failed to brief
the TFR, thus mitigating pilot culpability.


A telephone briefing that misses a TFR would mitigate pilot culpability but
an internet briefing that misses a TFR would not mitigate pilot culpability?
Why would that be?


If the pilot misses the TFR NOTAM in the DUATS briefing, s/he bears
sole blame for it. If the TFR NOTAM is omitted from either the verbal
or DUATS type of briefing, I would expect it to mitigate the pilots
culpability in the event of a PD. In my experience, it's easier for a
pilot to overlook a single NOTAM among the plethora in a DUATS
briefing, but the live briefer briefs only those NOTAMS that are
pertinent to the flight so the relevant TFRs are not buried in the
clutter of irrelevant NOTAMS.

Of course, this issue will soon be moot when LocMart phases in the
computerized voice to deliver the telephone briefings of the future.

"Speak or say 'one' for a full briefing. Speak or say 'two' for
an updated briefing. Using the touch-tone pad enter the
departure airport identifier. ...."

In the name of reduced costs, the continuing trend of automation
replacing wet-ware will continue until the accident rate starts
increasing. Wile computers are less likely to make errors than
people, it is the people who program the computers, so that expected
increase in accuracy will likely not be achieved.

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...

If the pilot misses the TFR NOTAM in the DUATS briefing, s/he bears
sole blame for it.


If the pilot misses the TFR NOTAM in the telephone briefing, s/he bears sole
blame for it.



If the TFR NOTAM is omitted from either the verbal
or DUATS type of briefing, I would expect it to mitigate the pilots
culpability in the event of a PD. In my experience, it's easier for a
pilot to overlook a single NOTAM among the plethora in a DUATS
briefing, but the live briefer briefs only those NOTAMS that are
pertinent to the flight so the relevant TFRs are not buried in the
clutter of irrelevant NOTAMS.


So the telephone briefing is preferred because it's more likely to be
incomplete?

So the telephone briefing is preferred because it's more likely to be
incomplete?

Yes.

"All available information" is the way lawyers beat their opponents to
death. That's what a machine briefing gives you - reams and reams of
stuff that doesn't matter or says the same thing, and you have to read
through it all to find the one or two bits that do matter.

With a telephone briefing, I'm dealing with a person who has been doing
this all day, and is already familiar with the situation. I get the
picture without the noise.

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jose" wrote in message
. net...

So the telephone briefing is preferred because it's more likely to be
incomplete?


Yes.

"All available information" is the way lawyers beat their opponents to
death. That's what a machine briefing gives you - reams and reams of
stuff that doesn't matter or says the same thing, and you have to read
through it all to find the one or two bits that do matter.

With a telephone briefing, I'm dealing with a person who has been doing
this all day, and is already familiar with the situation. I get the
picture without the noise.


It appears you've never actually used DUAT. It doesn't give you reams and
reams of stuff that doesn't matter or says the same thing that you have to
read through find the one or two bits that do matter. It allows you to
tailor the briefing to fit your needs. If you're not interested in some
information don't select it and it won't be provided. You don't have to
read through anything you don't want.

Oh, by the way, you can't actually get pictures with a telephone briefing,
but you can with DUAT.

If you're not interested in some
information don't select it and it won't be provided. You don't have to
read through anything you don't want.

I don't know that I'm not interested in it until I read it. A telephone
briefer has already read it.

Oh, by the way, you can't actually get pictures with a telephone briefing,
but you can with DUAT.

I get my pictures with CIRRUS (which is, I suppose a DUATs interface),
AccuWeather, and Unisis. Other places too, depending.

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.