Stop the noise

"airads" wrote in message
om...
Now they want the FAA to require A/C registration numbers to be
enlarged and located under the wings "where they belong".

On this side of the pond, you have to have your registration on the
underside of your left wing anyway.

D.

"David Cartwright" wrote in message
...
"airads" wrote in message
om...
Now they want the FAA to require A/C registration numbers to be
enlarged and located under the wings "where they belong".

On this side of the pond, you have to have your registration on the
underside of your left wing anyway.

Which country is that?

Paul

On 20 Mar 2004 08:08:57 -0800, (airads) wrote:

Feb. 24 - The Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association on Tuesday
provided initial support to four Massachusetts pilots - all AOPA
members - facing a lawsuit filed by a few residents. The suit alleges
that the noise signature from the aerobatics performed by the pilots
caused significant harm; they are seeking approximately $1 million in
damages. The pilots are based at various airports, some 20 miles from
the homes of the litigants.

"This is potentially an issue that could affect all pilots engaged in
any type of air commerce - from a Cub to a 747," said AOPA President
Phil Boyer. "We are fully prepared to take this through the federal
system if necessary.

I wonder if they've considered getting a "junk yard lawyer" and
counter suit for harrasment.

If the AOPA is serious they really need to come up with a good
countersuit that would cost those filing the original lawsuit far more
than what they are aksing. That they have caused great financial harm
(pilots having to sell planes to meet expenses) is already an arguing
point.

I think in these cases we should not just fight the case but take
agressive counter action "if possible" that would make those
considering similar actions in the future to back up and consider the
consequences.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com



http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/newsite...04-1-108x.html

Frank

Roger Halstead wrote:

If the AOPA is serious they really need to come up with a good
countersuit that would cost those filing the original lawsuit far more
than what they are aksing.

The problem there is that they have formed an organization, and it is the org
that is sueing these pilots. You don't have grounds for a countersuit unless this
one is settled in favor of the pilots. After that occurs, they'll disolve the
organization, and you won't have anyone to sue. Furthermore, AOPA has not been
injured by this suit, so they will not be able to file a countersuit (though
they could certainly support the pilots financially if they decide to do so).

George Patterson
Battle, n; A method of untying with the teeth a political knot that would
not yield to the tongue.

Furthermore, AOPA has not been
injured by this suit, so they will not be able to file a countersuit (though
they could certainly support the pilots financially if they decide to do so).

According to AOPA Pilot, they have indeed made "a substantial
contribution" to defense costs.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (requires authentication)

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

Cub Driver wrote:


Furthermore, AOPA has not been
injured by this suit, so they will not be able to file a countersuit
(though they could certainly support the pilots financially if they decide
to do so).

According to AOPA Pilot, they have indeed made "a substantial
contribution" to defense costs.

Yet the pilots still had to sell their aircraft?

- Andrew

On Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:19:03 -0500, Andrew Gideon
wrote:

Cub Driver wrote:


Furthermore, AOPA has not been
injured by this suit, so they will not be able to file a countersuit
(though they could certainly support the pilots financially if they decide
to do so).

According to AOPA Pilot, they have indeed made "a substantial
contribution" to defense costs.

Yet the pilots still had to sell their aircraft?

They don't have the benefit of their lawyers doing everything for
free.

According to AOPA Pilot, they have indeed made "a substantial
contribution" to defense costs.

Yet the pilots still had to sell their aircraft?

Evidently so.

I rather doubt that AOPA;'s contribution was large enough for them to
want to buy back the airplanes. I don't know if Boston lawyers bill
$400 an hour, but I am sure they earn more an hour than I do in a day.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (requires authentication)

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

"G.R. Patterson III" wrote
The problem there is that they have formed an organization, and it is the
org
that is sueing these pilots. You don't have grounds for a countersuit
unless this
one is settled in favor of the pilots. After that occurs, they'll disolve
the
organization, and you won't have anyone to sue.

