2 civilian airliners down south of Moscow

From: "Pete"


Coincidence, or...?
Pete

Coincidence.....or Richard Reid redux?

Here is some mo
Dave


BUCHALKI, Russia (Aug. 25) - A Russian airliner crashed and another apparently
broke up in the air almost simultaneously after they took off from the same
Moscow airport Tuesday night, officials said, raising fears of terrorism and
leaving little hope that any of at least 89 people on board could have
survived.

Authorities said rescuers found wreckage from a Tu-154 jet, which was carrying
at least 46 people, about nine hours after it issued a distress signal and
disappeared from radar screens over the Rostov region, some 600 miles south of
Moscow.

Officials made conflicting statements about whether the signal indicated a
hijacking or an SOS and the claims could not be independently confirmed.

At about the same time the Tu-154 jet disappeared, a Tu-134 airliner carrying
43 people crashed in the Tula region, about 125 miles south of Moscow,
officials said. The Emergency Situations Ministry later said that everybody on
board the Tu-134 was killed.

The planes had left Moscow's Domodedovo airport within 40 minutes of each other
Tuesday night and disappeared from radar screens about 11:00 p.m, officials
said.

President Vladimir Putin ordered an investigation by the nation's main
intelligence agency, the Federal Security Service, and security was tightened
at airports across the country.

Authorities have expressed concern that separatists in war-ravaged Chechnya
could carry out attacks linked to this Sunday's election to replace the
region's pro-Moscow president, who was killed by a bombing in May. Rebels have
been blamed for a series of terror strikes that have claimed hundreds of lives
in Russia in recent years.

Witnesses reported seeing an explosion before the first plane crashed and
suspicions of terrorist involvement were compounded when officials said the
Tu-154 airliner had issued a signal indicating the plane was being seized.

However, the Interfax news agency later quoted an unnamed Russian law
enforcement source as saying the signal was an SOS and no other signals were
sent.

Earlier, Interfax had quoted another source in Russia's ''power structures'' as
saying the signal indicating a seizure or hijacking came at 11:04 p.m., shortly
before the plane disappeared from radar. Emergency and Interior Ministry
sources in southern Russia, speaking on condition of anonymity, also told The
Associated Press a distress signal indicated an attack was activated.

Interfax reported that emergency workers spotted a fire in the Rostov region,
where the Tu-154 went missing. But rainy weather hampered the search efforts
and it took hours before any wreckage was found. A flight data recorder from
the plane was recovered, Emergency Situations Minister Sergei Shoigu said,
according to Interfax.

The regional Emergency Situations Ministry chief Viktor Shkareda told AP the
plane apparently broke up in the air and that wreckage was spread over an area
of some 25-30 miles. Body parts have also been found along with fragments of
the plane, Interfax quoted federal Emergency Situations Ministry as saying. It
said the parts were found near Gluboky, a village north of the regional capital
Rostov-on-Don.

Shkareda said 52 people were aboard the plane, while emergency officials in
Moscow put the number of passengers and crew at 46.

In the Tula region, rescuers found fragments of the Tu-134 jet's tail near the
village of Buchalki. Emergency Situations Ministry spokeswoman Marina Ryklina
said later there were no survivors.

At about the same time that the Tu-134 crashed, the Tu-154 lost contact with
flight controllers, Ryklina said. Interfax, citing Russia's Interstate Aviation
Committee, said 44 passengers and an unknown number of crew were abroad.

The Tu-154 took off from Moscow's Domodedovo airport at 9:35 p.m. Tuesday and
the other plane left 40 minutes later, state-run Rossiya television reported.

The Tu-154 belonged to the Russian airline Sibir, which said that the plane had
been in service since 1982.

Quoting unnamed aviation officials and security experts, Russian news agencies
said authorities were not ruling out terrorism and suspicions were heightened
by the fact that the two planes disappeared around the same time.

ITAR-Tass reported that the authorities believe the Tu-134 fell from an
altitude of 32,800 feet. It said the plane belonged to small regional airline
Volga-Aviaexpress and was being piloted by the company's director, and quoted
dispatchers as saying 34 passengers and seven crew were aboard. Ryklina put the
numbers at 35 and eight - a total of 43.

Interfax quoted a Domodedovo airport spokesman as saying no foreigners were on
the passenger lists for either plane.

Authorities said the Tu-134 was headed to the southern city of Volgograd, where
Volga-Aviaexpress is based, while the plane that crashed in the Rostov region
was flying to the Black Sea resort city of Sochi, where Putin is vacationing.

When Russia's U.N. Ambassador Andrey Denisov was told of the initial report of
two near-simultaneous crashes, he said, ''Now we have to see if there's
terrorism.''

In Washington, a U.S. official, speaking on condition of anonymity Tuesday
evening, said it was the understanding of American officials that the two
Russian planes disappeared within four minutes of each other, which ''in and of
itself is suspicious.''

AP-NY-08-25-04 0209EDT

My local paper this morning said the southernmost plane sent a hijack code
just before it went off radar.

--

B-58 Hustler History: http://members.cox.net/dschmidt1/
-

"Pete" wrote in message
...
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe...ash/index.html

Within 4 minutes of each other. Both took off from Domodedovo

Coincidence, or...?

