Jon Johanson stranded in Antartica....

In article ,
ET wrote:
"Jimmy Galvin" wrote in
:

You can offer all apologies all you want but only for yourself. Don't
talk for me. I feel that he took a chance for glory, self promotion,
stupidity, or whatever and ended up with his tit caught in the
wringer. It is not up to me and my tax dollars to bail his sorry ass
out of the jamb he inflected on himself. This goes for all those fools
that climb mountains, trek through caves, or go exploring in the woods
relying on a GPS with 1/2 dead batteries to guide them along. They
should all just be left to their own devices and hopefully receive a
Darwin Award for their efforts.


Yeah, but to not even sell the guy fuel is bad form......

*WHY* ??

I'd suggest it is far _worse_ form for the PIC *not* to have "made sure of"
the necessary resources =in=advance=/


If a pilot makes an "emergency" (or otherwise) landing in a farmer's field,
is that farmer obligated in any way to sell him fuel from his farm holding
tank, so he can fly the plane back out?

What, if *anything*, is different about the two scenarios?

Presumably, Jon *knew* he was going to need fuel when he got there.

WHY DIDN'T HE MAKE ADVANCE ARRANGEMENTS to ship _his_own_ fuel there?

What 'flight services' were listed as available at that location?
Betcha it's "no services".

(Robert Bonomi) wrote in
ervers.com:

In article ,
ET wrote:
"Jimmy Galvin" wrote in
:

You can offer all apologies all you want but only for yourself.
Don't talk for me. I feel that he took a chance for glory, self
promotion, stupidity, or whatever and ended up with his tit caught
in the wringer. It is not up to me and my tax dollars to bail his
sorry ass out of the jamb he inflected on himself. This goes for all
those fools that climb mountains, trek through caves, or go
exploring in the woods relying on a GPS with 1/2 dead batteries to
guide them along. They should all just be left to their own devices
and hopefully receive a Darwin Award for their efforts.


Yeah, but to not even sell the guy fuel is bad form......

*WHY* ??

I'd suggest it is far _worse_ form for the PIC *not* to have "made
sure of" the necessary resources =in=advance=/


If a pilot makes an "emergency" (or otherwise) landing in a farmer's
field, is that farmer obligated in any way to sell him fuel from his
farm holding tank, so he can fly the plane back out?

What, if *anything*, is different about the two scenarios?

Presumably, Jon *knew* he was going to need fuel when he got there.

WHY DIDN'T HE MAKE ADVANCE ARRANGEMENTS to ship _his_own_ fuel there?

What 'flight services' were listed as available at that location?
Betcha it's "no services".




If that farmer had fuel to sell, yeah! I would. I'm not saying they
have too, I'm just saying they are being first class d$cks by not doing
it.

--
ET


"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams

On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 02:26:37 +0000,
(Robert Bonomi) wrote:

In article ,
ET wrote:
"Jimmy Galvin" wrote in
:

You can offer all apologies all you want but only for yourself. Don't
talk for me. I feel that he took a chance for glory, self promotion,
stupidity, or whatever and ended up with his tit caught in the
wringer. It is not up to me and my tax dollars to bail his sorry ass
out of the jamb he inflected on himself. This goes for all those fools
that climb mountains, trek through caves, or go exploring in the woods
relying on a GPS with 1/2 dead batteries to guide them along. They
should all just be left to their own devices and hopefully receive a
Darwin Award for their efforts.

Yup, what ever happened to compassion and the exploratory spirit.?



Yeah, but to not even sell the guy fuel is bad form......

Right now we could use all the PR we can get and this would have been
a good way to pick up some.

Even back when the RUSSIANS were supposed to be the bad guys they gave
some one else fuel when we refused.

Looks like the NSA could stand a bit of tutoring in the humanistic
side of things.

So far even the state department is after them "as I understand".
but they haven't budged. So to me the whole operation down there is an
embarrassment to us.


