gun discharge in cockpit.

On Mon, 24 Mar 2008 17:56:49 -0700 (PDT), Dan
wrote:

On Mar 24, 8:35 pm, Roger wrote:

3. ALWAYS keep the gun unloaded until ready to use.

My wife's is always ready to use. That is whey after sticking my

"Ready to use" is meant to be interpreted in context. A concealed
carry handgun is loaded because it may be used at any time. Therefore
it is being "used" as it is being carried.

Whenever you pick up a gun, immediately engage the safety, and, if the

And how pray tell do you do this with a model 12 trap gun or Glock
9mm?

The Glock safety is a trigger safety, period. The is no manual safety,
thus no safety to engage/disengage. So keep your damn finger off the
trigger and thereby avoid disengaging the safety.

Although considered a safety the problem is it's not a true safety in
the sense of preventing an accidental firing. (Unlike the 1911 which
blocks the firing pin) If you drop it and something hits the trigger
from the front it'll fire and don't go sticking it in your belt.:-))


Bottom line -- only point it at things you don't mind killing.

Minding and intending have little to do with each other.
If some one broke into our home in the middle of the night I would
deeply regret the resutls of my intentions.

No kidding. If you haven't worked through the scenarios beforehand,
you'll lose. The preps certainly have no compunction about offing you.



Best plan is to determine the extent of legal use of deadly force in
your jurisdiction and then plan to that contingency.

Self defense is the only option in MI. Protection of property is not.
At night you only need fear for your life. You are still going to have
to explain as does every officer. At least you no longer have to
prove you exhausted all avenues of escape.


Careful what you shoot at , it may shoot back.

Then be fast and accurate.
I'm not faster than a ricochet

Don't try to lecture me on firearms, Roger. I have more ten times more

And where was I doing that?
That is one of the problems with Usenet. We reply in first person and
it sounds like a lecture.

hours on ranges than you have hours in your Deb.

I've only seen one AD on a trap range and I've been around a very long
time. It went off when the action closed on a semi auto. (don't
remember if it was a Remington 1100 or Winchester 1400). Hands were
clear of the trigger guard and barrel down range. Could have been a
high primer... who knows. Scared the guy with the shotgun more than
any one else. There was an AD at the MI State trap shoot one year.
Not sure of the details, but the weather IIRC was light rain, the
guy with the shot gun closed the action and dropped the thing either
when mounting it to his shoulder of closing the action. It went off
when it hit the ground. Unfortunately it landed with the barrel
pointed to the rear. Fortunately it was in the mud and although it
blasted a guy in the back the dirt took up a lot of the power. The
only guns I can think of that would pivot like that when closing would
be a single or double barrel but as I said, I wasn't there.

Now the old Winchester predecessor of the model 12 (don't remember the
model number but it had an open hammer) those were notorious for going
off when closing the action. They also didn't have a disconnector.

Roger (K8RI)
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Mar 26, 7:56*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
"Matt W. Barrow" wrote :



"WingFlaps" wrote in message
news:4e6254b3-c090-4df5-b316-38ba32bf4272

@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...





On Mar 25, 11:36 am, "Matt W. Barrow"
wrote:
On Mar 24, 5:58 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

Dan wrote innews:ebef48ed-3f45-4584-b2c2-
What does Dudley have to do with it?

Nothing. Matt thinks in his tiny mind that anyone who talks to me
is
somehow enabling me. It's because he doesn't understand trolling.

And you certainly do you demented POS.

::
:: Oooh such anger!
:: Can you insult me so eloquently too *-pretty please?

Pootyhead!

Hey, you didn't call me a pootyhead.

That's 'cos he doesn't have warm slippery feelings for you.

Cheers

On Mar 26, 8:01*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
WingFlaps wrote in news:05bdb035-545c-445a-b2ad-
:

On Mar 25, 11:51*am, "JGalban via AviationKB.com" u32749@uwe wrote:
Vaughn Simon wrote:

* Yet again...politics!

* Just for the record, I did not grow up with Dick Cheney :-)

* A couple of guys I know did wind up accidentally shooting their friend
s on
hunting trips. *

Evolution in action?

Technically, that's natural selection.

Right. Wish there was more...

Cheers

On Mar 26, 1:49 am, Roger wrote:

The Glock safety is a trigger safety, period. The is no manual safety,
thus no safety to engage/disengage. So keep your damn finger off the
trigger and thereby avoid disengaging the safety.

Although considered a safety the problem is it's not a true safety in
the sense of preventing an accidental firing. (Unlike the 1911 which
blocks the firing pin) If you drop it and something hits the trigger
from the front it'll fire and don't go sticking it in your belt.:-))

By "true safety" I suppose you mean a separate switch that blocks the
action in some way (There is no safety designed, manufactured, or sold
that "prevents accidental firing" -- or at least that had better be
your attitude while handling firearms).

