Fun with trailling edge dive brakes

Scott,
As a mosquito pilot, once you're sure you're in the field, use full
brake, maintain 50kts (if it's not too rough or windy, otherwise 55kts) and
leave the brakes fully out. When you flare, the time to do it is just AFTER you
want to, i.e. a couple of feet lower. Aim to touch down main and tailwheels
together. It works for me.

Hope this helps,

Simon.

I'm faster that I want to
be and don't touch as lightly as I'd like

Remember to control your speed by attitude. If you are too fast you are likely
to bounce despite flaps and airbrakes.
The correct speed and a fully held off flare at the correct height should
enable 'greasers' every time.

Scott,

I'm surprised that no PIK 20B or HP pilots have so far joined in the
trailing-edge brakes debate! I've been flying my 20B now for 2 years
(400+ hrs and 178 landings) and have to admit that landing can be a
high work-load time especially in windy conditions. Generally letting
down with 45-60 degree flaps at anything faster than 55 kts results in
a bounce or two - best results occur at around 48 kts in still air.

I've practised trying to 2-point the ship ad nausium but finally
concluded that the higher angle of attack simply increases the risk of
excessive float. Now I settle her onto the main wheel then steadily
wind off the flap to -8 degrees. The transition from neutral to -4
results in the tail-wheel kissing the ground and I then ease the stick
back to nail the tail down and progress to -8 to ensure best aileron
authority for the roll-out, using wheel brake as required.

In gusty conditions I restrict the flap setting to 30-40 degrees and
approach at Vs plus half wind-speed. One strong gust with 60+ flap
can stop you dead, drop you in and spoil your whole day as I found out
the hard way, even with 65 kts on.

Geoff Vincent
VH-GAX


On 26 Sep 2004 17:42:58 -0700, (Scott Elhardt)
wrote:

I've been happily flying my H303 Mosquito for a year now and my
landings seem to be getting worse as time goes on. I have tried a lot
of approaches to the process, but inevitably I'm faster that I want to
be and don't touch as lightly as I'd like especially with a lot of
brake out.

Any trailing edge dive brake experts care to describe your accumulated
perspectives?

Scott

Thanks to all who responded.

There are many great recommendations to think about. Landing this
sailplane for me, has been like my golf game - I manged very well
until I tried to do 'better'!

I will definately devote some fall flying time to some pattern tows
before the long white no-fly season in Minnesota.

Thanks again

Scott

Scott,Take a few pattern tows. You'll be able to remember
any mistakes you made and be able to work on them immediately
instead of forgetting a week later.This worked wonders for my landings in a Laister Nugget
long ago. This was my first experience with a flaps
only ship.
Tom Serkowski
ASH-26E

Early PIK20, HP, SGS-135 and others have flaps only, they are different
than the trailing edge dive brakes on the Mosquito, 304, Hornet, Ventus
.....the trailing edge dive brakes are balanced with opening on top and
bottom, they do not use the same very high angle of nose down as the flaps
only gliders and techniques are somewhat different.. actually easier and
more effective with the trailing edge dive brakes....
tim


"Geoff Vincent" wrote in message
...
Scott,

I'm surprised that no PIK 20B or HP pilots have so far joined in the
trailing-edge brakes debate! I've been flying my 20B now for 2 years
(400+ hrs and 178 landings) and have to admit that landing can be a
high work-load time especially in windy conditions. Generally letting
down with 45-60 degree flaps at anything faster than 55 kts results in
a bounce or two - best results occur at around 48 kts in still air.

I've practised trying to 2-point the ship ad nausium but finally
concluded that the higher angle of attack simply increases the risk of
excessive float. Now I settle her onto the main wheel then steadily
wind off the flap to -8 degrees. The transition from neutral to -4
results in the tail-wheel kissing the ground and I then ease the stick
back to nail the tail down and progress to -8 to ensure best aileron
authority for the roll-out, using wheel brake as required.

In gusty conditions I restrict the flap setting to 30-40 degrees and
approach at Vs plus half wind-speed. One strong gust with 60+ flap
can stop you dead, drop you in and spoil your whole day as I found out
the hard way, even with 65 kts on.

Geoff Vincent
VH-GAX


On 26 Sep 2004 17:42:58 -0700, (Scott Elhardt)
wrote:

I've been happily flying my H303 Mosquito for a year now and my
landings seem to be getting worse as time goes on. I have tried a lot
of approaches to the process, but inevitably I'm faster that I want to
be and don't touch as lightly as I'd like especially with a lot of
brake out.

Any trailing edge dive brake experts care to describe your accumulated
perspectives?

Scott

Hi Tim,

I'm considering purchasing a Mosquito listed on W&W current day 5/8/2014. Kevin Wayt and Rick Walters warn against trailing edge brakes after Rick's accident dropping his Ventus B in while on short final in heavy shear at Minden. I'd like to speak with you by phone to be talked through how to avoid possible problems and become comfortable before I commit to purchase a Mosquito. You can reach me at .

Thanks.

Jon T.

Originally Posted by Tim Mara

just use partial dive brakes (still far more effective than most spoilered
ships) until you're down close to the flare....then drag everything
out..it's like having a drag chute.the glider will slow and touch down
effortlessly...
you can pretty much then use the dive brakes to get you slowed down and
hardly need a wheel brake
once you get use to doing this you'll never be happy with anything less!
tim

"Scott Elhardt" wrote in message
om...
I've been happily flying my H303 Mosquito for a year now and my
landings seem to be getting worse as time goes on. I have tried a lot
of approaches to the process, but inevitably I'm faster that I want to
be and don't touch as lightly as I'd like especially with a lot of
brake out.

Any trailing edge dive brake experts care to describe your accumulated
perspectives?

Scott