*WHY* ??

I'd suggest it is far _worse_ form for the PIC *not* to have "made sure of"
the necessary resources =in=advance=/


If a pilot makes an "emergency" (or otherwise) landing in a farmer's field,
is that farmer obligated in any way to sell him fuel from his farm holding
tank, so he can fly the plane back out?

No, but most will out of something called compassion.
There is a big difference between being obligated and being obstinate.

What, if *anything*, is different about the two scenarios?

Obligation versus compassionate, versus obstinate.

Presumably, Jon *knew* he was going to need fuel when he got there.

WHY DIDN'T HE MAKE ADVANCE ARRANGEMENTS to ship _his_own_ fuel there?

What 'flight services' were listed as available at that location?
Betcha it's "no services".


Doesn't really matter. Had the weather gone as forecast he'd not have
needed any. It's not really a matter of being required, but rather
one of being of help.

There seem to be a lot of unforgiving people who could use a bit of
compassion when some one else screws up.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair?)
www.rogerhalstead.com
Return address modified due to dumb virus checkers

(Robert Bonomi) wrote:

I'd suggest it is far _worse_ form for the PIC *not* to have "made sure of"
the necessary resources =in=advance=/


If a pilot makes an "emergency" (or otherwise) landing in a farmer's field,
is that farmer obligated in any way to sell him fuel from his farm holding
tank, so he can fly the plane back out?

What, if *anything*, is different about the two scenarios?

Presumably, Jon *knew* he was going to need fuel when he got there.

WHY DIDN'T HE MAKE ADVANCE ARRANGEMENTS to ship _his_own_ fuel there?

What 'flight services' were listed as available at that location?
Betcha it's "no services".

My understanding is he wasn't actually planning to go there. There are
probably a number of problems with shipping fuel to places you are not
planning to go, just in case:
- it's expensive to ship it there
- you may have to ship it out again if you don't use it - I'm not sure
whether they would let you leave it there indefinitely

On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 02:26:37 +0000,
(Robert Bonomi) wrote:



Yeah, but to not even sell the guy fuel is bad form......

*WHY* ??

I'd suggest it is far _worse_ form for the PIC *not* to have "made sure of"
the necessary resources =in=advance=/


If a pilot makes an "emergency" (or otherwise) landing in a farmer's field,
is that farmer obligated in any way to sell him fuel from his farm holding
tank, so he can fly the plane back out?

What, if *anything*, is different about the two scenarios?

Presumably, Jon *knew* he was going to need fuel when he got there.

WHY DIDN'T HE MAKE ADVANCE ARRANGEMENTS to ship _his_own_ fuel there?

What 'flight services' were listed as available at that location?
Betcha it's "no services".


Robert
the flight plan as I know of it was for a direct flight, no stops, New
Zealand, South Pole, Argentina

when you go out for a local flight do you have fuel stashed every ten
miles ? or do you plan on returning to an airfield with fuel supplies?

Jon made all the preparations necessary but was caught by headwinds
that were not anything like forecast.

The guy has stainless steel courage and a precise methodical approach
to his flight planning. he is well aware that a ditching anywhere
along the route would see him dead from hypothermia within 15 minutes.
to do what he does takes a rare courage.

**** happens occasionally. lets hope that when it happens to you there
are compasionate humans around to help you.
from experience I can tell you that breaking an aeroplane 1,500 miles
from home can make you the lonliest guy on the planet. you can make a
lot of good friends in times like those. ....or you can be screwed by
arseholes.

I hope you get a chance to meet him. he's a top guy. for his
inspirational courage we made him a life member of the Sport Aircraft
Association of Australia

Stealth Pilot
Australia

What if all of those persons who are sympathetic to Jon Johanson's plight
were to put their money where their mouth is, start a fund, hire a whatever,
send a hero, make us all cry tears of joy, and save Jon. I do not write
this with animosity. Prove to me that there is a legitimate fund in place
and I'll send five bucks. And I've never even heard of the guy before I
started reading these strings.

