TOW PLANE Accident

Video stills recorded the tug's elevator position.

Where are you able to see the video footage?

BG

See if you can open these files.

https://dms.ntsb.gov/public/62000-62...018/622033.pdf
https://dms.ntsb.gov/public/62000-62...018/622036.pdf
For the full video, make a FOIA request to the NTSB or via the FAA. They've been willing to assist, though there are nominal fees in some cases. In my experience, they won't ask for a justification, though providing one might help.

I'm curious as to how many clubs or tow pilots have really trained and cut a glider loose? It takes a bit of time to react to the situation and if you've never trained or experienced it the time is even greater.
Most tow pilots have talked about it but never experienced it in the heat of the moment.
We pull an unexpected release on our glider students. When do the tug pilots get the same unexpected training?

At one of the clubs I frequent they drop the rope in the grass on landing. So at least the tug pilot is used to reaching for the release and becomes comfortable with its location.

Reaction was not an issue.Â* Surprise!Â* It got quiet.Â* Dump the glider
(no worrying that it was my wife flying - she can do this on her own).Â*
Pick out a field and steer that way.Â* Actually I'd chosen that field
years before.Â* Look inside for what might be the problem.Â* Aha!Â* The
edge of my glove had hooked the mixture control as I came back from
adjusting the prop control (this was a Cessna Skywagon with throttle and
mixture on the left side quadrant and prop on the panel).Â* Add mixture,
recover around 100' AGL, land, and put the gloves in my pockets.Â* That
never happened again!

On 3/11/2019 5:04 PM, wrote:
I'm curious as to how many clubs or tow pilots have really trained and cut a glider loose? It takes a bit of time to react to the situation and if you've never trained or experienced it the time is even greater.
Most tow pilots have talked about it but never experienced it in the heat of the moment.
We pull an unexpected release on our glider students. When do the tug pilots get the same unexpected training?

At one of the clubs I frequent they drop the rope in the grass on landing. So at least the tug pilot is used to reaching for the release and becomes comfortable with its location.

--
Dan, 5J

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 5:27:02 PM UTC-4, Duster wrote:
Video stills recorded the tug's elevator position.

Where are you able to see the video footage?

BG

See if you can open these files.

https://dms.ntsb.gov/public/62000-62...018/622033.pdf
https://dms.ntsb.gov/public/62000-62...018/622036.pdf
For the full video, make a FOIA request to the NTSB or via the FAA. They've been willing to assist, though there are nominal fees in some cases. In my experience, they won't ask for a justification, though providing one might help.

Everything you need is in the video analysis. Good job by the analyst. Experienced tow pilots & glider instructors can figure it out from here.

T8

The NTSB has just issued the Final Report with Probable Cause on this accident:

Probable Cause and Findings
The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident to be:
The tow plane pilot's loss of airplane control for reasons that could not be determined based on
the available evidence. Contributing to the accident was the glider instructor's diversion of
attention away from the tow airplane which resulted in his delay in releasing the tow rope once
the tow plane was no longer visible from the glider cockpit.

Full Report:
https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/Re...Final&IType=FA

On Sunday, March 10, 2019 at 7:01:48 PM UTC-5, Duster wrote:
Though the final report w/any probable cause is scheduled for this Wednesday (3/13), there are a few details that perplex me. Video analysis (segment #2)indicates the spoiler handle starts to move aft at (in seconds?) 5.14s, then is near full aft by 9.21s until 11.13s when it "starts to move forward". Near the end of the epoch, the release handle moves several inches, then dangles, coincident with a snapping sound. The glider PIC reported deploying brakes when he saw the towplane below to the right with slack in the line. He stated,"and the[n] released the towrope." Partial to full brake handle aft for about 6 seconds, most while tug/glider still connected it seems (tho maybe wrong). Witnesses told the PIC they didn't think he pulled the tug's tail up; some of the written docs bear this out. Video stills recorded the tug's elevator position.

Someone died....sucks for the reason......truley......

