Flying Story

On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:25:41 -0500, "Danny Deger"
wrote:

Here is a flying story for you to enjoy -- I hope. I am almost finished
with a complete book. Anyone know how to get an agent of a publisher?

Danny Deger

Others have already made the obvious comments regarding spelling and
the virtual impossibility of seeing your own errors. Also there are
style questions--different folks like different styles.

This snapshot of the work doesn't really have the "hook" that gets you
a contract, but I assume there is one in the total work. There has to
be some theme, message, coherence, or compelling issue that is going
to get a buyer to shell out the $$$ for your work.

You can "self-publish" or "publish on demand"--these are two aspects
of what is referred to as the "vanity press". Folks want to say
they've written a book, so they pay a couple of thousand dollars to
have a few hundred copies printed up and then distribute them to
friends. I don't recomment that, YMMV.

"When Thunder Rolled" got bought up by the first publisher that read
it. I got a friend who had published several books to give me a
contact name for an acquisition editor and that was all it took.
Smithsonian Books did the job and I didn't use an agent. But,
Smithsonian is a non-profit and not very aggressive in marketing.
Thanks to some friends like RAM's own Dan Ford who got a review
published in the Wall Street Journal, the book did quite well.

"Palace Cobra" originally was contracted to Smithsonian, but they
failed to publish under the contract terms and defaulted. I then found
an agent who marketed the manuscript for me and got it printed by St.
Martin's Press. Better marketing, better contract, better pay-off.

It takes a lot of effort to find a publisher or agent who will take
your work. Scout out the internet for names and contact info. Write or
call and ask if they have an interest. Don't send unsolicitied
manuscripts out!

For most agents and publishers the requirement is a
"proposal"--usually that's a synopsis or executive summary, an
expanded table of contents and two chapters to illustrate your work.
Make sure that the proposal has some teeth; something to really get
them salivating over the book.

The publisher will do the copy edit, the design, the cover art and
maybe more.

Good luck.

Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
www.thunderchief.org
www.thundertales.blogspot.com

In rec.aviation.piloting Ed Rasimus wrote:
On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:25:41 -0500, "Danny Deger"
wrote:

Anyone know how to get an agent of a publisher?

I haven't ever published a book myself, but I have worked for some
(fiction) authors, and from what I understand of the process, Ed Rasimus'
comments are right on. To expand a little on some of the things he said:

You can "self-publish" or "publish on demand"--these are two aspects
of what is referred to as the "vanity press". Folks want to say
they've written a book, so they pay a couple of thousand dollars to
have a few hundred copies printed up and then distribute them to
friends. I don't recomment that, YMMV.

One version of this I've heard is that "as a writer, you should only
ever sign the BACK of a check". In other words, people should be giving
you money, not the other way around. If somebody wants you to give them
money first, be careful.

In fiction, the initial check you get is usually an advance against
royalties. In other words, to make up numbers, if your cut of each book
is $1, and they send you a check for $1000, at least a thousand copies
of the book have to be sold before you get any more money. If the book
sells less than a thousand copies, you owe the difference back to the
publisher. If it sells more, then every so often (maybe quarterly), you
get a check for the additional copies that have sold so far. Non-fiction
may be different.

Thanks to some friends like RAM's own Dan Ford who got a review
published in the Wall Street Journal, the book did quite well.

Depending on the publisher, you will get some amount of support from
them in the form of advertising and promotion. But you can also do your
own promotion. Bookstores usually like to have "local authors" in to
sign books; sometimes they will order some extra copies of your book
for the signing. Sign all the copies they have, even the ones they don't
sell that day - they will put them on the shelf, and signed copies
hardly ever get returned as unsold to the publisher. Talk to your tax
person or attorney, but you may even be able to write off some of your
promotional expense.

It takes a lot of effort to find a publisher or agent who will take
your work. Scout out the internet for names and contact info.

There is (was?) a book called "Writer's Market" that listed the contact
information for many publishers, along with the types of things they
liked to publish. You might also go to the bookstore and see which
publishers are printing similar types of books.

