Nasa Icing courses

Scott Draper wrote:
Not everyone receives or subscribes to *every* newsgroup.

That's because we want to choose what we download.

Well you chose to download it.

Icing is mostly
relevant to IFR flight.


Not true. Unless you want to bend thoughts one way only. And I see your
need to do so. I would not advocate vfr pilots follow your lead of
practicing non-enlightenment. Around the great lakes here we get
moisture, higher up icing, farther away icing, and higher and farther it
is snow. VFR pilots here contend with this, lots. The IFR planes are
known icing approved. So would you advocate the ifr pilots not learn
about icing as they can just push a button to shed it?

And if you would bother to look and read before you bash, you would see
that there is also a course on ground icing also.

Both are very applicable to vfr flying.

Somehow I just know you are 'really good' at Microsoft flightsimulator.

I have not looked at the courses yet but I see no harm in them. Take
your electrons to the recycle bin.

It was a good post and I am glad to have run accross it.

I would not advocate vfr pilots follow your lead of
practicing non-enlightenment.

That's a ridiculous mischaracterization of what I said.

I did say that icing applies *mostly* to IFR pilots and that remains
true. That isn't the same as saying that VFR pilots *never* have to
worry about icing.

Your post was a mixture of ad hominem and straw man arguments.

Say what you want, the OP was just fine in what he did.




Scott Draper wrote:
I would not advocate vfr pilots follow your lead of
practicing non-enlightenment.

That's a ridiculous mischaracterization of what I said.

I did say that icing applies *mostly* to IFR pilots and that remains
true. That isn't the same as saying that VFR pilots *never* have to
worry about icing.

Your post was a mixture of ad hominem and straw man arguments.

"Scott Draper" wrote in message
...
That's because we want to choose what we download. Icing is mostly
relevant to IFR flight.

If everyone did what you did, there'd be no point to having multiple
groups.

While I agree with you that the original post was over-cross-posted, it
seems to me that the only newsgroup that was blatantly off-topic for the
post was r.a.owning.

It seems to me that airframe icing is primarily an IFR issue, possibly of
interest to people reading r.a.piloting, and hardly applicable to people
involved in their primary training (the main audience in r.a.student). But
a person who lacks a conservative bent, a person who doesn't understand why
it's a good thing to be VERY minimal about cross-posting, they aren't going
to see it that way.

They are going to think "well, this *might* be of interest to someone who
*might* be reading that newsgroup", and they (or similar-minded folks) are
going to get all bent out of shape if you try to suggest otherwise.

Which is, in fact, what happened so far.

Of course, your original reply was somewhat exaggerated as well (there
*were* plenty of rec.aviation.* newsgroups that didn't get the post). I'm
sure that didn't help the mood.

Pete

it seems to me that the only newsgroup that was blatantly off-topic
for the post was r.a.owning.

I agree that it's arguably on topic for most of the groups, but so is
almost *every* topic. After all, what doesn't apply to the "piloting"
group? And aren't we all "students" of some sort?

The overlap of readership among the groups makes cross-posting
redundant. My observation is that it's mostly newbies that do it.

Of course, your original reply was somewhat exaggerated as well

Artistic license? ;-)

("Peter Duniho" wrote)
[snip]
It seems to me that airframe icing is primarily an IFR issue, possibly of
interest to people reading r.a.piloting, and hardly applicable to people
involved in their primary training (the main audience in r.a.student).


Jim (OP) has experience with people involved in their primary training.

Weather is taught to VFR primary students, why not icing?

"Clouds ......recognize and avoid!"
"T-storms ...recognize and avoid!"
"Icing ..........recognize and avoid!"


Montblack

"Montblack" wrote in message
...
Jim (OP) has experience with people involved in their primary training.

Weather is taught to VFR primary students, why not icing?

Because they have enough to learn already?

Seriously though, a primary student's knowledge of icing need not extend
much further than "don't fly when freezing rain is forecast". For extra
credit, a short discussion of what causes freezing rain might be called for.

Most icing occurs inside a cloud, and VFR pilots should not have to worry
about that, or anything else that might happen inside a cloud.

But more importantly (and more to the point) the r.a.student newsgroup is
more about the process of learning to fly, and especially as it applies to
primary students, than it is about any random topic a pilot might be
educated on. Here's the charter:

It's been said that every good pilot is a student pilot -- for
life. This group is dedicated to learning experiences and questions,
particularly (but not exclusively) by and for those who haven't
yet attained the private pilot certificate. Written exams, solo
flights, learning to land, maneuvers, flight tests, instructors
and instructional techniques, etc.

Pete

Peter Duniho wrote:
Weather is taught to VFR primary students, why not icing?

Because they have enough to learn already?

Seriously though, a primary student's knowledge of icing need not extend
much further than "don't fly when freezing rain is forecast". For extra
credit, a short discussion of what causes freezing rain might be called for.

I disagree; have you hung around the airport, early in the morning,
on a gorgeous winter day, perfect VFR day, but very cold and all the
aircraft on the ramp have frost or ice on them? you wouldn't believe
the number of folks who don't understand that just brushing off the
worst of it is not good enough...

--Sylvain

Pete,
I have read and participate in r.a.s for the last few years. The
newsgroup is not 'restricted' to primary students. There are many
instrument/comercial etc. students there as well and IMHO, the
learnings are never stopped for all pilots.

The website link which Jim provided has section on ground icing as
well. The information benefits all pilots and not just IFR rated
pilots.

Again, IMHO, there are no such things as too much information when
it comes to safety issues. Weather is totally unpredictable, VFR
pilots can encounter icing unintentionally. I had posted the account
of my first encounter with freezing rain about this time last year (not
in weather forecast, we were not in the cloud). What happened to us
could have happened to many pilots including primary students on a
solo VFR flight.

Any perceived problem with cross postings of on-topic subject is
quite insignificant in comparison to the numerous off topic, thread
hijacking branching out to politic and religious discussions seen at
rec.avatiation newgroups!

Hai Longworth

Scott Draper wrote:

Please don't crosspost to *every* aviation newsgroup.



Please don't you post at all.

Matt