As to high tow vs. low tow.....I have my preference, but will wait until REAL NUMBERS show a difference.
I will NOT say the US needs to go low tow (again, I am biased....), I will wait on numbers.
I shall say, many peeps I have flown with are improperly trained on low tow......sorta described by posts in this thread.
Yes, as mentioned by some peeps (posted or to me via email/PM), "out of control is out of control....".

I agree with out of control.......

I am out of "keeping a fine eye" on tow, but one comment I had was......."who the F makes a glider (mostly SGS-xx) that climbs on tow?
Frankly....(waiting until we fly in the NE US....)....I will pay for tows in.......
SGS-2-33
SGS-1-26
ASK-21
ASW-2xxx

My thought......is there enough forward trim to maintain EITHER tow position?
Frankly, from what I vaguely remember......a thumb behind the stick on ANYTHING is enough to maintain vertical position.
A "death grip" on the stick blows out many minor sensor inputs to correct tow flying......

I am waiting until our club flies.....I will pay for tows in quite a few ships to see.......I will report back.......

If nothing else, I learn something.......
Maybe everyone will learn something.......

As stated before.....this conversation is a ****ing match, until hard numbers, still a ****ing match...

On Tuesday, March 19, 2019 at 7:54:52 PM UTC-4, Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
Someone died....sucks for the reason......truley......
...
I am out of "keeping a fine eye" on tow, but one comment I had was......."who the F makes a glider (mostly SGS-xx) that climbs on tow?

It may be different for heavier pilots than me, but with me solo in the 2-33, even with the ballast brick (can't fly without it), and of course with the trim full forward, I still need to push the stick forward on tow so hard that I use both hands. That is a situation that can turn tragic in a moment of distraction. Even with another person of my weight in the other seat it still requires a major stick-forward force.

On 3/19/2019 9:31 PM, wrote:

It may be different for heavier pilots than me, but with me solo in the 2-33, even with the ballast brick (can't fly without it), and of course with the trim full forward, I still need to push the stick forward on tow so hard that I use both hands. That is a situation that can turn tragic in a moment of distraction. Even with another person of my weight in the other seat it still requires a major stick-forward force.


Yes, I've noticed the same in 2-33's when flying dual with light
passengers (using ballast as necessary and within CG limits). The tow
hook is low on the fuselage nose, so tow rope tension imparts an upward
force on the glider that must be countered with down elevator. It's
just the nature of the beast, and something that should be well within
the capability of any qualified pilot to handle. If there were anything
unusually dangerous about 2-33's tow characteristics, statistics would
have told us many decades ago, because your average trainer 2-33 does a
LOT of tows compared to other gliders.

Vaughn

---
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I'm curious as to how many clubs or tow pilots have really trained and cut a glider loose?
[You are going to lose a tow rope every time you do that]


Most tow pilots have talked about it but never experienced it in the heat of the moment.
[Thank you, God]

We pull an unexpected release on our glider students. When do the tug pilots get the same unexpected training?
[When you screw up back there. Ain't no instructor in the back seat of a Pawnee]

[ROY]

This is the post from reddit from the son of the pilot. He has actually seen the footage. Interestingly, he mentions health as a possible issue.
mrmrkester • 18d
The fatality in this accident was my father.

I have viewed the GoPro video in question a million times (doesn’t show impact) and to blame the accident solely on that doesn’t really make complete sense.

The towplane goes down by itself before the kiting really takes place. My dad was a pretty healthy guy but I’m more likely to believe in a medical issue before solely blaming the glider instructor. I’m not the NTSB so I won’t do their job, but it just doesn’t all add up.

Our Pawnee had the ability to cut the rope from the towplane end plus my dad makes no radio calls?

I’m a member of a different soaring club near my university and they tried replicating the accident (at altitude) and the tow pilot didn’t report much difficulty in controlling the Pawnee.

I’m a CFI-G myself, but if you ever lose sight of the towplane please release immediately. Had this pilot done this I’m not convinced the result would have been much different, but perhaps would have given my father a better chance of survival.

What we do carries an inherit risk, especially when flying behind a rope of someone else.

Please be safe out there.