What would you pay?

Kobra wrote:
Hangar tenents,

Hypothetical situation: You're in a hangar. There are no more hangars for
100 miles. There is a waiting list for a hangar just as long. There are
plenty of tie-downs for a poultry 70.00 per month. Just out of curiosity
... what would be the magic price of hangar rent that would make you say,
"THAT'S IT!! I'M OUTTA HERE!! YOU CAN HAVE THE HANGAR...GIVE ME A FRICKIN'
TIE-DOWN."

$70 gets you a t-hanger at 4R7 ($50 a decade ago), $60 gets you one at
3R7...

None are available at either... Tiedowns used to be free at 4R7, now
they want to charge, but I don't remember what... 3R7 is planning on
building more t-hangers, 4R7 is exploring a grant ($300k for 10
t-hangers on last guesstimate)...

Darrel Toepfer wrote:

$70 gets you a t-hanger at 4R7 ($50 a decade ago), $60 gets you one at
3R7...

None are available at either... Tiedowns used to be free at 4R7, now
they want to charge, but I don't remember what... 3R7 is planning on
building more t-hangers, 4R7 is exploring a grant ($300k for 10
t-hangers on last guesstimate)...

If building ten hangars costs $300k, the rents on the existing ones are
ridiculously low.

George Patterson
Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
your slightly older self.

George Patterson wrote:
Darrel Toepfer wrote:

$70 gets you a t-hanger at 4R7 ($50 a decade ago), $60 gets you one at
3R7...

None are available at either... Tiedowns used to be free at 4R7, now
they want to charge, but I don't remember what... 3R7 is planning on
building more t-hangers, 4R7 is exploring a grant ($300k for 10
t-hangers on last guesstimate)...

If building ten hangars costs $300k, the rents on the existing ones are
ridiculously low.

New ones require sprinkler systems, old ones don't... They'll probably
tear the old ones down at some point to force a move to higher prices...

Kobra wrote:

Hypothetical situation: You're in a hangar. There are no more hangars for
100 miles. There is a waiting list for a hangar just as long. There are
plenty of tie-downs for a poultry 70.00 per month. Just out of curiosity
... what would be the magic price of hangar rent that would make you say,
"THAT'S IT!! I'M OUTTA HERE!! YOU CAN HAVE THE HANGAR...GIVE ME A FRICKIN'
TIE-DOWN."

Disregarding the idea that the hangar protects the aircraft from the
elements (hail and prolonged sunshine being two), how about this (assuming
you live in an area prone to snow, ice, and/or frost)?

What is your time worth? In my case, I use my aircraft to commute weekly.
The yet-another-preflight task I would prefer to avoid is the time
consuming task of removing snow, ice, or frost from an aircraft that had
been tied down.

I supposed that, if a tie-down were my only choice, I would invest in some
type of cover for the aircraft, but then I have read that these can scratch
windows and paint.

--
Peter

Kobra wrote:
Hangar tenents,

Hypothetical situation: You're in a hangar. There are no more hangars for
100 miles. There is a waiting list for a hangar just as long. There are
plenty of tie-downs for a poultry 70.00 per month. Just out of curiosity
... what would be the magic price of hangar rent that would make you say,
"THAT'S IT!! I'M OUTTA HERE!! YOU CAN HAVE THE HANGAR...GIVE ME A FRICKIN'
TIE-DOWN."

Kobra



data point: 06C, Schaumburg (IL). 8 miles west of O'Hare, 1.7NM west of
my house.

Our tie-downs are $80/mo. The "old" hangars (which are unavailable) are
$250/mo. If you want to get on the waiting list for the "new" T-hangars,
they are $400/mo. By the way, you need to let them hold $800 of your
money for a "security deposit". Oh yeah, if you want heat, you put in a
gas furnace and get it hooked up to the meter (and you pay for the gas).

Seems we have plenty of potential customers for hangars because they
have started building a bunch more.

Surrounding airports are similarly priced. If you want to drive 100
miles you can get both tie-downs and hangars for about half.

Outrageous? Well, the city sunk something like $50M into the airport for
purchase and improvements. If they did not come along and do it, there
would be rows of nice pretty townhouses there by now. So, they build
expensive hangars that we seem to have an endless supply of willing
buyers to help defray the monthly nut.

I have a convenient airport, those who will pay have first class
hangars. I could "afford" the hangar. But, for nearly $5k a year, I
would rather put up with the outside and paint the beast every 7 years
instead of 12 (if it were inside).

Mike

: I have a convenient airport, those who will pay have first class
: hangars. I could "afford" the hangar. But, for nearly $5k a year, I
: would rather put up with the outside and paint the beast every 7 years
: instead of 12 (if it were inside).

