Harrison Ford Mistakenly Lands Husky On KSNA Taxiway

On Thursday, February 16, 2017 at 9:48:48 AM UTC-6, Larry Dighera wrote:
On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 21:03:57 -0500, Vaughn Simon wrote:

On 2/15/2017 12:21 PM, Larry Dighera wrote:
Is it time for venerated pilot Harrison Ford to ground himself for less than
adequate judgment skills to act as Pilot In Command?

The runway is the one with the big "20L" painted on its near-end.

This ignominious incident is worse than Senator Inhoff's landing on a taxiway
because there was a big X on the runway.


Nonsense Larry. Did you bother taking a glance at the airport diagram?

I was based at KSNA for a decade. I'm very familiar with the layout.

Anytime you have parallel runways, with one fat and the other skinny,
this incident will occasionally happen because it's easy to focus on
only the skinny runway while confusing it for the larger parallel
runway. It's a matter of sight fixation (seeing what you expect to see)
Once you've done that, then the even skinnier taxiway becomes the
"skinny" runway in the pilot's head. I know that it happens at PBIA,
and that pilots are specifically warned about it.

I understand your point, but I don't recall anyone ever having landed on that
taxiway. The taxiway is quite narrow, I would estimate about 1/3rd the width
of the narrow 75' wide runway 20L. Take a look here
https://goo.gl/maps/xgXjy2uURJm and you'll see from the surface markings and
layout how difficult it is to mistake taxiway Charlie for runway 20L.


That's not to say that Ford is blameless, only that he made a typical
and well-known pilot screwup. However it's OTT to imply that one
incident means a pilot should be grounded.

Ford has had his share of mishaps. I know that age has taken its toll on my
piloting abilities, and at 74, Ford is likely experiencing a similar decline.

If senility-based erosion of one's faculties (in addition to the possibility of
arrogance in Ford's case) has impaired one's judgment or cognition, it is
irresponsible for any pilot to continue to act as pilot in command. One could
look upon Ford's mishaps as Darwin's gentle nudge. When we find our decisions
causing disruption of the nominal performance of the NAS, it is an unmistakable
sign... The destination denial provides is likely to be the final one IMHO.

Sometimes it's difficult to be objective about the things which we are
passionate. In our determination to be objective, we must factor in that
passion-bias to judgment decisions.

He is working his reign of terror down the SoCal coast. Be on the lookout at Carlsbad's Palomar-McClellan Airport. A stray landing at Camp Pendleton might draw Marine fire

On Sat, 18 Feb 2017 00:22:31 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 19:57:12 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:

snip

Mr. Ford is either losing his cognitive abilities, or he lacks due respect for
the requirements to operate responsibly, or both.

Another possibility; he ****ed up.


That's beyond a possibility. It's a certainty.

Then it is not possible that he is "either losing his cognitive abilities,
or he lacks due respect for the requirements to operate responsibly, or both"?


Oh Plezze. Jim, I know you're smarter than that question would appear to
imply. Or have you just contracted a case of Trumpacity ("Trump Mendacity")?
:-)

It is, in my humble opinion, entirely possible, if not probable, that it was
either fellow airman Ford's possible less than reverent attitude toward
aviation, and the lessons it provides, and/or senescence-based progressive
physical impairment creeping in on its regular course, that precipitated what
you refer to as a Foxtrot Uniform.



The LA Times said Ford may not have been able to see over the nose of the
tail-dragger well enough to see the runway. That's a bogus excuse in my
opinion.


I suppose you have never in your life done anything that in retrospect you
concider stupid due to a momentary lapse in attention, focus or judgment?


When those type of events began to occur while PIC, I judged it was time to
stay out of the left seat. I'm not saying it's easy, but it is something
virtually all pilots must face at some point. You'll see ...

For most people those type of events begin to occur as soon as mommy
and daddy are out of sight.


Acts that I committed as an adult (which I believe is more germane to the
discussion) that I would consider "stupid due to a momentary lapse in
attention, focus or judgment" are generally grounded in a causality based on
stimuli in the physical world, or psychological in origin. A wise person who
is astute and attending to the events occurring in his/her life well enough to
recognize the opportunity for introspection FU's provide, will deliberate
internally on the dynamics involved, and attempt to adjust his future behavior
based on the results of that analysis so that similar errors are not repeated.

Those who choose to ignore facts, and continue to repeat non-beneficial
behavior, may face a sterner lesson...


It is when those type of events start occuring on a regular basis that
there is a problem.