I don't know how true this is in non-fiction, but in fiction, it helps
to have a short story or two published in a magazine or anthology
(collection of short stories). It gives the publisher some assurance
that you know what you're doing. A chapter of your book (with a bit of
editing) might make a good short story in a magazine, BUT the book
publisher may not like the idea of printing something that has already
been partially published. You should probably ask someone with more
current industry information about this.

Matt Roberds

Nice little memoir snippet, Danny. I wouldn't sweat the copyediting
that much at this stage, despite the nitpicking you're getting from
others. I've been a professional writer for more than twenty years and
I would rate your copy as fairly clean for a one-recheck draft.
Contrary to the expectations of non-professionals, fiction editors
don't discount submissions unless the grammar and spelling errors are
well into the low end of egregious. If it's a saleable yarn on first
glance, they won't chuck it into the slush pile.

Editing for the sake of pace, focus, character development, etc.,
however, can be very, very valuable. Unfortunately, an editor who can
provide you with feedback with that level of insight and engagement is
much more rare--and expensive.

As to the biz aspects, Ed's already given you the low-down. I would
especially heed his trenchant comments on what it takes to land a book
contract in the niche market of military aviation memoirs. I would
only add that--and I suspect that Ed was being nice in not mentioning
this--if your flying tales don't include combat experience, they're
going to be real tough to sell. Might want to aim for placing
individual stories with the slicks.

Be ruthless with yourself. Edit like a mofo. And always remember, a
writer is never "through" until the first shovelful of dirt hits
his/her coffin lid.


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"Bill Baker" wrote in message
...
Nice little memoir snippet, Danny. I wouldn't sweat the copyediting that
much at this stage, despite the nitpicking you're getting from others.
I've been a professional writer for more than twenty years and I would
rate your copy as fairly clean for a one-recheck draft. Contrary to the
expectations of non-professionals, fiction editors don't discount
submissions unless the grammar and spelling errors are well into the low
end of egregious. If it's a saleable yarn on first glance, they won't
chuck it into the slush pile.

Editing for the sake of pace, focus, character development, etc., however,
can be very, very valuable. Unfortunately, an editor who can provide you
with feedback with that level of insight and engagement is much more
rare--and expensive.

As to the biz aspects, Ed's already given you the low-down. I would
especially heed his trenchant comments on what it takes to land a book
contract in the niche market of military aviation memoirs. I would only
add that--and I suspect that Ed was being nice in not mentioning this--if
your flying tales don't include combat experience, they're going to be
real tough to sell. Might want to aim for placing individual stories with
the slicks.

Be ruthless with yourself. Edit like a mofo. And always remember, a
writer is never "through" until the first shovelful of dirt hits his/her
coffin lid.


Thanks all for the inputs. I had thought about the lack of combat, but I
have my mental break down because of being bullied at NASA Johnson Space
Center as the climax of the book. With the crazy astronaut and the recent
"postal" employee at NASA, I think my story of "going postal" (but without
any violance) might be worthy of getting published. For example I have
documents to prove NASA lied to the doctors in 1999 to have me locked up
against my will and I have document to prove NASA was involved with a local
judge to prevent me from getting an attorney or a hearing. It is amazing
how much is documented when you are hospitalized. My father tells me they
asked him for permission to erase my memory in 1999. In Feb, 2006 my boss
at the time told me he thought they would have erased my memory if he had
said yes.

Danny Deger


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you might also check on your spell check, you defiantly need help in that
field...
"Danny Deger" wrote in message
...

"Bill Baker" wrote in message
...
Nice little memoir snippet, Danny. I wouldn't sweat the copyediting that
much at this stage, despite the nitpicking you're getting from others.
I've been a professional writer for more than twenty years and I would
rate your copy as fairly clean for a one-recheck draft. Contrary to the
expectations of non-professionals, fiction editors don't discount
submissions unless the grammar and spelling errors are well into the low
end of egregious. If it's a saleable yarn on first glance, they won't
chuck it into the slush pile.

