I give up, after many, many years!

On May 12, 11:29*am, Le Chaud Lapin wrote:
There are other groups, where the gap between what resident sages know
and what newbies know is much larger, say in sci.crypt and comp.dsp,
and the hostility is no where near what I have seen in this group.

I have the same experience with sci.engr.chem and a few others. In
fact, the climate there is so different that I have no need to post
anonymously. I also have a theory. It is precisely because the
difference between what the resident sages (sic!) and the newbies know
is so much smaller in this group that the hostility is so much
greater.

The truth of the matter is that in this forum, there is no opportunity
to demonstrate aviation skill - that requires an aircraft. There is
an opportunity to demonstrate aviation knowledge - but precious little
of that is required to earn any certificate or rating, be it private,
commercial, instrument, CFI, ATP, or A&P. Of course that's only my
opinion, but at least it's an informed one - since I've earned all of
the above and can compare that to the effort required to earn
corresponding credentials in some of the other groups, of which I
also . There is little comparison. Some have suggested that the ATP
and A&P combined might be considered the Ph.D. of aviation. As
someone who has also earned an actual Ph.D. I consider this
laughable. The associate degree seems more comparable - and that's at
the ATP/A&P level.

That's not to say there is not more to know - there is always more to
know, and it really does make a difference if you really want to get
the most out of your airplane - but the amount of knowledge required
to get the credentials is laughably small, something any bright person
might pick up in his spare time with relatively little effort.

This leads to an interesting disconnect. In this group, it is not
rare for a rank novice - a student pilot or even someone who has never
flown - to know more than the supposed experts. This makes the
'experts' uncomfortable - especially when the novice asks questions,
the experts answer, and then the novice proceeds to point out the
logical inconsistencies and factual errors in their answers and
refuses to accept them just because they have credentials and he does
not. In comp.dsp and sci.engr.chem, just to pick two examples I
happen to be familiar with, that doesn't happen much. The barrier to
entry is too high.

Michael

F. Baum wrote:
On May 11, 7:29 pm, Shirl wrote:

The thing I dont get about this list is how everything turns
argumentitive after about a dozen posts on a thread. I dont get

Totally disagree with that one FB. You are way off base here. Let me
start by saying that not _everything_ turns arg after about a dozen
posts -- if only there was one that did not.

tman inv@lid wrote in :

F. Baum wrote:
On May 11, 7:29 pm, Shirl wrote:

The thing I dont get about this list is how everything turns
argumentitive after about a dozen posts on a thread. I dont get

Totally disagree with that one FB. You are way off base here. Let me
start by saying that not _everything_ turns arg after about a dozen
posts -- if only there was one that did not.


You're just trying to start an argument now.


Bertie

Andrew Sarangan wrote in news:29a0740a-9fc5-43e7-
:

On May 11, 7:16 pm, Shirl wrote:
Andrew Sarangan wrote:
I don't take seriously any posters who use handles instead
of their real names.

That's a little extreme, IMO ... I don't think a person should have to
use their real name to be taken seriously. Some people aren't
comfortable using their real names, and in many instances, with just
cause. I think it's more important how people conduct themselves than
whether or not they use their real names ... but ... to each, his own.

You do have a point because legitimate posts also come from anonymous
posters. But if you browse the topics, nearly all inflammatory posts
come from people whose names are fake, and people with real names have
rarely made such posts, although there are exceptions. Anonymity is
critical in some newsgroups, such as abuse, drugs etc.. In aviation
there might be an occasional need for anonymity, to discuss accidents
or similar things. But for just plain shooting the breeze, as we often
do in this group, I don't see anonymity as a basic requirement.




It is if you **** off as many people as I do!


Bertie

Andrew Sarangan writes:

You do have a point because legitimate posts also come from anonymous
posters. But if you browse the topics, nearly all inflammatory posts
come from people whose names are fake, and people with real names have
rarely made such posts, although there are exceptions.

However, the converse is not true: not all anonymous posters make inflammatory
posts.

Anonymity is an unpleasant necessity in cyberspace today.

But for just plain shooting the breeze, as we often
do in this group, I don't see anonymity as a basic requirement.

No matter what you say, and no matter what your opinion, and no matter how
nicely you say it, there will be someone who doesn't like it, so beware.

On Sun, 11 May 2008 16:16:42 -0700, Shirl
wrote:

Andrew Sarangan wrote:
I don't take seriously any posters who use handles instead
of their real names.

That's a little extreme, IMO ... I don't think a person should have to
use their real name to be taken seriously. Some people aren't
comfortable using their real names, and in many instances, with just
cause. I think it's more important how people conduct themselves than
whether or not they use their real names ... but ... to each, his own.

Whether we choose to consciously or not, it'd be a very rare person to
give the same weight to a post by someone behind a handle instead of a
name. Now if that person has been posting using that handle long
enough to establish an reputation they have become a known quantity.
OTOH Whether we want to or not it's difficult to add much credulence
to the first few posts form some one using a handle and particularly
so if they tend to be either extreme, or combative.

"Long ago" and I mean at least 5 or 6 years, I heard this group
described as a bunch of bitter old men, or pilots with little
tolerance.

I make no claim to always being right and I've received a few crackpot
e-mails and threats over the years using my real name, but I just
throw them in the round file.

Roger (K8RI) ARRL Life Member
N833R (World's oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com