While the FAA/NTSB concluded that probable cause in Ford's Santa Monica country
club "hard landing" was due to mechanical issues causing a cessation of power
(as I recall), I find it remarkable for a departing aircraft from the airport
where it was based to not have spilled a significant amount of fuel on impact.
I found no mention, nor saw no environmental haz-met team on site in the media
accounts of the incident I recall reading/viewing. ...How long ago was that?

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Sat, 18 Feb 2017 00:22:31 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 19:57:12 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:

snip

Mr. Ford is either losing his cognitive abilities, or he lacks due respect for
the requirements to operate responsibly, or both.

Another possibility; he ****ed up.


That's beyond a possibility. It's a certainty.

Then it is not possible that he is "either losing his cognitive abilities,
or he lacks due respect for the requirements to operate responsibly, or both"?


Oh Plezze. Jim, I know you're smarter than that question would appear to
imply. Or have you just contracted a case of Trumpacity ("Trump Mendacity")?
:-)

It is, in my humble opinion, entirely possible, if not probable, that it was
either fellow airman Ford's possible less than reverent attitude toward
aviation, and the lessons it provides, and/or senescence-based progressive
physical impairment creeping in on its regular course, that precipitated what
you refer to as a Foxtrot Uniform.

And couldn't possibly be a temporary distraction or lapse in judgement or
any of many other common tranisitory foibles?

So in your humble opinion he is either evil, demented or both.

The LA Times said Ford may not have been able to see over the nose of the
tail-dragger well enough to see the runway. That's a bogus excuse in my
opinion.


I suppose you have never in your life done anything that in retrospect you
concider stupid due to a momentary lapse in attention, focus or judgment?


When those type of events began to occur while PIC, I judged it was time to
stay out of the left seat. I'm not saying it's easy, but it is something
virtually all pilots must face at some point. You'll see ...

For most people those type of events begin to occur as soon as mommy
and daddy are out of sight.


Acts that I committed as an adult (which I believe is more germane to the
discussion) that I would consider "stupid due to a momentary lapse in
attention, focus or judgment" are generally grounded in a causality based on
stimuli in the physical world, or psychological in origin. A wise person who
is astute and attending to the events occurring in his/her life well enough to
recognize the opportunity for introspection FU's provide, will deliberate
internally on the dynamics involved, and attempt to adjust his future behavior
based on the results of that analysis so that similar errors are not repeated.

Or in other words, like most people, when you do something dumb you learn
from the experience.

Those who choose to ignore facts, and continue to repeat non-beneficial
behavior, may face a sterner lesson...

The key word here being "continue".

So far for the person you are declaring evil, demented, or both we have
one mechanical failure and one lapse of some sort.

It is when those type of events start occuring on a regular basis that
there is a problem.


While the FAA/NTSB concluded that probable cause in Ford's Santa Monica country
club "hard landing" was due to mechanical issues causing a cessation of power
(as I recall), I find it remarkable for a departing aircraft from the airport
where it was based to not have spilled a significant amount of fuel on impact.
I found no mention, nor saw no environmental haz-met team on site in the media
accounts of the incident I recall reading/viewing. ...How long ago was that?

The NTSB concluded that the main metering jet for the carburetor had
come loose, resulting in excessive fuel flow and the ultimate loss of
engine power in Ford's off airport forced landing.

As for spilled fuel, "Fuel was observed leaking from the front of the
airplane, and the responding fire department reported shutting off the
airplane's fuel supply from the cockpit."

https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.a...FA121 &akey=1


--
Jim Pennino

Lots of video of this incident he
https://twitter.com/i/moments/834441236182396929


On Sun, 19 Feb 2017 09:30:33 -0800, Larry Dighera wrote:

On Sat, 18 Feb 2017 00:22:31 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 19:57:12 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:

snip

Mr. Ford is either losing his cognitive abilities, or he lacks due respect for
the requirements to operate responsibly, or both.

Another possibility; he ****ed up.


That's beyond a possibility. It's a certainty.

Then it is not possible that he is "either losing his cognitive abilities,
or he lacks due respect for the requirements to operate responsibly, or both"?


Oh Plezze. Jim, I know you're smarter than that question would appear to
imply. Or have you just contracted a case of Trumpacity ("Trump Mendacity")?
:-)

It is, in my humble opinion, entirely possible, if not probable, that it was
either fellow airman Ford's possible less than reverent attitude toward
aviation, and the lessons it provides, and/or senescence-based progressive
physical impairment creeping in on its regular course, that precipitated what
you refer to as a Foxtrot Uniform.



The LA Times said Ford may not have been able to see over the nose of the
tail-dragger well enough to see the runway. That's a bogus excuse in my
opinion.


