Commercial rating?

(from Peter Duniho)
You keep forgetting the "commercial operation" component of the issue.
Without compensation, there is no holding out as a commercial operation.

Maybe (only maybe) so, but the FAA has rather creative definitions of
"compensation". I would never have considered recording the flight in a
logbook (a history of what actually happened) "compensation", nor does
it seem right that the fact that I can use this experience (which
actually happened) to demonstrate to the FAA that I am worthy of an
advanced rating to be "compensation" either.

(from Jim Macklin)
Any private pilot may offer, on a bulletin board a FREE ride
home. But if you are wanting to share the cost, several
checks are required.
1. The pilot is going anyway, whether anybody else wants to
go.
2. The offer cannot be made as a public offering, but only
to friends.
3. Costs must be shared which means the pilot must pay at
least the pro rata share, your passengers cannot pay all the
costs.

1 and 2 are not enumerated in the FARs. They are made up out of whole
cloth. The FAA can do that and get away with it.

And as for (1), "I am going to fly for three hours =anyway=. Wanna come
with me? I don't care where we go."

Legal? Where in the FARs?

Having made the offer, and having no takers, is it legal to consider the
weather, the condition of the aircraft, and the condition of the pilot,
and decide to not fly?

Jose
--
Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

The FAA lawyers make the rules. For instance, a brand new
private pilot may change a tire, but cannot work on the
brakes on the same wheel.



--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Jose" wrote in message
et...
| (from Peter Duniho)
| You keep forgetting the "commercial operation" component
of the issue.
| Without compensation, there is no holding out as a
commercial operation.
|
| Maybe (only maybe) so, but the FAA has rather creative
definitions of
| "compensation". I would never have considered recording
the flight in a
| logbook (a history of what actually happened)
"compensation", nor does
| it seem right that the fact that I can use this experience
(which
| actually happened) to demonstrate to the FAA that I am
worthy of an
| advanced rating to be "compensation" either.
|
| (from Jim Macklin)
| Any private pilot may offer, on a bulletin board a FREE
ride
| home. But if you are wanting to share the cost, several
| checks are required.
| 1. The pilot is going anyway, whether anybody else wants
to
| go.
| 2. The offer cannot be made as a public offering, but
only
| to friends.
| 3. Costs must be shared which means the pilot must pay
at
| least the pro rata share, your passengers cannot pay all
the
| costs.
|
| 1 and 2 are not enumerated in the FARs. They are made up
out of whole
| cloth. The FAA can do that and get away with it.
|
| And as for (1), "I am going to fly for three hours
=anyway=. Wanna come
| with me? I don't care where we go."
|
| Legal? Where in the FARs?
|
| Having made the offer, and having no takers, is it legal
to consider the
| weather, the condition of the aircraft, and the condition
of the pilot,
| and decide to not fly?
|
| Jose
| --
| Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
| for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

The FAA lawyers make the rules. For instance, a brand new
private pilot may change a tire, but cannot work on the
brakes on the same wheel.

Yes, but those rules are written down in a place labled "rules", where
we can all see them. The FAA also makes other rules that it keeps to
itself, and trots them out when convenient. Their definition of
"compensation" is one such.

Jose
--
Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:JktPf.116461$QW2.88175@dukeread08...
The FAA lawyers make the rules. For instance, a brand new
private pilot may change a tire, but cannot work on the
brakes on the same wheel.

My wife and daughter can change a tire on the car, but neither of them could
do a brake job on those cars.

Changing a tire on an airplane requires removal of the brake
assembly, perhaps splitting the wheel halves and installing
the new tire on the old wheel and properly torquring the
wheel bolts. Then the wheel must be installed after packing
the cleaned and inspected wheel bearing.

Changing a tire on an airplane is more like changing the
front hub on a car.

The FAA assumes that all work allowed under the term,
"preventative maintenance" by a private pilot will be done
using the tools, techniques and procedures as a licensed A&P
would use. On my car, I can do just as most oil change
shops do, get under the vehicle, remove the drain plug,
remove the old oil filter, reinstall the drain plug, install
a new oil filter, then pour 4 or 5 quarts of oil in the
engine. An aircraft oil change requires the additional
steps of cleaning oil screens and inspecting for metal and
cutting the old oil filter open and examining the paper for
metal.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:JktPf.116461$QW2.88175@dukeread08...
| The FAA lawyers make the rules. For instance, a brand
new
| private pilot may change a tire, but cannot work on the
| brakes on the same wheel.
|
| My wife and daughter can change a tire on the car, but
neither of them could
| do a brake job on those cars.
|
|
|
|

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:wLDPf.116565$QW2.26150@dukeread08...
Changing a tire on an airplane requires removal of the brake
assembly, perhaps splitting the wheel halves and installing
the new tire on the old wheel and properly torquring the
wheel bolts. Then the wheel must be installed after packing
the cleaned and inspected wheel bearing.

