In Flight computers and softwa

Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. (I have mastered sink) I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? Software? What can it do? The best device for those of us technically challenged?

Walt

On Nov 13, 6:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.
wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? *Software? *What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged? *

Walt

--
Walt Connelly

[And before somebody else bites, a PDA and soaring software is not
_necessary_ to proceed with this sport. But they can be useful.]

Ask your local XC pilots what they use and starting there is likely a
very good place. You'll be able to get help on how to use this stuff.
Most software can do way more than what a new pilot needs and knowing
how to turn off much of the junk is a good start.

Leading software packages include

SeeYou Mobile
XC Soar
LK 8000
Winpilot

The PDA market is kind of dead so choices of what PDA or PNA devices
(Portable Navigation Assistant) devices you run this stuff on is a bit
more complex. And choices of hardware may depend on if you want to
plug into a flight computer (like a Cambridge 302) to get better wind
data etc. or whether you just want to use a stand-alone GPS in the PNA/
PDA. Naviter did the Oudie which is a bundled PNA and SeeYou Mobile to
address some of the hassles with current PNA/PDA devices. The Oudie is
good for people who do not want to monkey around with technology.

You should ask local pilots if you can look at their PDAs in sunlight
(including wearing the sunglasses you fly with). You may be very
dissapointed in the daylight visibility of PDA/PNA devices. There are
more expensive solutions to that (e.g. the LX Mini Map).

You need t think about how to mount this stuff so its easy to se and
safe and powered properly. If you are flying club or rental gliders
the mounts available there may dictate what hardware to purchase.

---

Most of these programs have a simulator mode and some have simulator
software you can run on a PC. Using those features to learn the
software is really invaluable. The more technically savvy folks can
also drive any of these products with the NMEA data-out from soaring
simulators like Condor or Silent Wings and that's an even richer
environment to learn the products and play with advanced features
(like the current changes to contest Start features in SeeYou
Mobile...).

You did not talk about your goals etc, but if you are serious about
starting XC flying one of the best technology purchases you can make
is SeeYou (the desktop PC program not SeeYou Mobile). That lets you
analyze your own and other flights etc. What you use on the PDA.
Whatever of these soaring software you purchase you should purchase
SeeYou (for your PC) as well.

Darryl

On 11/13/2010 7:14 AM, Walt Connelly wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. (I have mastered sink)
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? Software? What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged?

Walt

Welcome to a life-changingly wonderful activity, Walt...and to RAS too! :-)

Have fun, too, researching your above-posed question(s); such self-education
truly is yet another fun part of immersion in soaring.

That said, do be aware your 'necessary' (above) may be a tad strong. My ship's
'electrical system' consists anymore of a handheld radio and a
hat-brim-mounted Malletec audio-only, uncompensated vario. At its finest, the
ship's electrical system substituted a panel-mounted Ball electric
analog/audio/uncompensated vario for the Malletec (an inherited panel mounted
radio never worked). Once, I considered flying with a loaned flight logger,
but personal laziness won over messing with an 'installation.' Yet, somehow,
(after mastering sink) sufficient mastery of sink's 'light-side' brother and
off-field landing basics led to an adult lifetime of crewless (in the
pre-arranged sense) XC, almost exclusively of the O&R sort. Landed out a few
times, had/made some really fun retrieves, never been lost, never even
experienced an overnighter. I've no doubt many of my contemporaries'
experiences would be similar.

Point being, do keep in mind during your research that simplification has its
own virtues!

May your soaring experiences be long and wondrous...

Dinosaurically,
Bob W.

On Nov 13, 12:08*pm, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On Nov 13, 6:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.

wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? *Software? *What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged? *

Walt

--
Walt Connelly

[And before somebody else bites, a PDA and soaring software is not
_necessary_ to proceed with this sport. But they can be useful.]

Ask your local XC pilots what they use and starting there is likely a
very good place. You'll be able to get help on how to use this stuff.
Most software can do way more than what a new pilot needs and knowing
how to turn off much of the junk is a good start.

Leading software packages include

SeeYou Mobile
XC Soar
LK 8000
Winpilot

The PDA market is kind of dead so choices of what PDA or PNA devices
(Portable Navigation Assistant) devices you run this stuff on is a bit
more complex. And choices of hardware may depend on if you want to
plug into a flight computer (like a Cambridge 302) to get better wind
data etc. or whether you just want to use a stand-alone GPS in the PNA/
PDA. Naviter did the Oudie which is a bundled PNA and SeeYou Mobile to
address some of the hassles with current PNA/PDA devices. The Oudie is
good for people who do not want to monkey around with technology.

You should ask local pilots if you can look at their PDAs in sunlight
(including wearing the sunglasses you fly with). You may be very
dissapointed in the daylight visibility of PDA/PNA devices. There are
more expensive solutions to that (e.g. the LX Mini Map).

You need t think about how to mount this stuff so its easy to se and
safe and powered properly. If you are flying club or rental gliders
the mounts available there may dictate what hardware to purchase.