I suppose you have never in your life done anything that in retrospect you
concider stupid due to a momentary lapse in attention, focus or judgment?


When those type of events began to occur while PIC, I judged it was time to
stay out of the left seat. I'm not saying it's easy, but it is something
virtually all pilots must face at some point. You'll see ...

For most people those type of events begin to occur as soon as mommy
and daddy are out of sight.


Acts that I committed as an adult (which I believe is more germane to the
discussion) that I would consider "stupid due to a momentary lapse in
attention, focus or judgment" are generally grounded in a causality based on
stimuli in the physical world, or psychological in origin. A wise person who
is astute and attending to the events occurring in his/her life well enough to
recognize the opportunity for introspection FU's provide, will deliberate
internally on the dynamics involved, and attempt to adjust his future behavior
based on the results of that analysis so that similar errors are not repeated.

Those who choose to ignore facts, and continue to repeat non-beneficial
behavior, may face a sterner lesson...


It is when those type of events start occuring on a regular basis that
there is a problem.


While the FAA/NTSB concluded that probable cause in Ford's Santa Monica country
club "hard landing" was due to mechanical issues causing a cessation of power
(as I recall), I find it remarkable for a departing aircraft from the airport
where it was based to not have spilled a significant amount of fuel on impact.
I found no mention, nor saw no environmental haz-met team on site in the media
accounts of the incident I recall reading/viewing. ...How long ago was that?

If the report below is to be believed, it would appear that Ford was a bit
confused and making multiple mistakes during his flight.

The bit about the airliner being in danger flies in the face of normal
procedures at KSNA. Airliners often hold short of 20L on the extreme northern
taxiway while landing traffic descends over them to the threshold. Personally,
I find that procedure a bit ironic given the minimum runway incursion distance
is something like 150' or 300'.

http://people.com/movies/harrison-fo...rsial-landing/
"Harrison Ford is heard making mistakes during radio communication with air
traffic control in the minutes leading up to his close call at a California
airport earlier this week, when he nearly crashed into a passenger plane after
erroneously landing in a taxiway instead of the runway he was cleared to use.

In newly released audio obtained by TMZ, the Star Wars legend is told his tail
number, “Husky Niner Hotel Uniform,” and a personal code of 0214. However, Ford
responds by stumbling over his words, telling the control tower that he was
flying a helicopter rather than his single-engine plane.

The 74-year-old actor is also told his radio transmission was made to the wrong
tower — rather than switching to the Los Angeles tower, he’s still
communicating with the Santa Monica Airport from which he departed.

Just 18 minutes after the transmission, the licensed pilot of many years
accidentally maneuvered toward a taxiway rather than the runway he was cleared
to land on. His plane flew over an American Airlines departing flight with 110
passengers on board and a six-person crew. The Dallas-bound 737 aircraft was
reportedly able to safely take off minutes after the incident."


On Wed, 22 Feb 2017 09:21:23 -0800, Larry Dighera wrote:


Lots of video of this incident he
https://twitter.com/i/moments/834441236182396929


On Sun, 19 Feb 2017 09:30:33 -0800, Larry Dighera wrote:

On Sat, 18 Feb 2017 00:22:31 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 19:57:12 -0000, wrote:

Larry Dighera wrote:

snip

Mr. Ford is either losing his cognitive abilities, or he lacks due respect for
the requirements to operate responsibly, or both.

Another possibility; he ****ed up.


That's beyond a possibility. It's a certainty.

Then it is not possible that he is "either losing his cognitive abilities,
or he lacks due respect for the requirements to operate responsibly, or both"?


Oh Plezze. Jim, I know you're smarter than that question would appear to
imply. Or have you just contracted a case of Trumpacity ("Trump Mendacity")?
:-)

It is, in my humble opinion, entirely possible, if not probable, that it was
either fellow airman Ford's possible less than reverent attitude toward
aviation, and the lessons it provides, and/or senescence-based progressive
physical impairment creeping in on its regular course, that precipitated what
you refer to as a Foxtrot Uniform.



The LA Times said Ford may not have been able to see over the nose of the
tail-dragger well enough to see the runway. That's a bogus excuse in my
opinion.


I suppose you have never in your life done anything that in retrospect you
concider stupid due to a momentary lapse in attention, focus or judgment?


When those type of events began to occur while PIC, I judged it was time to
stay out of the left seat. I'm not saying it's easy, but it is something
virtually all pilots must face at some point. You'll see ...

For most people those type of events begin to occur as soon as mommy
and daddy are out of sight.