Editing for the sake of pace, focus, character development, etc.,
however, can be very, very valuable. Unfortunately, an editor who can
provide you with feedback with that level of insight and engagement is
much more rare--and expensive.

As to the biz aspects, Ed's already given you the low-down. I would
especially heed his trenchant comments on what it takes to land a book
contract in the niche market of military aviation memoirs. I would only
add that--and I suspect that Ed was being nice in not mentioning this--if
your flying tales don't include combat experience, they're going to be
real tough to sell. Might want to aim for placing individual stories
with the slicks.

Be ruthless with yourself. Edit like a mofo. And always remember, a
writer is never "through" until the first shovelful of dirt hits his/her
coffin lid.


Thanks all for the inputs. I had thought about the lack of combat, but I
have my mental break down because of being bullied at NASA Johnson Space
Center as the climax of the book. With the crazy astronaut and the recent
"postal" employee at NASA, I think my story of "going postal" (but without
any violance) might be worthy of getting published. For example I have
documents to prove NASA lied to the doctors in 1999 to have me locked up
against my will and I have document to prove NASA was involved with a
local judge to prevent me from getting an attorney or a hearing. It is
amazing how much is documented when you are hospitalized. My father tells
me they asked him for permission to erase my memory in 1999. In Feb, 2006
my boss at the time told me he thought they would have erased my memory if
he had said yes.

Danny Deger


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Congratulations on the day's funniest typo.


On Tue, 8 May 2007 21:59:41 -0700, "Meaner than you"
wrote:

you might also check on your spell check, you defiantly need help in that
field...
"Danny Deger" wrote in message
.. .

"Bill Baker" wrote in message
...
Nice little memoir snippet, Danny. I wouldn't sweat the copyediting that
much at this stage, despite the nitpicking you're getting from others.
I've been a professional writer for more than twenty years and I would
rate your copy as fairly clean for a one-recheck draft. Contrary to the
expectations of non-professionals, fiction editors don't discount
submissions unless the grammar and spelling errors are well into the low
end of egregious. If it's a saleable yarn on first glance, they won't
chuck it into the slush pile.

Editing for the sake of pace, focus, character development, etc.,
however, can be very, very valuable. Unfortunately, an editor who can
provide you with feedback with that level of insight and engagement is
much more rare--and expensive.

As to the biz aspects, Ed's already given you the low-down. I would
especially heed his trenchant comments on what it takes to land a book
contract in the niche market of military aviation memoirs. I would only
add that--and I suspect that Ed was being nice in not mentioning this--if
your flying tales don't include combat experience, they're going to be
real tough to sell. Might want to aim for placing individual stories
with the slicks.

Be ruthless with yourself. Edit like a mofo. And always remember, a
writer is never "through" until the first shovelful of dirt hits his/her
coffin lid.


Thanks all for the inputs. I had thought about the lack of combat, but I
have my mental break down because of being bullied at NASA Johnson Space
Center as the climax of the book. With the crazy astronaut and the recent
"postal" employee at NASA, I think my story of "going postal" (but without
any violance) might be worthy of getting published. For example I have
documents to prove NASA lied to the doctors in 1999 to have me locked up
against my will and I have document to prove NASA was involved with a
local judge to prevent me from getting an attorney or a hearing. It is
amazing how much is documented when you are hospitalized. My father tells
me they asked him for permission to erase my memory in 1999. In Feb, 2006
my boss at the time told me he thought they would have erased my memory if
he had said yes.

Danny Deger


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Meaner than you wrote:
you might also check on your spell check, you defiantly need help in that
field...

Now THAT's funny!


Jeff

"Meaner than you" wrote in message
...
you might also check on your spell check, you defiantly need help in that
field...

Unlike you who just uses the wrong word?

Tex

In article ,
"Meaner than you" wrote:

you might also check on your spell check, you defiantly need help in that
field...

I would say that, if you are so defiant, you *DEFINITELY* need help!

"Meaner than you" wrote in message
...
you might also check on your spell check, you defiantly need help in that
field...


LOL!

"Defiantly."

Well, it passed the spell check, didn't it?

-c