What to do about North Korea...?

So if a civil war develops, causes the death of hundreds of thousends
innocent people who have done nothing wrong (particularly not to you),
probably millions loose their home and everything they have (which in
most cases wasn't much to start with), a whole generation of children
has no chance to live a normal childhood but has to grow up in war, hate
and fear etc. etc., *you win*? What a disgusting point of view!

Welcome to geopolitics, Stefan. I didn't say it was a good thing --
but it's the real deal.

Bottom line: Screwing with the U.S. (at least since 1945) has
traditionally been a lose-lose situation. Even Viet Nam, which
supposedly "won" its war with America, lost two generations to war.
Some victory.

Why do you think so few countries are dumb enough to try it?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

I was less than clear: I was referring to rights of people. Not
corporate entities. Not national entities. Human entities.

.... who have the right to form groups...

[...] However, I am also aware that this perspective is simplistic....

Yes, rights intersect and interfere with each other all the time. This
is why no rights are absolute.

Nevertheless, I believe that respect for human rights is a necessary
condition in keeping a democracy from being nothing more than a tyranny
of the majority.

I agree with you. But a belief that X is ncessary does not give us the
right or obligation to impose it. Substitute "respect for human rights"
with "respect and reverence for our Creator and Lord", or even "respect
and reverence for our Creator and Lord, Allah" and you will have a
situation where those who believe do so with even more conviction, and
(if true) even more reason. Yet we object.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 18:28:24 +0200, Thomas Borchert wrote:

Have you totally lost it? Your troops are still there not because they
are needed to maintain peace and freedom, but because forward bases
close to (what used to be) the enemy can't be had any cheaper than in
previously occupied country. Man, you really need a reality check...

and as they where at it it was also a big plus to use it for stealing
inventions and spying on his own allies.

but this is really old news.

#m
--
Did you ever realize how much text fits in eighty columns? If you now consider
that a signature usually consists of up to four lines, this gives you enough
space to spread a tremendous amount of information with your messages. So seize
this opportunity and don't waste your signature with bull**** nobody will read.

On 7 Jul 2006 12:51:39 -0700, Jay Honeck wrote:

They are killing EACH
OTHER now, and I think that's been part of the plan from the start.

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/database/
so _this_ is only collateral damage, eh?

#m
--
Did you ever realize how much text fits in eighty columns? If you now consider
that a signature usually consists of up to four lines, this gives you enough
space to spread a tremendous amount of information with your messages. So seize
this opportunity and don't waste your signature with bull**** nobody will read.

On 7 Jul 2006 19:40:59 -0700, Jay Honeck wrote:

In other words, if a stable democracy develops in Iraq, we win.

what will _you_ (you mean the USA, I suppose) win?

And if
civil war between the two major sects of Islam rages on
indefinitely...we still win.

again: what will _you_ (the USA) win?

#m
--
Did you ever realize how much text fits in eighty columns? If you now consider
that a signature usually consists of up to four lines, this gives you enough
space to spread a tremendous amount of information with your messages. So seize
this opportunity and don't waste your signature with bull**** nobody will read.

In article . com,
"Jay Honeck" wrote:

Bottom line: Screwing with the U.S. (at least since 1945) has
traditionally been a lose-lose situation. Even Viet Nam, which
supposedly "won" its war with America, lost two generations to war.
Some victory.
Why do you think so few countries are dumb enough to try it?

In the words of the great Japanese Admiral Yamamoto, "I fear we have
awakened a great sleeping giant."
Or a truely great American President, Teddy Roosevelt, "Walk softly and
carry a big stick."

In other words, if a stable democracy develops in Iraq, we win.

what will _you_ (you mean the USA, I suppose) win?

And if
civil war between the two major sects of Islam rages on
indefinitely...we still win.

again: what will _you_ (the USA) win?

In scenario #1, we have created a stable and friendly government in a
critical area of the world. In other words, peace has been achieved.

In scenario #2, we have diverted the enemy's attention inward, so that
they are devoting resources to killing each other rather than us. In
other words, peace (from our end) has been achieved.

In either scenario, we have helped to assure a consistent supply of oil
for the world's economy.

From the point of view of the US, neither scenario is optimal, and both
carry grave risks -- that "stable democracy" could elect themselves a
tyrranical radical mullah as president, for example -- but that never
changes. The world is a dangerous place.

And now, back to North Korea: For those who may need more reasons,
this is a pretty good summation of why we need to be worried about
them: http://tinyurl.com/n3nfp
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:
The only way we lose is if both sects unite in an Islamic theocracy.
I
don't think that is going to happen.
--


I suspect that 2,539 (plus 3 more today) American families think we
have already lost.

The only way we lose is if both sects unite in an Islamic theocracy.
I
don't think that is going to happen.

I suspect that 2,539 (plus 3 more today) American families think we
have already lost.

Agreed. But that's the way it is in all wars.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay,

Why do you think so few countries are dumb enough to try it?


Why do YOU think they crash airliners into your biggest buildings?

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)