That's simply defining 'safety" too narrowly. Even the 1911 has a grip
safety.

The Glock trigger safety has been proven in various field tests and in
daily use by the FBI, NYPD, DEA, and about 60% of all Law Enforcement
agencies in the US.

If you think about it, there's no better place for a safety -- the
only time there should be 3-7 lbs of pressure pulling back directly on
that trigger is when you want to fire. An no -- it doesn't go off if
you drop it, it catches on your belt, etc, etc etc. If it does you're
the victim of your own carelessness.

Anyone who carries a firearm in their belt without a holster is asking
for trouble.

Self defense is the only option in MI. Protection of property is not.
At night you only need fear for your life. You are still going to have
to explain as does every officer. At least you no longer have to
prove you exhausted all avenues of escape.

You're confirming my statement that you should "determine the extent
of legal use of deadly force for your jurisdiction..." And that
includes townships. Just because the state law provides some
definition of "self defense" doesn't mean your township or city
doesn't have more restrictive or more loosely defined laws.

Once you've figured out what the rules are, rehearse your actions
mentally and from time to time physically ("Should I turn on a light?
Use a Flashlight? Stand at the top of the stairs?") so that when you
hear something at 3 AM you can act as you planned in your woozy,
startled state.

The worst thing you can do is follow Uncle Ned's advice to shoot the
guy as he runs away and drag him into the house.

In nearly all jurisdictions in the United States, an intruder in your
house at night warrants the use of deadly force. Also nearly universal
is that you can't shoot an old lady who cut you off on the turnpike
(Texas is exempt, I think).

Bottom line -- learn the law before you have to explain your actions
in court. If you own or carry a firearm for self defense, you'd better
be prepared to deal with the consequences.


Careful what you shoot at , it may shoot back.

Then be fast and accurate.

I'm not faster than a ricochet

Ridiculous.

There's not an item in my (and I'm sure your) house that will cause a
direct ricochet of the typical expanding self-defense round -- unless
you have a huge collection of Battleship steel cuttings hanging on
your walls.

And where was I doing that?
That is one of the problems with Usenet. We reply in first person and
it sounds like a lecture.

Please forgive my misinterpretation.


Dan Mc

On Mar 26, 8:32 am, Clark wrote:

As designed the 1911 & 1911A1 do not have firing pin blocks. As far as I know
only the Model 80 Colt 1911 has a firing pin block. There may be/probably are
other pistols based on the 1911 design that have firing pin blocks but do not
count on any 1911 form pistol to have a firing pin block.


I think you're right (though the last time I tore down a 1911 was
1990).

They are fine pistols, I just can't feel the same attachment so many
do (to the point of veneration).

Maybe it's due to so many awful, old, worn issue versions I fired.



Dan Mc

Dan wrote:

Maybe it's due to so many awful, old, worn issue versions I fired.

Dan Mc


That's probably it. Stop by a local gunshop and check out a Kimber. It
is real hard to believe it's the same design.

On Mar 26, 10:09 am, Gig 601XL Builder
wrote:
Dan wrote:
Maybe it's due to so many awful, old, worn issue versions I fired.

Dan Mc

That's probably it. Stop by a local gunshop and check out a Kimber. It
is real hard to believe it's the same design.

Those are very nice -- Springfield Armory, Para Ordnace, even Smith &
Wesson are in the 1911 game.

My personal, totally biased preference is a Sig 229 in 9mm -- lots of
rounds, plenty of punch, cheap practice ammo, flawless feed, solid
feel, perfect machining, compact size --a really, really nice pistol.

The .40 is a decent compromise, but the more I shoot, the more I
realize the 9mm cartridge is probably the best overall compromise
handgun round. Keep in mind -- a handgun is something you use to fight
your way to your long gun.

I don't plan on plinking wild drugged up tribesmen, so a 45 just
doesn't fit my mission profile.

H&Ks are nice, but I don't have much expereince with those.


Dan Mc

I fired it without a recoil pad.

Once.

Never again!

I've never seen or heard of anyone firing this in any other position
than prone, with a bi or tripod and recoil pad.

On Mar 26, 1:13 pm, "Jon Woellhaf" wrote:
I fired it without a recoil pad.

Once.

Never again!

I've never seen or heard of anyone firing this in any other position
than prone, with a bi or tripod and recoil pad.

Can I ask.. what were you thinking??!?!?

Or was there a girl watching?

;-)

Dan wrote:
On Mar 26, 1:13 pm, "Jon Woellhaf" wrote:
I fired it without a recoil pad.

Once.

Never again!

I've never seen or heard of anyone firing this in any other position
than prone, with a bi or tripod and recoil pad.

Can I ask.. what were you thinking??!?!?


No kidding. Are you able to use your arm yet.

The Semi-Auto version isn't near as bad.