---

Most of these programs have a simulator mode and some have simulator
software you can run on a PC. Using those features to learn the
software is really invaluable. The more technically savvy folks can
also drive any of these products with the NMEA data-out from soaring
simulators like Condor or Silent Wings and that's an even richer
environment to learn the products and play with advanced features
(like the current changes to contest Start features in SeeYou
Mobile...).

You did not talk about your goals etc, but if you are serious about
starting XC flying one of the best technology purchases you can make
is SeeYou (the desktop PC program not SeeYou Mobile). That lets you
analyze your own and other flights etc. What you use on the PDA.
Whatever of these soaring software you purchase you should purchase
SeeYou (for your PC) as well.

Darryl

Even though I am a big SeeYouMobile fan I think I can give objective
advice. Look to your local pilots and what they use. If they are happy
to help you and they all use XC Soar I would use that. If you don't
like to screw around with software and don't mind paying some bucks go
with SYM, it is just so painless.

As to devices, probably the HP310 solution could be picked up cheap
somewhere and then you could trade up later and keep the HP310 for a
spare, or you could Oudie. Again your local pilots would be a great
help, but right now it is tricky as new options are coming on line.

I like to fly with very large text, no terrain, and very little
information; mostly what landing place I can make and by how much,
plus bearing to get there. That would be a good start and increase the
safety of your flights as opposed to making them more dangerous.

Brian

On Nov 13, 9:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.
wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? *Software? *What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged? *

Walt

--
Walt Connelly

Try a combination of SoarPilot (http://www.soaringpilot.org/), a Palm
Tungsten T, and a Magellan GPS Companion for the M500. SoarPilot is a
very capable and well-supported cross-country soaring program, and the
Palm Tungsten T with its transreflective screen is one of the most
sunlight-readable displays available. The Magellan GPS Companion is a
'sled' that fits onto the back of a Tungsten T and not only provides
GPS input, but also allows the combination to be powered from the
ship's 12V battery (or a small 12v auxiliary battery if you don't have
ship power). I have used one of these setups for years from
beginning X-C to full-out racing contests, and it hasn't run out of
steam yet. The SoarPilot program is free from the above site, and the
Tungsten T and Magellan GPS units can be found on eBay for a pittance
(a friend recently purchased a T, a GPS Companion, and the nice auto
suction mount for $40 US total).

Frank (TA)

On Nov 13, 7:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.
wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? *Software? *What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged? *

Walt

--
Walt Connelly

You'll get good advice from many sources. However, one which might
not be mentioned is this technology is undergoing rapid change. Any
'best' system will be state-of-the-art for no more than one season.
With this in mind, one could argue not 'painting yourself into a
corner' with expensive 'permanent' installations would be a good
strategy.

I would venture a guess the pending release of a vast number of
"tablet" computers of various sized and capabilities will have an
impact. Their greater screen "real estate" will allow software
programmers more freedom to offer advanced features. Internet
connectivity and sheer computing power will offer yet more.

On Nov 13, 4:26*pm, bildan wrote:
On Nov 13, 7:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.

wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? *Software? *What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged? *

Walt

--
Walt Connelly

You'll get good advice from many sources. *However, one which might
not be mentioned is this technology is undergoing rapid change. *Any
'best' system will be state-of-the-art for no more than one season.
With this in mind, one could argue not 'painting yourself into a
corner' with expensive 'permanent' installations would be a good
strategy.

I would venture a guess the pending release of a vast number of
"tablet" computers of various sized and capabilities will have an
impact. * Their greater screen "real estate" will allow software
programmers more freedom to offer advanced features. *Internet
connectivity and sheer computing power will offer yet more.

Walt, I can show you see you/ Ipaq 3900 pda and the Oudie. Just stop
by my house at the North end of SLGP.
KG

On Nov 13, 9:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.
wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
...

Walt

Walt,

Until you have mastered LIFT, there is no need for those gadgets. So
concentrate on a good audio vario and practice climbing.

When your thermalling is good enough for XC flight. I recommend Seeyou
mobile with some sort of hand held device that can be removed from the
cockpit.

Todd Smith
3S

On Nov 13, 8:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.
wrote:
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? *Software? *What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged? *

Walt

--
Walt Connelly

What are you flying? Do you own or rent? What equipment/instruments
are installed in the ships you fly?

[quote=Westbender;754852]On Nov 13, 8:14*am, Walt Connelly Walt.Connelly.
wrote:[color=blue][i]
Okay folks, I am a rather new glider pilot, about 120 flights within the
last year and maybe close to 100 hours aloft. *(I have mastered sink) *
I am beginning to acquire the gadgets necessary to proceed with this
sport and was looking for some input on those little PDA type devices I
see people poking with a stylus before take off.

Any recommendations on the best one to have? *Software? *What can it do?
The best device for those of us technically challenged? *

Walt

Thanks to all of you for your information and input. I will be seeking some guidance from the more experienced pilots at SLGP. Kilo Zulu and Golf and a few others have come thru with some good advice. I have a good wrist mounted audio vario because most rentals don't have audio and I don't like flying with my head inside the cockpit any more than necessary, especially in a thermal. I wouldn't say I have mastered lift as yet but I have managed to stay up 2.5 hours on a couple of occasions, although a full garbage can may well have done the same on those days. What an addiction.

Walt