Pete
-----------------------------------------------
(CNN) -- Two passenger planes have crashed in Russia Tuesday night,
Russian
officials and a news organization said.
A passenger jet carrying 34 passengers and eight crew members in the Tula
region crashed about 160 kilometers (100 miles) south of Moscow, the
ministry reported.

A second plane went down about 160 kilometers (100 miles) from
Rostov-on-Don, in southern Russia, government-run news agency Ria Novosti
reported.

A ministry spokeswoman said she could only confirm that the second plane
had
been lost to radar.

The first plane disappeared from radar at 10:56 p.m. (2:56 p.m. ET), a
ministry spokeswoman said.

The Tupolev-134 had taken off from Moscow's Domodedovo Airport and was en
route to Volgograd, in southern Russia.

The second plane, a Tupolev-154, disappeared at 11 p.m. (3 p.m. ET) after
having taken off from the same airport en route to Sochi in southern
Russia,
Ria Novosti reported.

There was no immediate word how many people were aboard the second plane.

The Tupolev-154 is a standard medium-range airliner on domestic flights in
Russia, according to aviation websites.

In article VP6Xc.135504$sh.122307@fed1read06, Darrell
wrote:

My local paper this morning said the southernmost plane sent a hijack code
just before it went off radar.

A report that has not been discounted by Russian authorities.

-john-

--
================================================== ==================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ==================

John A. Weeks III wrote:

In article VP6Xc.135504$sh.122307@fed1read06, Darrell
wrote:

My local paper this morning said the southernmost plane sent a hijack
code just before it went off radar.

A report that has not been discounted by Russian authorities.

-john-


....which proves, yet again, how little journalists understand: setting the
transponder/IFF to emergency mode is done in a hijacking - or any other
emergency. All it does is to show the plane with a different display on the
radar screen.
--
Mailman


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Mailman wrote:

...which proves, yet again, how little journalists understand: setting the
transponder/IFF to emergency mode is done in a hijacking - or any other
emergency.

Uhhh...no. The ICAO transponder emergency distress code is 7700 while hijacking
is (I think??) 7200. There's also one for NORDO (No Radio) which I think is
7600.


BUFDRVR

"Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips
everyone on Bear Creek"

"BUFDRVR" wrote
Mailman wrote:

...which proves, yet again, how little journalists understand: setting the
transponder/IFF to emergency mode is done in a hijacking - or any other
emergency.

Uhhh...no. The ICAO transponder emergency distress code is 7700 while hijacking
is (I think??) 7200. There's also one for NORDO (No Radio) which I think is
7600.

7500 for hijack. Your other guesses are correct. 77 and 76 came from the old
64 code days. Back when there was only 10 airplanes within a hundred miles of
an airport :-) 00 was the intercept code, and 11 was the interceptor weapons free
code (nuclear). 12 was contact flying below 12kft.

In article ,
(BUFDRVR) wrote:

Mailman wrote:

...which proves, yet again, how little journalists understand: setting
the
transponder/IFF to emergency mode is done in a hijacking - or any other
emergency.

Uhhh...no. The ICAO transponder emergency distress code is 7700 while
hijacking
is (I think??) 7200. There's also one for NORDO (No Radio) which I think
is
7600.

Hijack is 7500. For some reason I haven't fathomed, the FAA ATC
procedure is to contact the aircraft by radio and ask "Sir, please
confirm you are squawking 7500."

Has it occurred that just maybe, here and there, a hijacker just might
not notice the transponder code was changed?

BUFDRVR wrote:

Mailman wrote:

...which proves, yet again, how little journalists understand: setting the
transponder/IFF to emergency mode is done in a hijacking - or any other
emergency.

Uhhh...no. The ICAO transponder emergency distress code is 7700 while
hijacking is (I think??) 7200. There's also one for NORDO (No Radio) which
I think is 7600.

That would show or not, depending on the interrogator. I have no idea what
kind of coverage (and with what equipment) the Russians have. Even the
old(er) IFF on some Western military radars cannot always tell them apart.
--
Mailman


-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----

...which proves, yet again, how little journalists understand: setting the
transponder/IFF to emergency mode is done in a hijacking - or any other
emergency. All it does is to show the plane with a different display on the
radar screen.

Well, that depends if he squawks emergency, or if he squawks the hijack code.
Two different numbers - and I doubt many folks would dial in the wrong one
(although it has happened in the past).

v/r
Gordon
====(A+C====
USN SAR

Its always better to lose -an- engine, not -the- engine.

(Krztalizer) wrote:

...which proves, yet again, how little journalists understand: setting the
transponder/IFF to emergency mode is done in a hijacking - or any other
emergency. All it does is to show the plane with a different display on the
radar screen.

Well, that depends if he squawks emergency, or if he squawks the hijack code.
Two different numbers - and I doubt many folks would dial in the wrong one
(although it has happened in the past).


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...ia_plane_crash

It appears the Sibir airline's people are saying "activated an
emergency signal". The cockpit data recorders' info is detailed
somewhat in the article.