Actually the complaint was not filed by the organization, but by
individuals, it can be seen at
http://www.stopthenoise.org/docs/COMPLAINT.ammended.pdf

Plaintiffs:
Robert F. Casey, Jr. 92 Washington Street, Ayer, Massachusetts. This
presumably is the lawyer that someone said is donating his time, but is also
a Plaintiff.
Rita A. Casey, 92 Washington Street, Ayer, Massachusetts
David McCoy, 187 Old Groton Road, Ayer, Massachusetts
Amy McCoy, 187 Old Groton Road, Ayer, Massachusetts
Gerard Hall, 34 Lovett Lane, Chelmsford, Massachusetts.
Beverly Smith, 435 Old Ayer Road, Groton, Massachusetts
------------------------------------------------------------------
The STN site is pretty low tech and a bunch of rambling nonsense. I like
this quote "FAA is an organization of General Aviation pilots tasked with
policing, among other things, General Aviation". Really?
And "It is not our intent to shut down General Aviation", yet a couple
months
ago, this same guy, Bill Burgoyne, said "There is no reason people need to
have them (small airplanes) for transportation as private vehicles"
article at
http://www.generalaviationnews.com/e...olumn&-nothing

Another website, that is a little more professionally done and more
objective is
http://www.planesenseofgroton.org/
although they are publicly posting N-numbers of airplanes that offend them.
Is
that legal?

And if you want to see the height of anti aviation fascism, check out
http://pages.prodigy.net/rockaway/newsletter229.htm
Anyone else seen this garbage? These people have way too much time on
their hands.

And http://www.us-caw.org/ US Citizens Aviation Watch. Check the link for
Monitored Airports, see if you're being watched.

I know I'm not alone in these groups that this is all very disturbing.
Especially if you are operating legally within the regs and being threatened
in one way or another. I was once, ONCE. (Johnny Dangerously reference).
Time to take the
fight back to them.
Chris

On Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:24:25 GMT, "SeeAndAvoid"
wrote:

"G.R. Patterson III" wrote
The problem there is that they have formed an organization, and it is the
org
that is sueing these pilots. You don't have grounds for a countersuit
unless this
one is settled in favor of the pilots. After that occurs, they'll disolve
the
organization, and you won't have anyone to sue.

Actually the complaint was not filed by the organization, but by
individuals, it can be seen at
http://www.stopthenoise.org/docs/COMPLAINT.ammended.pdf

Plaintiffs:
Robert F. Casey, Jr. 92 Washington Street, Ayer, Massachusetts. This
presumably is the lawyer that someone said is donating his time, but is also
a Plaintiff.
Rita A. Casey, 92 Washington Street, Ayer, Massachusetts
David McCoy, 187 Old Groton Road, Ayer, Massachusetts
Amy McCoy, 187 Old Groton Road, Ayer, Massachusetts
Gerard Hall, 34 Lovett Lane, Chelmsford, Massachusetts.
Beverly Smith, 435 Old Ayer Road, Groton, Massachusetts
------------------------------------------------------------------
The STN site is pretty low tech and a bunch of rambling nonsense. I like
this quote "FAA is an organization of General Aviation pilots tasked with
policing, among other things, General Aviation". Really?
And "It is not our intent to shut down General Aviation", yet a couple
months
ago, this same guy, Bill Burgoyne, said "There is no reason people need to
have them (small airplanes) for transportation as private vehicles"
article at
http://www.generalaviationnews.com/e...olumn&-nothing

Another website, that is a little more professionally done and more
objective is
http://www.planesenseofgroton.org/
although they are publicly posting N-numbers of airplanes that offend them.
Is
that legal?


And if you want to see the height of anti aviation fascism, check out
http://pages.prodigy.net/rockaway/newsletter229.htm
Anyone else seen this garbage? These people have way too much time on
their hands.

I may be wrong, but it seems like "ol' Bill" tried to get his license
once and failed. Now has it in for anything to do with aviation.
Course I could just be mis-remembering. That did happen one time when
I thought I was wrong, but really was so... never mind.



And http://www.us-caw.org/ US Citizens Aviation Watch. Check the link for
Monitored Airports, see if you're being watched.

Most, but certainly not all are a bunch of nut cases. There are some
level headed ones who just don't like the noise, but if you follow the
noise pollution newsgroups you will see about 90% of the posts come
from only a few people who are just plain not rational.

However they do pose a threat to aviation in general, not just general
aviation. Some of them are pretty radical.


I know I'm not alone in these groups that this is all very disturbing.
Especially if you are operating legally within the regs and being threatened
in one way or another. I was once, ONCE. (Johnny Dangerously reference).
Time to take the
fight back to them.

When it comes to law I know about zip, but I learned two things from a
friend who is a lawyer.

In cases like this where they are obviously trying to intimidate and
harass the pilots, if at all possible file counter suits in amounts
large enough it will scare off all but the diehards and if you win
it'll make your lawyers rich. The other is you really do get all the
justice you can afford, unless you are very, very lucky.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Chris