Ramp checked at AVP today

What is
"He can check the
aircraft for the required anti-drug exterior data plate." ?

Also, since I fly a citabria there really isn't any where to put very
much stuff. I have one of the multi-compartment bags that hangs off
the back of an automobile seat bungeed in the baggage compartment
(couldn't see spending the premium for the "aviation" bag from
Sporty's). I carry the certificates, POH, W&B chart. I also have the
W&B plugged into my GPS. Does that count if I didn't, although I do,
have a paper copy of the W&B?

Does a fresh printout from aeroplanner count as a current chart?

Dave
68 7ECA

"dave" wrote in message
...

W&B plugged into my GPS. Does that count if I didn't, although I do,
have a paper copy of the W&B?

Only the W&B form signed by a mechanic counts as the legally required W&B --
a GPS database does not suffice.

Does a fresh printout from aeroplanner count as a current chart?

There is no legal requirement for you to carry VFR charts period -- just a
requirement that you obtain all necessary information before the flight.
For IFR you would be unable to accept airways clearances or deal with lost
communication procedures without charts, so charts are required there as
part of the requirement for appropriate navigation equipment.

--------------------
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

There is no legal requirement for you to carry VFR charts period -- just a
requirement that you obtain all necessary information before the flight.

I've been told (never been ramp-checked myself) that the FAA guy can
interpret this to mean that your chart must be current.

(That is, you don't have to carry a chart, but you may not carry a
chart that is out of date.)

And it would seem that, if you irritated the inspector by say refusing
to let go of your pilot certificate, he could declare on the spot
that, obviously, "all necessary information" includes a chart!

Personally, I would rather not take the chance.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com
Viva Bush! blog www.vivabush.org

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...


I've been told (never been ramp-checked myself) that the FAA guy can
interpret this to mean that your chart must be current.

I know this is a prevalent story, but I have never read of any enforcement
action on this.

It is very clear that the FAA's standard does not require any sectional
chart at all for flight in your traffic pattern or the immediate vicinity of
your airport. Is having an old chart onboard worse than no chart? No.

I always do have current charts onboard for wherever I plan to fly, and when
I fly cross-country I often carry with me expired charts for areas quite a
bit off course but where theoretically I might divert in a doomsday
situation. Does having those just-in-case expired charts make me less
safe? No, of course not.

Again, I do not believe there has ever been an enforcement action on this
issue, nor could/should there be one.

Again, you DO clearly need current IFR charts -- but even there, what's
wrong with carrying expired charts for places you don't plan to go unless
some one-in-a-million weather or mechanical event occurs?

--------------------
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

(No chart okay, out-of-date chart bad

I know this is a prevalent story, but I have never read of any enforcement
action on this.

Thanks for the added information.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com
Viva Bush! blog www.vivabush.org

Again, you DO clearly need current IFR charts --

Although I can't imagine setting off on an IFR flight without a
current IFR chart, it is not requried to have ANY chart on an IFR
flight! If you get to your destination without a problem fine.

If you cause a problem, though, you'll have some explaining to do.

vince norris

vincent p. norris wrote in
:

Again, you DO clearly need current IFR charts --

Although I can't imagine setting off on an IFR flight without a
current IFR chart, it is not requried to have ANY chart on an IFR
flight! If you get to your destination without a problem fine.

If you cause a problem, though, you'll have some explaining to do.

vince norris

Except taht if you cause a problem, whether the chart is current or not is
not going to make any difference.

If you cause a problem, though, you'll have some explaining to do.

That reminds me of what my flight instructor said on the subject of
whether the FAA actually requires a certificated pilot or mechanic at
the controls when you are propping a plane: "Dan, there are a whole
lot of reasons why you would not want this to become an issue."


all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com
Viva Bush! blog www.vivabush.org

That reminds me of what my flight instructor said on the subject of
whether the FAA actually requires a certificated pilot or mechanic at
the controls when you are propping a plane: "Dan, there are a whole
lot of reasons why you would not want this to become an issue."

Many years ago at OSH, as I remember the report, some idiot propped a
plane with no one in it. It got away from him and cut both legs off
a girl sleeping in a tent nearby.

Painful even to think of something so horrible, but I've never been
able to forget it.

vince norris

vincent p. norris wrote in message . ..
Again, you DO clearly need current IFR charts --

Although I can't imagine setting off on an IFR flight without a
current IFR chart, it is not requried to have ANY chart on an IFR
flight! If you get to your destination without a problem fine.

If you cause a problem, though, you'll have some explaining to do.

vince norris

Maybe from a literal reading context under part 91. But the
individual ops specs of FAR135 or FAR121 will specifiy what pubs
crewmembers must carry. But still Vince, I just can't buy this even
under part 91. The careless and reckless part of the regs will always
be applicable. And the FAA may require an IFR proficiency check on
your ass. If you show up without charts the check is over before it
even starts.

I once was jumpseating on an MD-11 from HKG to OAK. The Captain felt
that way and just decided that he'd use the F/O's Jepps that trip so
he left his at home(what an asshole.) Anyway the co-pilot pulls out
his STAR that ATC just cleared him on and sets it on the center
pedastal in front of the thrust levers so that both pilots could see
the arrival. We didn't see it happen, but I've witnessed this befo
It just disappeared! Suction from avionics fans probably slurpped it
down the crack! I made the mistake of telling the captain about this
possibility as he was blaming the F/O for losing it. The Capt then
asks me to tear up the floor hatch behind him and go down in the "hell
hole" and look for it. That was the end of my white shirt! About
like an MIR space station EVA. Took a couple of minutes hanging
upside down just to look for the damned avionics bay light switch down
there. Then it was a real snake act to get my fat body through the
tiny hole and traverse over up under the center cockpit. Never did
find it.

Moral of the story: carry your ****ing charts, dammit!

pacplyer - out