From the standpoint of the paint, it is generally financially better to let it
sit outside than to pay hangar rent. Of course other weather things (potential hail
damage, ice/snow removal), the convenience of indoor work, etc may be worth a lot to
some. For me, hangars are unavailable, and being outside isn't that big of a deal. A
$100 cover keeps the sun off the avionics and upholstery.

Of course on the few days during the winter when snow/ice is on it (like
today), I feel temporarily a bit different....

-Cory

--

************************************************** ***********************
* Cory Papenfuss *
* Electrical Engineering candidate Ph.D. graduate student *
* Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University *
************************************************** ***********************

From the standpoint of the paint, it is generally financially better to
let it
sit outside than to pay hangar rent. Of course other weather things
(potential hail
damage, ice/snow removal), the convenience of indoor work, etc may be
worth a lot to
some. For me, hangars are unavailable, and being outside isn't that big
of a deal. A
$100 cover keeps the sun off the avionics and upholstery.

Don't forget all the "intangibles" that come with having a hangar. Being
in a row of T-hangars is like docking your boat on a lake. Your neighbors
are instantly your friends, and everyone has an equal footing from which to
start, whether you're a bank president or a lowly innkeeper.

Grilling out at the hangar usually means an instant gathering, as the
airport bums are drawn to the smell of burgers and free beer. We've solved
all the world's problems in our hangar, and strategized many a business
decision in Atlas' shadow.

A place to keep your "stuff" is worth a lot, too. Riding lawn mowers fit
under the wings, motorcycles fit in the back, and our Mustang fits nicely
where the kitchen usually "lives" in summer. (We just take down the kitchen
table, and drive the car in...)

Having a living "diary" is worth something, too. We've got 8.5 x 11 inch
photos of every place we've flown, and every person we've flown with, on the
walls of our hangar. (I covered the walls with 1" styrofoam/fiberglass
insulation board, to which we staple all the photos.) It's collectively
called our "Wall of Shame", and it's absolutely priceless to us, as we can
look back and see how the kids have grown, and reminisce about great flights
and wonderful people who are no longer with us... The walls really can
"speak", and they are great conversation starters.

There is SO much more to a hangar than just an "airplane garage."

Some people have a lovely cottage on a lake -- we have a tin shack on a
strip of asphalt. But I know where I'd rather hang out!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Don't forget all the "intangibles" that come with having a hangar.
.snipped lots of advantages

Yep. I fully agree. I curse every time I have to do some "simple"
operation like airing up the tires outside on a 12 degree windy day
(like today).

But $5 grand a year?

That buys a LOT of maintenance and upgrades.

As far as the companionship, our hangars are somewhat isolated so you
would rarely even see another soul.

With the house being under 2 miles away, I can pretty much run back home
for whatever I need. Folks further out say this can be a real pain when
you try to do some PM, forget this or that tool, and have to make a 1
hour plus round trip to get it.

Anyway, my personal "break even" point is about %250. Like I said, we
have "old" hangars for that price, but you cannot get one. The lease
allows subletting so when an owner sells their plane, they usually
"sell" the hangar with it.

Mike

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:JOCmf.636366$xm3.487896@attbi_s21...
From the standpoint of the paint, it is generally financially better to
let it
sit outside than to pay hangar rent. Of course other weather things
(potential hail
damage, ice/snow removal), the convenience of indoor work, etc may be
worth a lot to
some. For me, hangars are unavailable, and being outside isn't that big
of a deal. A
$100 cover keeps the sun off the avionics and upholstery.

Don't forget all the "intangibles" that come with having a hangar. Being
in a row of T-hangars is like docking your boat on a lake. Your neighbors
are instantly your friends, and everyone has an equal footing from which
to start, whether you're a bank president or a lowly innkeeper.


Good points!

I pay $235 a month for a 44foot T-Hanger with electricity (I pay the
electric bill) which works fine with a Reiff pre-heater. I could add an
electric space heater, but is it worth it? The Reiff makes the engine
compartment so warm that much heat transfers to the cabin via the cover.
Only occasionally do we get below 0F.

In the 6000 foot elevation here, it does wonders to protect the paint and
internals. During the winters, it's a major benefit. We don't get all that
much snow down in the valley (as opposed to the hills around us), but when
we do it blows a lot and can get into all sorts of nook and crannies as it's
the light fluffy powder.

As for "friends", those of us on the same row as my hanger all share (cost
us a one time $50) to use a riding lawn mower that has a special hitch to
tow/push the aircraft. That's been a blessing more times than I can
remember.


Matt
---------------------
Matthew W. Barrow
Site-Fill Homes, LLC.
Montrose, CO

Jay Honeck wrote:

Some people have a lovely cottage on a lake -- we have a tin shack on a
strip of asphalt. But I know where I'd rather hang out!

Yeah, but you pay next to nothing for it (you recently posted a figure of
something like $1,200/year?). Around here, you're looking at upwards of $5,000.

George Patterson
Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
your slightly older self.