Forrest


"Robert Bonomi" wrote in message
ervers.com...
In article ,
ET wrote:
"Jimmy Galvin" wrote in
:

You can offer all apologies all you want but only for yourself. Don't
talk for me. I feel that he took a chance for glory, self promotion,
stupidity, or whatever and ended up with his tit caught in the
wringer. It is not up to me and my tax dollars to bail his sorry ass
out of the jamb he inflected on himself. This goes for all those fools
that climb mountains, trek through caves, or go exploring in the woods
relying on a GPS with 1/2 dead batteries to guide them along. They
should all just be left to their own devices and hopefully receive a
Darwin Award for their efforts.


Yeah, but to not even sell the guy fuel is bad form......

*WHY* ??

I'd suggest it is far _worse_ form for the PIC *not* to have "made sure
of"
the necessary resources =in=advance=/


If a pilot makes an "emergency" (or otherwise) landing in a farmer's
field,
is that farmer obligated in any way to sell him fuel from his farm holding
tank, so he can fly the plane back out?

What, if *anything*, is different about the two scenarios?

Presumably, Jon *knew* he was going to need fuel when he got there.

WHY DIDN'T HE MAKE ADVANCE ARRANGEMENTS to ship _his_own_ fuel there?

What 'flight services' were listed as available at that location?
Betcha it's "no services".

Robert Bonomi wrote:
ET wrote:


Yeah, but to not even sell the guy fuel is bad form......


*WHY* ??

I'd suggest it is far _worse_ form for the PIC *not* to have "made sure of"
the necessary resources =in=advance=/


If a pilot makes an "emergency" (or otherwise) landing in a farmer's field,
is that farmer obligated in any way to sell him fuel from his farm holding
tank, so he can fly the plane back out?

If the farmer is smart, he'll sell it to him for ten times what he paid
to get it to his farm/polar ice cap, and then go back and buy a ten
year's supply of gas.

Jimmy Galvin wrote:
You can offer all apologies all you want but only for yourself. Don't talk
for me. I feel that he took a chance for glory, self promotion, stupidity,
or whatever and ended up with his tit caught in the wringer. It is not up to
me and my tax dollars to bail his sorry ass out of the jamb he inflected on
himself.

Hi Jimmy,

This guy's out there pushing the bounds of what Man can do, and doing it
with homebuilt aircraft no less, and you're squawking about gallons of
gas. You sound like those chicken%$# NASA 'crats that told our
astronauts not to talk to Denis Tito on the ISS. What a bunch of
tight%^& jerks. It's said to me that the ultimate obstavle to Jon's
flying over the pole is not headwinds, but $#%holes.

This goes for all those fools that climb mountains, trek through
caves, or go exploring in the woods relying on a GPS with 1/2 dead batteries
to guide them along. They should all just be left to their own devices and
hopefully receive a Darwin Award for their efforts.

You should receive a "One Foot In The Grave" award for leading your life
of quiet desperation.

It's said to me that the ultimate obstavle to Jon's
flying over the pole is not headwinds, but $#%holes.

Chief among them being the one Johanson's head was up when he neglected to
cache fuel along his intended route....

"Jimmy Galvin" wrote:

You can offer all apologies all you want but only for yourself. Don't talk
for me. I feel that he took a chance for glory, self promotion, stupidity,
or whatever and ended up with his tit caught in the wringer. It is not up to
me and my tax dollars to bail his sorry ass out of the jamb he inflected on
himself. This goes for all those fools that climb mountains, trek through
caves, or go exploring in the woods relying on a GPS with 1/2 dead batteries
to guide them along. They should all just be left to their own devices and
hopefully receive a Darwin Award for their efforts.

Many people would say that applied to all pilots of light aircraft,
especially those who build their own. I know a lot of people think I'm
crazy...