Changing a tire on an airplane is more like changing the
front hub on a car.

Okay...now describe the steps and skills involved in doing a brake job.

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:JktPf.116461$QW2.88175@dukeread08...
| The FAA lawyers make the rules. For instance, a brand
new
| private pilot may change a tire, but cannot work on the
| brakes on the same wheel.
|
| My wife and daughter can change a tire on the car, but
neither of them could
| do a brake job on those cars.
|
|
|
|

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:wLDPf.116565$QW2.26150@dukeread08...
[...]
Changing a tire on an airplane is more like changing the
front hub on a car.

Okay...now describe the steps and skills involved in doing a brake job.

Why should he?

The point is not how complex the task is. It's whether it's allowed under
FAR 43.17(c). Tires changes are. Brake work is not.

Now, that said...a tire change is only permitted "provided it does not
involve complex assembly operations". Jim's description of a tire change is
accurate for many aircraft, but such a tire change may be precluded by the
prohibition against "complex assembly operations". It depends on how the
FAA (i.e. your local inspector) interprets the word "complex".

Jim certainly makes the process *sound* "complex".

I've never heard of a pilot being cited for replacing a tire, but there's
certainly room for equivocation in the regulation.

Pete

I really wanted to point out the need for following the
rules, procedures and techniques for any preventative
maintenance. It takes 2,000 hours of training in the
classroom and shop to qualify for an FAA A&P and that is
really just an entry level. A private pilot requires 40
hours in the airplane flying and the other training
generally just introduces such terms as "magneto, piston,
safety wire."

Each airplane is different and each person doing maintenance
on that airplane is required to follow the manufacturer's
manuals. So to do a "tire change" or replace a battery, you
need to have the manual and any supplementary manuals, the
tools and follow the procedures.

Bottom-line, a pilot who wants to work on "his" airplane
needs instruction. There are training classes available.
--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Peter Duniho" wrote in
message ...
| "Matt Barrow" wrote in message
| ...
|
| "Jim Macklin"
wrote in message
| news:wLDPf.116565$QW2.26150@dukeread08...
| [...]
| Changing a tire on an airplane is more like changing
the
| front hub on a car.
|
| Okay...now describe the steps and skills involved in
doing a brake job.
|
| Why should he?
|
| The point is not how complex the task is. It's whether
it's allowed under
| FAR 43.17(c). Tires changes are. Brake work is not.
|
| Now, that said...a tire change is only permitted "provided
it does not
| involve complex assembly operations". Jim's description
of a tire change is
| accurate for many aircraft, but such a tire change may be
precluded by the
| prohibition against "complex assembly operations". It
depends on how the
| FAA (i.e. your local inspector) interprets the word
"complex".
|
| Jim certainly makes the process *sound* "complex".
|
| I've never heard of a pilot being cited for replacing a
tire, but there's
| certainly room for equivocation in the regulation.
|
| Pete
|
|

On a car or an airplane? Drum brakes, expansion tubes,
mechanical, floating disk (Goodyear) or floating caliper
(Cleveland), multi-disk (King Air or jets)? You must be
specific.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P



--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:wLDPf.116565$QW2.26150@dukeread08...
| Changing a tire on an airplane requires removal of the
brake
| assembly, perhaps splitting the wheel halves and
installing
| the new tire on the old wheel and properly torquring the
| wheel bolts. Then the wheel must be installed after
packing
| the cleaned and inspected wheel bearing.
|
| Changing a tire on an airplane is more like changing the
| front hub on a car.
|
| Okay...now describe the steps and skills involved in doing
a brake job.
|
| "Matt Barrow" wrote in
message
| ...
| |
| | "Jim Macklin"
wrote
| in message
| | news:JktPf.116461$QW2.88175@dukeread08...
| | The FAA lawyers make the rules. For instance, a
brand
| new
| | private pilot may change a tire, but cannot work on
the
| | brakes on the same wheel.
| |
| | My wife and daughter can change a tire on the car, but
| neither of them could
| | do a brake job on those cars.
| |
| |
| |
| |
|
|
|
|