Acts that I committed as an adult (which I believe is more germane to the
discussion) that I would consider "stupid due to a momentary lapse in
attention, focus or judgment" are generally grounded in a causality based on
stimuli in the physical world, or psychological in origin. A wise person who
is astute and attending to the events occurring in his/her life well enough to
recognize the opportunity for introspection FU's provide, will deliberate
internally on the dynamics involved, and attempt to adjust his future behavior
based on the results of that analysis so that similar errors are not repeated.

Those who choose to ignore facts, and continue to repeat non-beneficial
behavior, may face a sterner lesson...


It is when those type of events start occuring on a regular basis that
there is a problem.


While the FAA/NTSB concluded that probable cause in Ford's Santa Monica country
club "hard landing" was due to mechanical issues causing a cessation of power
(as I recall), I find it remarkable for a departing aircraft from the airport
where it was based to not have spilled a significant amount of fuel on impact.
I found no mention, nor saw no environmental haz-met team on site in the media
accounts of the incident I recall reading/viewing. ...How long ago was that?

What "extreme northern taxiway" are you talking about? Lima is at the
end of the runway and if a plane is behind the hold short lines, then
no landing plane is going to go over it. If I had as many aircraft as
Ford, I'd probably confuse them all the time too. And he didn't switch
from SMO to LAX on the handoff? Quelle Horreur!


Larry Dighera wrote:
If the report below is to be believed, it would appear that Ford was a bit
confused and making multiple mistakes during his flight.

The bit about the airliner being in danger flies in the face of normal
procedures at KSNA. Airliners often hold short of 20L on the extreme northern
taxiway while landing traffic descends over them to the threshold. Personally,
I find that procedure a bit ironic given the minimum runway incursion distance
is something like 150' or 300'.

http://people.com/movies/harrison-fo...rsial-landing/
"Harrison Ford is heard making mistakes during radio communication with air
traffic control in the minutes leading up to his close call at a California
airport earlier this week, when he nearly crashed into a passenger plane after
erroneously landing in a taxiway instead of the runway he was cleared to use.

In newly released audio obtained by TMZ, the Star Wars legend is told his tail
number, ?Husky Niner Hotel Uniform,? and a personal code of 0214. However, Ford
responds by stumbling over his words, telling the control tower that he was
flying a helicopter rather than his single-engine plane.

The 74-year-old actor is also told his radio transmission was made to the wrong
tower ? rather than switching to the Los Angeles tower, he?s still
communicating with the Santa Monica Airport from which he departed.

Just 18 minutes after the transmission, the licensed pilot of many years
accidentally maneuvered toward a taxiway rather than the runway he was cleared
to land on. His plane flew over an American Airlines departing flight with 110
passengers on board and a six-person crew. The Dallas-bound 737 aircraft was
reportedly able to safely take off minutes after the incident."

--
Don Poitras

Larry Dighera wrote:

If the report below is to be believed, it would appear that Ford was a bit
confused and making multiple mistakes during his flight.

I think I will believe the official report when it is released and not
jump to conclusions based on blather from the aviation ignorant media
and TMZ.


--
Jim Pennino

Don Poitras wrote:
What "extreme northern taxiway" are you talking about? Lima is at the
end of the runway and if a plane is behind the hold short lines, then
no landing plane is going to go over it. If I had as many aircraft as
Ford, I'd probably confuse them all the time too. And he didn't switch
from SMO to LAX on the handoff? Quelle Horreur!

If he was landing at SNA, why would SNA hand him off to LAX?


--
Jim Pennino

wrote:
Don Poitras wrote:
What "extreme northern taxiway" are you talking about? Lima is at the
end of the runway and if a plane is behind the hold short lines, then
no landing plane is going to go over it. If I had as many aircraft as
Ford, I'd probably confuse them all the time too. And he didn't switch
from SMO to LAX on the handoff? Quelle Horreur!

If he was landing at SNA, why would SNA hand him off to LAX?
--
Jim Pennino

He was probably doing "tower enroute". LAX is between SMO and SNA.

--
Don Poitras

Don Poitras wrote:
wrote:
Don Poitras wrote:
What "extreme northern taxiway" are you talking about? Lima is at the
end of the runway and if a plane is behind the hold short lines, then
no landing plane is going to go over it. If I had as many aircraft as
Ford, I'd probably confuse them all the time too. And he didn't switch
from SMO to LAX on the handoff? Quelle Horreur!

If he was landing at SNA, why would SNA hand him off to LAX?
--
Jim Pennino

He was probably doing "tower enroute". LAX is between SMO and SNA.

Point missed; he was in the SNA pattern and LANDING at SNA, why would SNA
hand him off to LAX in the middle of a LANDING at SNA?


--
Jim Pennino